Augie Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 ...and based on Pegulas moves with wanting a czar and no contract extension to Whaley the writing is already on the wall. Rex is here to stay for at least another year. He was handpicked by the Pegulas and has 25 million guaranteed. He is not leaving after one year. Maybe... but the writing on the wall is blurry at this point. I won't pretend to know where this is headed, but I will say Whaley is better at his job than Rex is at being a HC. I don't think there's any question about that. We shall see where it goes. The $20 mil left after this year is not huge dollars in the overall operating budget of an NFL team, but I think Rex gets another year.
BuffaloBillsForever Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) Maybe... but the writing on the wall is blurry at this point. I won't pretend to know where this is headed, but I will say Whaley is better at his job than Rex is at being a HC. I don't think there's any question about that. We shall see where it goes. The $20 mil left after this year is not huge dollars in the overall operating budget of an NFL team, but I think Rex gets another year. I can't say that but Rex was handed some sweet talent with NY. One thing is for sure is that Tannenbaum built a MUCH better team for Rex when he entered year 1 than what Whaley has done for Rex. Edited October 31, 2015 by BuffaloBillsForever
Sisyphean Bills Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Maybe... but the writing on the wall is blurry at this point. I won't pretend to know where this is headed, but I will say Whaley is better at his job than Rex is at being a HC. I don't think there's any question about that. We shall see where it goes. The $20 mil left after this year is not huge dollars in the overall operating budget of an NFL team, but I think Rex gets another year. Well, since these two have to work together, it strikes me as saying the heads side of the coin is better at its job than is the tails side.
Augie Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Well, since these two have to work together, it strikes me as saying the heads side of the coin is better at its job than is the tails side. In this case, the coin can be (and has to be) split. They work together, but it's not the same as one of those coaches with total power situations (which almost never works). It would be great if they could have a common vision and implement it, but that require Rex being a capable coach. That has not proven to be the case.
dave mcbride Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) Maybe... but the writing on the wall is blurry at this point. I won't pretend to know where this is headed, but I will say Whaley is better at his job than Rex is at being a HC. I don't think there's any question about that. We shall see where it goes. The $20 mil left after this year is not huge dollars in the overall operating budget of an NFL team, but I think Rex gets another year.Why is Whaley so great at identifying talent? What late round picks or street free agents of his beside Nickell Robey have panned out? Bradham, who looked to be one, is having a truly horrible season, unfortunately. Where are his Dion Lewises, Richard Shermans, Julian Edelmans, Chris Harrises, Kyle Williamses, and -- dare I say it -- Jason Peterses?Incognito was a great signing (probably a Rex guy but I'll give credit to Whaley too), but of course he was known to be good already. Where are those unheralded guys who flat out perform on this squad? Hogan and Robey are the best we've got, and they're not great. The Patriots are always loaded with them. That's who you have to compare Whaley against. He's ok, but let's be honest. The best players either preceded him or or are high picks or expensive FAs. I'm loath to give him credit for TT, who Rex had targeted. Edited October 31, 2015 by dave mcbride
BillsLux Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Although I don't ever want to boo the Bills at home (just not productive to the team, I feel your frustration with the front office. Quite honestly, I can't delineate Rex moves from Waley moves, so I'll just place the blame on management in general. (I will probably never criticize Pegula simply because he kept the Bills in Buffalo) Whaley moves: Continuing to put our team in the hands of EJ: EJ was picked number 16th. We were sold on the fact that he was a running quarterback in the mold of RG3 (the man at the time). But anyone watching EJ realized within a game or two that he's not a quick and agile quarterback at all. When he get's going, he's fast, but he doesn't possess escapability skills at all. We've also had to hear for three years that he needs to work on his accuracy. EXCUSE ME!!! THAT's WHAT QUARTERBACKS DO, THAT's ALL THEY DO, THEY THROW ACCURATE PASSES! If you can't do that, what are you. A immensely likeable human being that's difficult to root against, but he won't win games. Now, I'm not saying that I would of started Cassel over EJ, although it seemed Rex would of, but what I would say, is that it's incredible to me that Whaley didn't keep Cassel as a contingency given that Tyrod is a mobile quarterback and EJ has a propensity to get hurt. For three years, Whaley has undervalued the position of the quarterback and backup quarterback. We've had to watch pre-season games of qb's they've brought in for a week just to cut. Harvin: History doesn't lie Jackson: I'm delighted we let a pillar of the community in exchange for the guy who broke Smith's jaw. Jackson would of been a better backup then we've had for the last few weeks. When I watch the Bills now, they remind of the Jets the last two years. Supposedly good talent that were undisciplined and couldn't put it together.
Deranged Rhino Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Isn't it possible to think that he's made some good moves and bad moves instead of hunkering down in a bunker and denying the obvious in order to give an over-the-top defense of an average gm? No one is saying he bears no responsibility. But he didn't act alone. One miss, compared to the successes he's had, isn't enough to sink Whaley even if he did (but he didn't) draft EJ all by himself. The team JUST underwent an ownership change, followed quickly by an entire coaching staff change and front office reshuffling. They've had less than 12 months, zero time to build any kind of stability within the organization or on the field. No one is arguing Whaley's been perfect (at least I'm not), but he's been far better than any of his recent predecessors especially when you factor in the organizational changes he's had to survive. Give the guy some time. Change for the sake of change is how you end up being on the outside looking in for 15 years.
Augie Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Our talent is far beyond what we had 3-5 years ago. Period. Argue that if you want, but it's just silly.
MRW Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Why is Whaley so great at identifying talent? What late round picks or street free agents of his beside Nickell Robey have panned out? Bradham, who looked to be one, is having a truly horrible season, unfortunately. Where are his Dion Lewises, Richard Shermans, Julian Edelmans, Chris Harrises, Kyle Williamses, and -- dare I say it -- Jason Peterses?Incognito was a great signing (probably a Rex guy but I'll give credit to Whaley too), but of course he was known to be good already. Where are those unheralded guys who flat out perform on this squad? Hogan and Robey are the best we've got, and they're not great. The Patriots are always loaded with them. That's who you have to compare Whaley against. He's ok, but let's be honest. The best players either preceded him or or are high picks or expensive FAs. I'm loath to give him credit for TT, who Rex had targeted. So let's see, Whaley gets blame for picking EJ, even though he was not the GM, but does not get credit for TT even though he was the GM? Seems like a no-win situation you're setting him up for here.
Rico Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 So let's see, Whaley gets blame for picking EJ, even though he was not the GM, but does not get credit for TT even though he was the GM? Seems like a no-win situation you're setting him up for here. It is what it is. Whaley may have been given the title of GM, but he's never had the clout that other GMs have had. The HC doesn't report to him, and if the HC wants to bring ex-Jet players in, they are brought in. If the HC wanted TT brought in, he was brought in. Whaley makes personnel moves that the HC and staff don't agree with, he's gone 'rogue'. I agree, not the best situation for him.
808 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 people still crying over fred gone is insanity. whats he done so far in seattle? been hurt.. like he was here for the past 3 years. he was an awesome bill and great to cheer for but he was 34 and injury prone. i don't care if they are awesome in the community. give me a team of felons if its gonna win games I'm just tired of losing already. just freaking win
Buffalo Barbarian Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 I am 34 and have been a Bills fan for 24 years. I live in California and have flown across the country to 3 Bills home games only to see them lose all of it. I've been through all the joys and tribulations since 1990. The Jaguars game was the most disheartening game I have seen in 24 years. The root cause of this game and this season has been DOUG WHALEY. He needs to go. He does not care about the team nor the fans. He is selfish and only cares about his ego. Don't we deserve much better as loyal fans? I petition that during our next home game, we fans create "Fire Doug Whaley" signs and wave them in the stadium for the Pegulas to see. I rarely post message like this, but I felt a strong conviction to do so, and I hope you as fans can relate. LETS CREATE "FIRE DOUG WHALEY" SIGNS DURING OUR NEXT HOME GAME. Thoughts? I'm not his biggest fan because of neglecting the QB position and whiffing on the Oline and offense in general but he has done well on defense. But how does he not care about this team and how does he have a big ego?
Rob's House Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) people still crying over fred gone is insanity. whats he done so far in seattle? been hurt.. like he was here for the past 3 years. he was an awesome bill and great to cheer for but he was 34 and injury prone. i don't care if they are awesome in the community. give me a team of felons if its gonna win games I'm just tired of losing already. just freaking winThat's kind of the point. When you have inexperienced QBs and a mediocre O-line, and a RB starting the season hurt, and your GM drops the only other RB on your team who can both block and consistently catch passed out of the backfield (so he can keep yet another ST specialist), it makes it harder to just freaking win. Also, check out games missed for FJ and games missed for our guys and get back to me on the injury bit. Edited October 31, 2015 by Rob's House
1B4IDie Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) I am 34 and have been a Bills fan for 24 years. I live in California and have flown across the country to 3 Bills home games only to see them lose all of it. I've been through all the joys and tribulations since 1990. The Jaguars game was the most disheartening game I have seen in 24 years. The root cause of this game and this season has been DOUG WHALEY. He needs to go. He does not care about the team nor the fans. He is selfish and only cares about his ego. Don't we deserve much better as loyal fans? I petition that during our next home game, we fans create "Fire Doug Whaley" signs and wave them in the stadium for the Pegulas to see. I rarely post message like this, but I felt a strong conviction to do so, and I hope you as fans can relate. LETS CREATE "FIRE DOUG WHALEY" SIGNS DURING OUR NEXT HOME GAME. Thoughts? Has the lack of water damaged your thought process? That is definitely a sign of dehydration. The GM fills the cabinets with players. The coaches decide how to use the players. The cabinets at One Bills drive haven't been this filled with talent, this century. With one exception - QB. Now the on the field product that is on the coaches. So we won't be waiving Fire Whaley signs against the Dolphins. Next time maybe bounce the idea on shout wall before you go full bore with a post. smh Edited October 31, 2015 by 1B4IDie
thebandit27 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 And those TV contracts end up being worthless if fans don't watch the games. And what is going to cause that to happen? Doug Whaley?
Nihilarian Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 Why is Whaley so great at identifying talent? What late round picks or street free agents of his beside Nickell Robey have panned out? Bradham, who looked to be one, is having a truly horrible season, unfortunately. Where are his Dion Lewises, Richard Shermans, Julian Edelmans, Chris Harrises, Kyle Williamses, and -- dare I say it -- Jason Peterses?Incognito was a great signing (probably a Rex guy but I'll give credit to Whaley too), but of course he was known to be good already. Where are those unheralded guys who flat out perform on this squad? Hogan and Robey are the best we've got, and they're not great. The Patriots are always loaded with them. That's who you have to compare Whaley against. He's ok, but let's be honest. The best players either preceded him or or are high picks or expensive FAs. I'm loath to give him credit for TT, who Rex had targeted. I agree with this when comparing the Bills to the Patriots. Whaley has had three off seasons now, and a bunch of players drafted / free agents seem to be so fragile. BTW Incognito was all Rex Ryan because the 2014 season saw the bills with the worst O line in the league, and Incognito was available the entire time. This scouting dept & Whaley seem to have difficulty in assessing offensive line talent. My biggest beef with Whaley in his building a competitive team is still the trade up for Watkins for two first round picks 2014-2015 while the team is still searching for the franchise QB. Not to even mention Watkins is about the highest priced fragile decoy I've ever seen.
BuffaloBillsForever Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) And what is going to cause that to happen? Doug Whaley? Indirectly Doug Whaley is since he is ultimately responsible for the mediocre product on the field. I agree with this when comparing the Bills to the Patriots. Whaley has had three off seasons now, and a bunch of players drafted / free agents seem to be so fragile. BTW Incognito was all Rex Ryan because the 2014 season saw the bills with the worst O line in the league, and Incognito was available the entire time. This scouting dept & Whaley seem to have difficulty in assessing offensive line talent. My biggest beef with Whaley in his building a competitive team is still the trade up for Watkins for two first round picks 2014-2015 while the team is still searching for the franchise QB. Not to even mention Watkins is about the highest priced fragile decoy I've ever seen. At least Lee Evans wasn't injury prone. Edited October 31, 2015 by BuffaloBillsForever
Chandler#81 Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 So let's see, Whaley gets blame for picking EJ, even though he was not the GM, but does not get credit for TT even though he was the GM? Seems like a no-win situation you're setting him up for here. There's a helluva lot of crusaders here. Facts be damned.
dave mcbride Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 So let's see, Whaley gets blame for picking EJ, even though he was not the GM, but does not get credit for TT even though he was the GM? Seems like a no-win situation you're setting him up for here. He gets blame for picking EJ because he was the guy pushing hardest for the pick. Rex was the guy pushing for Taylor, so Rex gets most of the credit for that. That's why. I agree with Rico, though - it's a no-win situation for the GM in this sort of power structure. One move that I did leave out which was terrific was the Hughes trade. Yes, Nix was GM, but Whaley was head of pro personnel and anyway in 2013 Nix was phasing himself out. Hughes has had two great seasons for the Bills and is a very good player. There's a helluva lot of crusaders here. Facts be damned. Not really. See above.
Rico Posted October 31, 2015 Posted October 31, 2015 (edited) Well, I have gone on record many times that Pegs best move when he took over would've been to throw all of "Ralph's trash" to the curb, wash away the losing stench, and start anew with a clean slate. But that didn't happen, and I'm not campaigning here to dump Whaley. I think he's made some good moves and some bad moves, but overall I think he has indeed improved the talent level on the roster since he took over as GM. I don't think that improvement though has been significant enough to the point that he's guaranteed to get an extension, especially if things keep going south and the internal fighting is/has been actually going on. Edited October 31, 2015 by Rico
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