hondo in seattle Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 When Bucky writes sentences that forces the reader to choose if DW is insecure or arrogant, I get the impression that Bucky just doesn't like Whaley. I wonder if something happened between them.
clearwater cadet Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Give EJ a chance without Marrone as the coach. Marrone sucked so it would only make sense EJ sucked while with him. He can't beat cinni with Cassel anyway.
BillsVet Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Is it reasonable to conclude that Whaley, by virtue of selecting Manuel, had more interest in him playing that the current coaching staff who did not pick him? I would think it logical. Is it reasonable to conclude then that Whaley was not as eager to sign clear starting competition to Manuel in Taylor and Cassel? I would think it logical. Is it reasonable then that Whaley, whom I believe is not signed beyond the 2015 season, would want his guy Manuel, on the game-day roster? This after Manuel was not dressed in weeks 1 and 2. I would think it logical. Therefore, it's logical that handling of the QB position has been done in a way so as to ensure the GM's QB had an opportunity, even if the primary backup, to get playing time should Taylor be injured. I also realize it's an exercise in futility to discuss logic with those for whom fan-hood will always supersede debate. We don't know for sure what happens behind closed doors at OBD, but drawing conclusions based on known facts is reasonable. What's not is going to bat for the team rain or shine, particularly with the track record this team has in recent years. That's not logical.
birdog1960 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 wow. back to shooting the messenger I see. does anyone here really disagree that the roster would be better right now with fred and cassell on it?
LB3 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Is it reasonable to conclude that Whaley, by virtue of selecting Manuel, had more interest in him playing that the current coaching staff who did not pick him? I would think it logical.Is it reasonable to conclude then that Whaley was not as eager to sign clear starting competition to Manuel in Taylor and Cassel? I would think it logical. Is it reasonable then that Whaley, whom I believe is not signed beyond the 2015 season, would want his guy Manuel, on the game-day roster? This after Manuel was not dressed in weeks 1 and 2. I would think it logical.Therefore, it's logical that handling of the QB position has been done in a way so as to ensure the GM's QB had an opportunity, even if the primary backup, to get playing time should Taylor be injured. I also realize it's an exercise in futility to discuss logic with those for whom fan-hood will always supersede debate. We don't know for sure what happens behind closed doors at OBD, but drawing conclusions based on known facts is reasonable. What's not is going to bat for the team rain or shine, particularly with the track record this team has in recent years. That's not logical. I don't agree. If Whaley's future rested/rests on him having a QB that can make this team successful, I don't think it would matter where he got that QB (draft or free agency) as long as that QB performs well. He would be the guy who brought that QB in.
ko12010 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 wow. back to shooting the messenger I see. does anyone here really disagree that the roster would be better right now with fred and cassell on it? I don't think Cassell adds anything When Bucky writes sentences that forces the reader to choose if DW is insecure or arrogant, I get the impression that Bucky just doesn't like Whaley. I wonder if something happened between them. He probably said in private, "Bucky, you're the epitome of what is wrong with sports journalism these days. Leave me alone you parasite."
hondo in seattle Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) wow. back to shooting the messenger I see. does anyone here really disagree that the roster would be better right now with fred and cassell on it? I agree with you 100%. After 15 years out of the playoffs, I think the NFL should grant the Bills an exemption that allows us an unlimited number of players with an unlimited salary cap. Seriously, though, it just seems that Bucky set out to write a 'DW Sucks' article. I still disagree with the cutting of Freddy but it's not hard to see Whaley's logic even when you disagree with it. And trading away MC? It seemed like a reasonable business decision at the time. Yet according to Bucky, DW was not being a reasonable GM. Instead he was acting out of insecurity and/or arrogance. Bucky makes DW sound like an egotistical, petulant child who has no business running a franchise when DW seems like a pretty smart personnel guy if you ask me. The ad hominen tone of the article was unnecessary and very much off point. Edited October 14, 2015 by hondo in seattle
birdog1960 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 I agree with you 100%. After 15 years out of the playoffs, I think the NFL should grant the Bills an exemption that allows us an unlimited number of players with an unlimited salary cap. Seriously, though, it just seems that Bucky set out to write a 'DW Sucks' article. I still disagree with the cutting of Freddy but it's not hard to see Whaley's logic even when you disagree with it. And trading away MC? It seemed like a reasonable business decision at the time. Yet according to Bucky, DW was not being a reasonable GM. Instead he was acting out of insecurity and/or arrogance. Bucky makes DW sound like an egotistical, petulant child who has no business running a franchise when DW seems like a pretty smart personnel guy if you ask me. The ad hominen tone of the article was unnecessary and very much off point. flag for straw man...it was widely reported fred would have renegotiated to stay and he's not costing seattle much. cassell was resigned cheap as well
QCity Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 wow. back to shooting the messenger I see. does anyone here really disagree that the roster would be better right now with fred and cassell on it? Josh Johnson, a guy with about 4 days exposure to the playbook, is suddenly a better option than Cassel. Also, Cierre Wood and Dan Herron are apparently upgrades over FredEx. Something, something, excuses, something, money, something....
plenzmd1 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) I'm not so hung up on whether the QB is developmental or not -- I just want him to be able to play. The Bills simply don't have that player now. Both Brett Hundley and Bryce Petty have been in their respective team systems for nearly half a year now, and both have physical talent. Regardless of their youth, they'll have SOME capability to play decently enough if called upon. In contrast, the Bills' passport-checking moves yesterday called to mind nothing so much as a frantic response from the TSA to a Code Red alert. Josh Johnson just happened to be the random guy picked out from one of the baggage security lines yesterday. Bear in mind that Rex had two QBs last year, and it didn't go so well. He had three this year -- until he didn't. Turns out they were wrong. Both of the players you mention are young with upside...i think that is the difference between them and keeping Cassell as the 3. And i am making a big assumption, but yes i think he was the 3. No way they cut him if you wanted him to be primary backup Just too much risk there of him signing elsewhere. .I do believe EJ all along was the guy who would start the next game if TT was hurt, but they wanted Matt in game. Also, the passport thing surprised me...one can get an expedited passport in a couple of days i believe...i know I did about 10 years ago. Well, if nothing else perhaps we can all now agree that the Bills would have preferred to have signed Josh McCown rather than traded for Cassel. That always seemed obvious to me, but there was some debate about this in recent months. Some even suggested that the Bills performed some sort of Jedi mind trick to force Cleveland to overpay for McCown. I was 100% against McGown, looks like i may have been wrong...mark it down, doesn't happen much wow. back to shooting the messenger I see. does anyone here really disagree that the roster would be better right now with fred and cassell on it? I do. Love Fred, but who would you cut to keep him? And my feelings on Cassell are pretty obvious. Edited October 14, 2015 by plenzmd1
birdog1960 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Josh Johnson, a guy with about 4 days exposure to the playbook, is suddenly a better option than Cassel. Also, Cierre Wood and Dan Herron are apparently upgrades over FredEx. Something, something, excuses, something, money, something.... objectivity is so refreshing even when it's uncomfortable. I do. Love Fred, but who would you cut to keep him? And my feelings on Cassell are pretty obvious. how bout gay, who they later cut anyway?
plenzmd1 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Josh Johnson, a guy with about 4 days exposure to the playbook, is suddenly a better option than Cassel. Also, Cierre Wood and Dan Herron are apparently upgrades over FredEx. Something, something, excuses, something, money, something.... Dont look at it that way...... Cassell or Jordan Gay? Cassell or IK? Freddy or Karlos Williams? Freddy or Boobie? Freddy or Chris Gragg in a TE heavy scheme?
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) Weeden > Cassel > EJ. The Bills coaches agreed, which is why EJ was 3rd string behind Cassel.I don't know how anyone can make this arguement yet. Cassel effectively lost his job because EJ was "enough" of a safety net so that to me can only justify that EJ=MC. And like we've seen so often in the past, Cassel a practice superstar, doesn't tend to hold down a starting job for long once he's out there. Add that Dallas offense is built to attack further downfield then I've tended to see from Cassel and I don't expect it will go well. Edited October 14, 2015 by over 20 years of fanhood
BillsVet Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 is h I don't agree. If Whaley's future rested/rests on him having a QB that can make this team successful, I don't think it would matter where he got that QB (draft or free agency) as long as that QB performs well. He would be the guy who brought that QB in. Every GM is judged in large part based on their (QB) decision(s) and if they draft one high, that pick is going to be scrutinized. And I highly doubt Whaley was high on acquiring direct competition for the 1st round pick he made at QB. The Bills have gone out of their way over the years to avoid QB controversies like the plague. I've heard nothing about the Pegula's extending the GM, which presumably is based on how the team performs in 2015 after so much was spent this off-season. The idea that Whaley should be immune from criticism, especially for QB moves remains absurd.
plenzmd1 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 how bout gay, who they later cut anyway? Okay, so first two games actives are Shady, Williams, Boobie...Fred sits on sidelines inactive.How does that sit with fanbase and Fred? I agree on not having a KO guy...but then you willing to part with Carpenter to get a guy who can do both? I think Carpenter should be fine with both, but that is not how they approached the season.
Big Turk Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Cassell is a game manager type QB that throws too many interceptions for someone who can't throw the ball downfield effectively. No thanks.
birdog1960 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 Cassell is a game manager type QB that throws too many interceptions for someone who can't throw the ball downfield effectively. No thanks. so how do you defend whaleys decision to sign him not once but twice?
Chandler#81 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 The Bills, otoh, have 2, and yesterday had to conduct a DEEP dumpster dive to unearth one of the worst semi-qbs in the league (Johnson) -- a guy who doesn't even know the offense. I just think it's shaky roster management. Cassel in my opinion is more valuable on the team than matthew mulligan (or Gay/Cundiff; take your pick). He does, actually. Played for the 49ers last year under Roman -and he can run. That's why he's here. He already said he's familiar with the offense. Smart move from a strong mgmnt.
YoloinOhio Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 (edited) so how do you defend whaleys decision to sign him not once but twice? It seemed like they wanted to make sure they had a "capable" vet going into TC because they didn't know what they were going to get out of EJ and TT with the new system and coaching staff. When I say capable I mean "experienced." Obviously a "good" experienced vet isnt available in FA or for a late round pick. Once they saw what they had with those two, he became dispensible. Teams that rely on guys like Cassel, McCown, Hoyer, Fitz, etc. at QB are just playing scared. JMO. Edited October 14, 2015 by YoloinOhio
plenzmd1 Posted October 14, 2015 Posted October 14, 2015 He does, actually. Played for the 49ers last year under Roman -and he can run. That's why he's here. He already said he's familiar with the offense. Smart move from a strong mgmnt. and was in Cinci all off season and through TC...hmmm
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