In defense of EJ (yeah, I said it!)

[Big Gun]

Bravo Metz. Thank you for the hidden insults to people's intelligence. Maybe you should rethink - why you as well as I had to sit back on suspension - before you continue the jabs at people.

 

Yes, we think EJ has talent and could be a starter. Well so far it looks as if we are wrong for having an opinion. That does not mean you can sit there and call us idiots.

I will do my hardest to not fall into responding to antagonistic postings again.

Have a nice day.

Kind of ironic that you would say that, as anyone who's opinion differed from yours and thought EJ wasn't a good QB was wrong and a troll in your eyes.

[BmarvB]

I've officially transitioned to being annoyed every time I watch Cam Newton play... It's a combination of dashed hope that EJ could have evolved be that good, combined with the realization Thad Lewis is actually far better.... #ihatemyfanhood

 

Hmmmmm

Where is Thad Lewis now? I thought he could have been developed into a pretty good backup.

Sure he screwed up but it wasn't EJs fault 100%. Poor play calls and also everyone was covered on several plays that mattered. Whether a short 2nd or a 3rd down.

 

He did well! He led the team to a comeback. But Corey Graham sealed our win. They just had to last one more drive. Unfortunately we all know the outcome or there would be "Will EJ take the #1 spot?" Threads.

 

You're absolutely right. That was the point I was making in EJ's defense. Even though he really did suck everything suckable in the first half, he put it behind him, overcame it, and brought the team back in the 2nd half. Had we won, somebody (not me) would be speaking EJ's name in the same sentence with Frank Reich (Again, NOT me)

Edited October 26, 2015 by BmarvB

[FireChan]

I am guessing that if it were any other QB you would say something different.

 

Yes, EJ was horrible getting sacked and fumbling with multiple defenders descending upon him and the next 2 drives throwing INT's. But he got his chit together and pulled off the comeback until the phantom PI call on Darby.

 

How about putting some credit on Shady for fumbling in or damn near the RedZone. Add those 3 lost points and it is also a different game. Blame EJ for a horrid 3 series, just don't forget the rest of the team dropping passes and missing tackles.

 

 

Funny thing was as I watched parts of the Cowboys Giants game I saw Matt Cassel throw 2 wobbling INT's (on consecutive drives) yesterday evening.

Bad when there's multiple defenders? Yikes, do we play a team without defenders?

[CodeMonkey]

Maybe the most disturbing long term issue to me with Manuel was noticed and pointed out by the Yahoo talking heads during the game a few times yesterday. Three years in and Manuel is still staring down his receivers and not looking the safeties off even a little. That plus still consistently throwing to the middle of the field right into zone coverage. Still doing these kinds of very bad things three years in makes me seriously doubt his viability as a starter, ever. He has some potential as a backup however.

[Fadingpain]

Maybe the most disturbing long term issue to me with Manuel was noticed and pointed out by the Yahoo talking heads during the game a few times yesterday. Three years in and Manuel is still staring down his receivers and not looking the safeties off even a little. That plus still consistently throwing to the middle of the field right into zone coverage. Still doing these kinds of very bad things three years in makes me seriously doubt his viability as a starter, ever. He has some potential as a backup however.

His throwing mechanics are just awful and that hasn't improved much over time, either.

 

It's a big part of why he is so inconsistent with his accuracy.

 

I think he'll be out of the league shortly.

[TakeYouToTasker]

Just so we're clear, in his 5 starts you've seen enough to evaluate that Tyrod isn't great and has no room to grow, but in 15 starts you still thought EJ Manuel was the best QB on our roster? I see his 16th start changed your opinion a bit.

Tyrod has been in the league for 5 years and all of his starts have been in his 5th season, so the game should definitely have slowed down for him by now. The overwhelming majority of EJ starts had been in his rookie year, with a handful at the beginning of his second season, where the game very typically has not slowed down yet for quarterbacks. The third year is where you typically see quarterbacks take strides.

[Big Gun]

His throwing mechanics are just awful and that hasn't improved much over time, either.

 

It's a big part of why he is so inconsistent with his accuracy.

 

I think he'll be out of the league shortly.

I suspect if not sometime in the next 2 weeks, most definitely at years end. What coaching staff is going to trust him with even a backup position? He crapped out against arguably the worst team in the NFL. If i'm a coach, i'm not touching this guy.

[BuffaloHokie13]

Tyrod has been in the league for 5 years and all of his starts have been in his 5th season, so the game should definitely have slowed down for him by now. The overwhelming majority of EJ starts had been in his rookie year, with a handful at the beginning of his second season, where the game very typically has not slowed down yet for quarterbacks. The third year is where you typically see quarterbacks take strides.

So, in short, yes. you were wrong after 15 games of EJ, but 5 is enough for a definitive evaluation.

[GG]

Tyrod has been in the league for 5 years and all of his starts have been in his 5th season, so the game should definitely have slowed down for him by now. The overwhelming majority of EJ starts had been in his rookie year, with a handful at the beginning of his second season, where the game very typically has not slowed down yet for quarterbacks. The third year is where you typically see quarterbacks take strides.

 

And in his 16 starts, EJ has yet to have as good a game as TT's best game, and has had a lot of games that are worse than TT's worst game. A little tidbit you continued to ignore in your crudsade.

[xsoldier54]

None of those things are problems if EJ doesn't put us in a hole early. No late game heroics from Blake. No 1 yard. No bad call.

This. EJ is horrible and it was his mistakes that caused that huge deficit. Without those mistakes, we win this game easily.

[BuffaloHokie13]

This. EJ is horrible and it was his mistakes that caused that huge deficit. Without those mistakes, we win this game easily.

I don't know if that's fair. Turnovers only led to 20 of the Jags' 34 points.

[TakeYouToTasker]

 

And in his 16 starts, EJ has yet to have as good a game as TT's best game, and has had a lot of games that are worse than TT's worst game. A little tidbit you continued to ignore in your crudsade.

Perhaps you should have read the things I said, instead of simply opining in ignorance, yes?

 

EJ Manuel has demonstrated that he is not the answer, as he hasn't taken the strides he needed to here in his third season. He is, beyond a shadow of a doubt, not as good of a quarterback as Tyrod Taylor.

 

This is unfortunate, because EJ's development was crucial to us having any success this year, and in to the next several years; as Tyrod Taylor is also a bad quarterback. Not as bad as EJ Manuel, but not good enough to win consistently in the NFL.

[GG]

I don't know if that's fair. Turnovers only led to 20 of the Jags' 34 points.

 

Don't discount the net 4 points left on the field with a bad pass to Gragg in 1Q

[dave mcbride]

 

Don't discount the net 4 points left on the field with a bad pass to Gragg in 1Q

That is absolutely true. Gragg was wide open.

[TakeYouToTasker]

So, in short, yes. you were wrong after 15 games of EJ, but 5 is enough for a definitive evaluation.

Again, given NFL developmental curves at the quarterback position, I wanted to see what EJ might have matured in to in his third season, which is when quarterbacks typically begin to show marked improvements.

 

Tyrod Taylor is in his fifth season.

[Wayne Cubed]

 

Don't discount the net 4 points left on the field with a bad pass to Gragg in 1Q

 

Yea he missed Gragg twice on that drive. The deep throw, if he hits Gragg in stride, there is no one behind him and he could have waltzed into the endzone. Then he misses wide open in the corner of the endzone.

[dave mcbride]

An interesting factoid: EJ is the only QB in NFL history to have been the losing starting QB in three different countries.

[GG]

Perhaps you should have read the things I said, instead of simply opining in ignorance, yes?

 

EJ Manuel has demonstrated that he is not the answer, as he hasn't taken the strides he needed to here in his third season. He is, beyond a shadow of a doubt, not as good of a quarterback as Tyrod Taylor.

 

This is unfortunate, because EJ's development was crucial to us having any success this year, and in to the next several years; as Tyrod Taylor is also a bad quarterback. Not as bad as EJ Manuel, but not good enough to win consistently in the NFL.

 

I take it this is your evolved position on EJ after yet another clunker. Perhaps you're substituting wishful thinking for analysis. No reason to trash TT to lift up EJ, which is what you have constantly done until yesterday morning, and now that the story line is written it's time to pivot the argument?

 

What you continue to ignore, even now, is that EJ hasn't made any improvements to his critical errors. His game yesterday was a rehash of the "cons" that were in every scouting report and from some objective analysis from Seminole fans. You seem to think that a light magically turns on in a QB's head in his third training camp. If that were the case, we'd have JP Losman breaking Jim Kelly's records.

 

For the few cases where the QBs do turn it on in year three, there's usually a progression in the positive direction. That has clearly been missing in EJ's case. He's the same guy, making the same mistakes that he was in his junior year at FSU.

 

You were fooled by a few good passes against Cleveland and Pittsburgh, with little pressure, yet he still threw the ball a split second too late on many of those.

 

TT on the other hand has already accomplished more than EJ and in two games was down more playmakers than EJ had - and has a winning record to show for it.

 

Bottom line is that defenses need to totally retool their game plan with TT as the QB, while for EJ all they need to do is blitz a few more times per game and the inevitable turnover will come.

[FireChan]

Again, given NFL developmental curves at the quarterback position, I wanted to see what EJ might have matured in to in his third season, which is when quarterbacks typically begin to show marked improvements.

 

Tyrod Taylor is in his fifth season.

Oh is that why you posted 50+ times about how EJM is the best QB on the roster? The story changes, huh?

[BuffaloHokie13]

Oh is that why you posted 50+ times about how EJM is the best QB on the roster? The story changes, huh?

No no no, 15 games simply weren't enough time to evaluate EJ. But by his 5th start we know everything about Tyrod because he backed up a Super Bowl MVP for 4 years in another franchise.