TPS Posted December 1, 2015 Author Posted December 1, 2015 Schwartz's D units always needed stars to excel, and that's why they dropped when Detroit lost some key players in '13. . hmmm....seems to me that a lot of ryan supporters give him a pass on his Jets D after he lost His star CBs. How is that different? Doesn't he also need "stars to excel"?
GG Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 hmmm....seems to me that a lot of ryan supporters give him a pass on his Jets D after he lost His star CBs. How is that different? Doesn't he also need "stars to excel"? Not too much of a pass, but even after losing his CBs, Ryan's defenses never fell down to the levels that Schwartz's defenses dropped. If Ryan had this year's Jets O or even Bills O, they would have been a playoff team in '14.
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 Guy had his team carry him off the field in a meaningless game... try and spin that in a way that makes him not seem like a total douche.
BuffaloBillsForever Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 (edited) I think the differences is due to declining players especially on the defensive line and a lack of depth rather than the coaching differences between Ryan and Schwartz. Edited December 1, 2015 by BuffaloBillsForever
dave mcbride Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 The Bills have 7 sacks in the last 6 games, and one of those sacks (the phantom one by Tarpley on Sunday) wasn't even really a sack - Smith probably thought he was running out of bounds for a yard or so and figured it was more productive to do so than throw it away. He ended up back at the LOS.
Livinginthepast Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 The stats dont lie. The Bills D has gone way backwards and Rex is certainly responsible. Its very similar to the hatchet job that Greg Williams did when he came in here. He took over Wade's vaunted D and employed a new scheme which immediately resulted in disaster. They should have kept Schwartz as a D coach and hired a coach that would improve on last year's Offense. Once they hired Rex, there was never a chance that he would have retained Schwartz or even that Schwartz would have stayed. The big problem is that Rex's D schemes don't work with our current personal. In fact based on all the press reports the stars on our D are not buying in at all and are looking like they might revolt. Rex is starting to look like a really bad hire.
YoloinOhio Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 (edited) I believe in Schwartz too, and we should have made him head coach regardless of what happened in Detroit. That's the coaches graveyard. He'd have done very well here. he had a #1 pick at QB, a #2 pick at WR, and a #2 pick at DT and made the playoffs once in 6 years, and was one of the most undisciplined teams in history. And that's not his fault? He would do much better with no QB ...because it's Buffalo? :/ Edited December 1, 2015 by YoloinOhio
dpberr Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 Schwartz's defense played to the strength of the talent on hand, whether by design or good fortune. Ryan's defense ignores that consideration completely. Anyone who drops freaking MARCEL DAREUS into coverage should be fired ten seconds after that play.
H2o Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 Who's to say Schwartz would want to come back after being passed over for Ryan?
Mr. WEO Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 That is just a ridiculous comparison. If you look at the statistics, historically Rex's teams were much superior to Schwartz's. Ironically, this is the worst defensive unit that Ryan has overseen in his career. Schwartz's D units always needed stars to excel, and that's why they dropped when Detroit lost some key players in '13. Bills D would very likely had been better this year with Schwartz in charge. It's a different question if the defense would be better in '16 and '17 which is what Pegulas care a lot more about. Detroit went 4-12 in 2012.... he had a #1 pick at QB, a #2 pick at WR, and a #2 pick at DT and made the playoffs once in 6 years, and was one of the most undisciplined teams in history. And that's not his fault? He would do much better with no QB ...because it's Buffalo? :/ I would take Schwartz back as DC, but I don't see how anyone thinks he steps into what's going on in Buffalo and does any better than he did in Detroit.
GG Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 Detroit went 4-12 in 2012.... I was referring to defensive rankings, not the team record.
Augie Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 Schwartz's defense played to the strength of the talent on hand, whether by design or good fortune. Ryan's defense ignores that consideration completely. Anyone who drops freaking MARCEL DAREUS into coverage should be fired ten seconds after that play. And the 10 seconds is only to be sure of what you just saw, because.... who would do that? Rex wants to trick people and win with his "scheme", but we're talented enough to just beat people! But he'll keep banging on those round pegs until they go into those square holes. Take a breath, look around, and do it the smart way! (Yeah, I'm a bit angry at this point.)
Billsguy Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 (edited) The better defensive scheme and head coaching abilities lies with the coach that has the better qb on the offense. Until we land a franchise qb we will be going through coaches The Bills had no QB last year and the defense was much much better. Your argument doesn't hold water. The coaching of the defense last year was superior to this year. Period. Rex Ryan and his idiot twin brother have made a reputation as defensive specialists that is largely fiction. Jim Schwartz was a much better defensive coordinator than the current regime. The Pegulas erred big time hiring Rex Ryan. You would think Ryan was a rookie head coach with all the tactical and strategic errors that occur every game. What idiot drops Marcel Dareus into pass coverage? Seriously, how can people defend his ineptitude? Smart wins, stupid loses! This is why has Ryan been a career loser! Edited December 1, 2015 by Billsguy
Mr. WEO Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 I was referring to defensive rankings, not the team record. D was ranked higher in 2012 before the stars left in 2013. And the D shot up to number 2 in 2014.
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 And the 10 seconds is only to be sure of what you just saw, because.... who would do that? Rex wants to trick people and win with his "scheme", but we're talented enough to just beat people! But he'll keep banging on those round pegs until they go into those square holes. Take a breath, look around, and do it the smart way! (Yeah, I'm a bit angry at this point.) are we talented enough to just beat people? I honestly don't think we are. Last year's team had a ton of turnovers. That is not a sustainable scheme or plan. Yeah we had sacks too, but how many of those came against awful QBs? I'll give him the rodgers game - we had a good gameplan in that game. But lately that isnt even looking like that crazy good of an accomplishment. You can fire the coach - but if the players want to continue to be lazy and take plays off - these are the results you're going to get.
Reed83HOF Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 are we talented enough to just beat people? I honestly don't think we are. Last year's team had a ton of turnovers. That is not a sustainable scheme or plan. Yeah we had sacks too, but how many of those came against awful QBs? I'll give him the rodgers game - we had a good gameplan in that game. But lately that isnt even looking like that crazy good of an accomplishment. You can fire the coach - but if the players want to continue to be lazy and take plays off - these are the results you're going to get. They weren't lazy last year...hmmmm...what could have changed???
GG Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 D was ranked higher in 2012 before the stars left in 2013. And the D shot up to number 2 in 2014. So Schwartz's D shoots up to No. 2 after he left, and that's supposed to invalidate my point?
Mr. WEO Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 So Schwartz's D shoots up to No. 2 after he left, and that's supposed to invalidate my point? With or without his "stars", Schwartz's D was mediocre his last 2 years. It got better much after he was fired. It wasn't the stars or lack of them...
Santana Posted December 1, 2015 Posted December 1, 2015 I think some of the problem is that we're trying to worry about what the coaches did OUTSIDE of Buffalo. IMO the only thing that matters is how the coaches did with the players that are on Buffalo's roster. When I look at the two coaches and what they did/do defensively with the players we have, there's no question that the players seemed far more comfortable in Schwartz's defense. Last Years Defensive Rankings: Buffalo finished the season as a top five defense, ranking fourth overall, and finished in the top five in a host of different defensive categories. Chief among them, sacks (1st – 54), third down percentage (1st – 33.18), yards per play (3rd, 4.86), passing defense (3rd – 205.8), takeaways (3rd – 30) points per game (4th – 18.1) and first downs per game (5th – 18.9). The biggest difference I see between the Schwartz and Rex is consistency. One week we can pretty much tame have Tom Brady looking like a lost puppy for pretty much an entire game and the next week we let Alex Smith look like Drew Brees from a year ago. That's the biggest problem with Rex. I think with Schwartz you didn't see such a huge disparity from week to week.
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