The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 I said that the Boobie play did not impact the game, however I believe these dumb penalties (e.g. smack talking) are a sign of lax discipline that permeates the team and affects performance. Which players are holding eachother accountable? Everyone wants to talk about Bellichick. You think Tom Terrific might have some sway in that locker room? How about Pittsburgh, ever hear those guys talk about what James Harrison meant to those teams? You hear what guys say about Earl Thomas out in Seattle? What kind of message does it send when $100Million Mario loafs? Everyone wants to pin leadership exclusively on coaches. Even if you pin the MAJORITY of it on coaches, you mean to deny the utter VACCUM of leadership this team has at the player level? The shifting sands of suckage. A minute ago you were blaming Mario. I've shifted nothing. Not in this thread, nor in the nine years of threads I've been saying the same !@#$ing thing since Dick Jauron was here. The taunting/personal foul that would of backed them up further on the punt- instead it resulted in off setting. That lets the Eagles change play calling to their advantage. I believe 3 neutral zone infractions that put the eagles from 3rd and long to third and short. The false starts. Oh, and dont forget pigpen going in motion and running forward like arena freakin football! Those things have a huge impact on the outcome of the game. That is why coaches preach until they are blue in the face about not doing those things. If we would clean up our mess the score could of easily been 30-17 in favor of us. You're not following.
4merper4mer Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 (edited) I've shifted nothing. Not in this thread, nor in the nine years of threads I've been saying the same !@#$ing thing since Dick Jauron was here. You're not following. Then help me. Since we know Rex is perfect having taken last year's #4 defense and maintained a top 25 ranking with it, who is it that you are blaming? Reddick and Tarpley or Mario? Edited December 14, 2015 by 4merper4mer
PromoTheRobot Posted December 14, 2015 Author Posted December 14, 2015 Which players are holding eachother accountable? Everyone wants to talk about Bellichick. You think Tom Terrific might have some sway in that locker room? How about Pittsburgh, ever hear those guys talk about what James Harrison meant to those teams? You hear what guys say about Earl Thomas out in Seattle? What kind of message does it send when $100Million Mario loafs? Everyone wants to pin leadership exclusively on coaches. Even if you pin the MAJORITY of it on coaches, you mean to deny the utter VACCUM of leadership this team has at the player level? I've shifted nothing. Not in this thread, nor in the nine years of threads I've been saying the same !@#$ing thing since Dick Jauron was here. Unless you are in the locker room you have no idea what kind of leadership exists. And my beef isn't about players, it's about the guy at the top who ignores team discipline because he wants to be loved.
BuffaninATL Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 The pick that set up the go ahead FG was inconceivable. The fact that the ref standing 18 inches from Sammy on his long TD called him out of bounds is simply inexcusable. It was conceivable. It is part of designed plays. Teams are doing it left and right b/c they know it won't be called consistently. Even Wllcots called it for what it was....OPI Inconceivable? NO Unacceptable? YES
The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Super! I played Hockey, Football, Baseball, Basketball, and wrestling along with ski club. I was too small for college football and went on to have a great career in the Marines. Back to my original point my friend- when we did boneheaded things in football our coach sat us, ran us, dug us into the ground. It made you be more disciplined come game day. It is just my opinion that Rex runs too loose of a ship to get at least average discipline. Again, its really just my opinion in the grand scheme of things. Your entitled to yours as I am mine. Were your teams successful? I started on a state championship team. That year our coach one Pennsylvania coach of the year. His philosophy that year was to let the players who had been together for three years take the reigns and lead themselves. And we did. So I ask again: were your teams successful? Did you have players that were leaders? Or were you completely at the mercy of whatever mood your coach was in on any given day? Did you have playmakers? Did big players make big plays? Or did the coaches micromanage you to success? Did you commit infractions? Were you able to recover from them by making plays? Or did you coach just keep benching players who did bonehead things? They never had a chance to redeem themselves? Unless you are in the locker room you have no idea what kind of leadership exists. And my beef isn't about players, it's about the guy at the top who ignores team discipline because he wants to be loved. Well that completely obliterates your own original point. And the one that follows!
BuffaninATL Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 We didn't lose yesterday because of penalties. Yep. He's a personell liability. Has nothign to do with scheme. The scheme could have him set up four yards in the backfield and he still couldn't find the quarterback. Alrighty then ..... that's not what I suggested anyways. You made the claim that it is the players who commit the penalties, not the coaches, and there was nothing Rex can do to address the problem.
4merper4mer Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Were your teams successful? I started on a state championship team. That year our coach one Pennsylvania coach of the year. His philosophy that year was to let the players who had been together for three years take the reigns and lead themselves. And we did. So I ask again: were your teams successful? Did you have players that were leaders? Or were you completely at the mercy of whatever mood your coach was in on any given day? Did you have playmakers? Did big players make big plays? Or did the coaches micromanage you to success? Did you commit infractions? Were you able to recover from them by making plays? Or did you coach just keep benching players who did bonehead things? They never had a chance to redeem themselves? Seriously? Have you considered the coach of your high school ping png team let the players lead because he only spoke Japanese and realized you wouldn't understand him anyway?
The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Then help me. Since we know Rex is perfect having taken last year's #4 defense and maintained a top 25 ranking with it, who is it that you are blaming? Reddick and Tarpley or Mario? May be I don't view fandom as being driven by the necessity to blame someone.
fridge Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Which players are holding eachother accountable? Everyone wants to talk about Bellichick. You think Tom Terrific might have some sway in that locker room? How about Pittsburgh, ever hear those guys talk about what James Harrison meant to those teams? You hear what guys say about Earl Thomas out in Seattle? What kind of message does it send when $100Million Mario loafs? Everyone wants to pin leadership exclusively on coaches. Even if you pin the MAJORITY of it on coaches, you mean to deny the utter VACCUM of leadership this team has at the player level? I've shifted nothing. Not in this thread, nor in the nine years of threads I've been saying the same !@#$ing thing since Dick Jauron was here. You're not following. I do not understand the criticism of a player based on the money that you personally do not pay them. Mario Williams and Jerry Hughes each have 4 sacks. Last night Khalil Mack had 5. I guess I can blame the players, but you can't deny there's an issue with scheme. I understand what you're saying, and there's nothing I hate more than when players give up or are lazy. But to isolate Mario and Hughes and Dareus, and to disregard their performances in the previous seasons is foolish. They were fantastic. Mario had a huge contract last year and performed admirably. Something changed (the defensive scheme) and it's up to the coaches and no one else to get the best play out of them. All three of those players have not been utilized to their fullest potential.
cantankerous Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 This "tone" logic is inconceivable. It truly is. PLAYERS MAKE PLAYS Still waiting to hear someone tell me about the time (other than Hughes' strip sack against the woeful Dolphins) somebody from this "super talented" defense went ahead and changed the game this year. Rambo week 10 @ NYJ (forced fumble on KO, recovered a fumble, made game sealing INT) I think it's inconceivable that you think coaching doesn't have anything to do with how this team performs. Coaches get the team prepared to play, instill discipline, and hold players accountable...none of which happened yesterday.
The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 I do not understand the criticism of a player based on the money that you personally do not pay them. Mario Williams and Jerry Hughes each have 4 sacks. Last night Khalil Mack had 5. I guess I can blame the players, but you can't deny there's an issue with scheme. I understand what you're saying, and there's nothing I hate more than when players give up or are lazy. But to isolate Mario and Hughes and Dareus, and to disregard their performances in the previous seasons is foolish. They were fantastic. Mario had a huge contract last year and performed admirably. Something changed (the defensive scheme) and it's up to the coaches and no one else to get the best play out of them. All three of those players have not been utilized to their fullest potential. Based on everything I've heard from former players on NFLN, etc., how much money you make is very well known in the locker room and very much shapes your team mate's perception of you. I could care less. The point was that his team mates know and his team mates see the same effort we do. Rambo week 10 @ NYJ (forced fumble on KO, recovered a fumble, made game sealing INT) I think it's inconceivable that you think coaching doesn't have anything to do with how this team performs. Coaches get the team prepared to play, instill discipline, and hold players accountable...none of which happened yesterday. I didn't mean to imply it has NOTHING to do with it. The message that comes up on this board time and time again, however,r is that it has EVERYTHIGN to do with it. And that's flat wrong.
Augie Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Boobie is a follower.... he was just trying to fit in. Well coached teams do not perform this way. Period. This is a waste of talent.
The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Also, about the defense being the same: http://twitter.com/ChrisTrapasso/status/676445403626115073 @ChrisTrapasso Perspective: In 2014: #Bills D starters missed total of 13 games due to injury. In 2015 thru Week 14: #Bills D starters have missed 29 games
fridge Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Based on everything I've heard from former players on NFLN, etc., how much money you make is very well known in the locker room and very much shapes your team mate's perception of you. I could care less. The point was that his team mates know and his team mates see the same effort we do. I didn't mean to imply it has NOTHING to do with it. The message that comes up on this board time and time again, however,r is that it has EVERYTHIGN to do with it. And that's flat wrong. I agree that it probably lies somewhere in the middle. You're sort of mad at the player, and I'm disappointed with the coaching staff. Regardless it didn't get done, and the ultimate accountability will likely be that Mario is axed and I think it's a shame. I think we could use that kind of talent, and we've seen previous coaches get that talent out of him. If Mario quit on the team/coaches, etc. I don't think money has anything to do with it, so NFLN and players in the lockerroom that are worried about his salary are unjustified.
The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 I agree that it probably lies somewhere in the middle. You're sort of mad at the player, and I'm disappointed with the coaching staff. Regardless it didn't get done, and the ultimate accountability will likely be that Mario is axed and I think it's a shame. I think we could use that kind of talent, and we've seen previous coaches get that talent out of him. If Mario quit on the team/coaches, etc. I don't think money has anything to do with it, so NFLN and players in the lockerroom that are worried about his salary are unjustified. Whether or not they're right doesn't take away from how they feel about things. Ross Tucker said of his time in the NFL: there are two things that matter in an NFL locker room: how much money you make and how violent you're willing to be.
4merper4mer Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 May be I don't view fandom as being driven by the necessity to blame someone. Mario will be glad to hear that. He was confused by all the things you had typed. Not quite as confused as he was when he lined up at corner, but still.
The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 (edited) Mario will be glad to hear that. He was confused by all the things you had typed. Not quite as confused as he was when he lined up at corner, but still. It's sort of weird watching you dance around the same point I've been making for nine years and only to find bizarre things to pick at rather than offer any kind of counter point, whatsoever. Edited December 14, 2015 by The Big Cat
BuffaloBillsMagic1 Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 can someone please !@#$ing explain precisely what a coach is supposed to do? these men have been playing football for decades. the rules didn't suddenly change when they entered the pros. yes, they took 15 !@#$ing penalties yesterday. And yet, a fluke play on a second and 26 (that nobody is talking about enough) and a blatant pick to set up the go-ahead FG was the difference 15 penalties and the game was there to be won. stop blaming coaches. players make plays. punt returners fumble. and defensive players do things to change games. riddle me this: when was the last time a defender changed the game in a positive way for the bills? coaching? !@#$ no. there is no leadership among the players. stop. blaming. the coaches. If a player or players keep doing stupid things..sit them.....then they will respond. To keep letting this crap happen is setting a bad example that there is no accountability for stupidity..the rex way. You dont see Belicheat's teams doing this nonsense , do you?
fridge Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 Whether or not they're right doesn't take away from how they feel about things. Ross Tucker said of his time in the NFL: there are two things that matter in an NFL locker room: how much money you make and how violent you're willing to be. As poetic as that sounds, I think it doesn't matter on the playing field. You need to maximize your potential the talent of your players. Often you hear them say that Schwartz just rushed the 4 and they got there, but we had the same team and Wannstadt just rushed 4 and they didn't get there. It obviously has to do with coaching and how the scheme attacks the QB. Sometimes Rex drops Mario into coverage, but other times his blitzes are designed to spring up holes for safeties or corners. It's a different philosophy, and it doesn't maximize your most talented player. If Mario sulks and gets upset by this role, then FINE he's not as great of a team player as you would have liked, but it doesn't mean you keep plugging away. A good coach maximizes his talents and can be adaptive.
The Big Cat Posted December 14, 2015 Posted December 14, 2015 If a player or players keep doing stupid things..sit them.....then they will respond. To keep letting this crap happen is setting a bad example that there is no accountability for stupidity..the rex way. You dont see Belicheat's teams doing this nonsense , do you? So we're back to making the GOAT HC with the GOAT QB the standard for coaching and success in the NFL? Which players--other than Hughes--have been repeat offenders the entire season? I'll hang up and take my answer off air.
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