Perry Turtle Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 right - but they are not like a case where someone transposed a number wrong on an evidence bag and it got tossed out. those are major flaws in the nfls system still. arbitrarily making up a punishment is a pretty MAJOR technicality, even if the person committed the infraction. It calls into question the ability for the Comissioner to protect the integrity of the league under the current CBA. The fix for this is a byzantine set of codes and punishments in the next CBA, which undoubtably will be exploited by guys like Belichick ("the rules don't explicitly say that you can't do that").
Kelly the Dog Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 i think thats also a point not to forget - its not like theres now zero punishment for all this. just no suspension.Yeah for the actual infraction and actual punishment the team paid a hefty price of the fine and especially the #1 and #4 pick. Plus the loss of two excellent cheaters they cannot use anymore. Brady is tarnished in his reputation by a substantial amount of fans and branded a cheater. That is probably enough of a punishment, too, for what he did. But the travesty if there is one is that he just blatantly cheated and blatantly lied and the league is not able to punish that. All in all, although I was perhaps the biggest arguer of guilt on the board, the overall punishment and outcome even with this ruling fits the crime. I just think the personal punishment for Brady should have been more and maybe the team less. I still doubt Kraft and Belicjick had any knowledge.
KingRex Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Yup. #noasterisk The court ruling says no asterisk for Brady, but the Pats already have accepted a million $ fine and loss of some draft picks for violating the rule as an institution on the issue of trying to gain a competitive advantage by deflating footballs.
Blokestradamus Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 This makes the whole process worthwhile.
NoSaint Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Really? Why do you think that? I'm sure the league never had a meeting where they said to each other what do we do if a player advises an employees to steal the games balls and alter them just before kickoff and then just denies everything when we investigate with outlandish answers that no one believes? If someone does three or four things wrong in succession they should have a list of penalties for this? weve been through this debate many many times. it seems the judge agreed with the arguments made on bradys behalf. ive enjoyed the spirited debate, and appreciate you taking the time to be very educated on the topic for sure, but honestly im not sure what to say to you on this at this point. you know that i think the issue is not that this was so vague that no one thought of it, but that it was actually defined and had precedent that the league needed to notify that they were altering policy for.
Kelly the Dog Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Come on man. I said I wasn't commenting on the legal aspect. Then you can't really make a statement like you did because it had no bearing whatsoever on this ruling. weve been through this debate many many times. it seems the judge agreed with the arguments made on bradys behalf. ive enjoyed the spirited debate, and appreciate you taking the time to be very educated on the topic for sure, but honestly im not sure what to say to you on this at this point. you know that i think the issue is not that this was so vague that no one thought of it, but that it was actually defined and had precedent that the league needed to notify that they were altering policy for. When would they have done this notifying? I really don't understand what you are referring to. Apologies if I'm missing something obvious.
klos63 Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Yeah for the actual infraction and actual punishment the team paid a hefty price of the fine and especially the #1 and #4 pick. Plus the loss of two excellent cheaters they cannot use anymore. Brady is tarnished in his reputation by a substantial amount of fans and branded a cheater. That is probably enough of a punishment, too, for what he did. But the travesty if there is one is that he just blatantly cheated and blatantly lied and the league is not able to punish that. All in all, although I was perhaps the biggest arguer of guilt on the board, the overall punishment and outcome even with this ruling fits the crime. I just think the personal punishment for Brady should have been more and maybe the team less. I still doubt Kraft and Belicjick had any knowledge. I think one other aspect of all this gets overlooked. The rule about PSI and having the teams be in control of game balls all week was put into place, at the urging of Brady and Peyton, in order to allow the QB's play at the highest level they can achieve. They have control over PSI, they can scuff the balls all week, break them in to their liking. It seems like a poorly written rule, but the point of it was to allow each QB to 'customize' the game ball , within limits, to whatever suits them best. If you allow this, they should have more leway in PSI range. It's overblown because it's the Patriots and Brady. It's time to put this to rest and concentrate on more important things , like the regular season for our Bills.
YoloinOhio Posted September 3, 2015 Author Posted September 3, 2015 Brady is going to demolish that Steelers defense.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Brady is going to demolish that Steelers defense. And then ours the following week. Book it. I'm now bearish, seeing an 0-2 start.
YoloinOhio Posted September 3, 2015 Author Posted September 3, 2015 And then ours the following week. Book it. I'm now bearish, seeing an 0-2 start. ok... But there is a slight difference between the two to be fair
NickelCity Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Very much expected, but still aggravating. Let's all just cheat, eff it.
nucci Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 And then ours the following week. Book it. I'm now bearish, seeing an 0-2 start. Not really shocking for you
Fan in Chicago Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Brady is tarnished in his reputation by a substantial amount of fans and branded a cheater. That is probably enough of a punishment, too, for what he did. But the travesty if there is one is that he just blatantly cheated and blatantly lied and the league is not able to punish that. He will always have his ring. And no matter what we beat up on Brady* for , no one can argue against his smarts. I wouldn't be surprised if he had reviewed this entire scenario with a lawyer well before getting those balls deflated. Given the possible benefit and the low possibility of a conviction, it is not unreasonable to expect he went into it with eyes more than wide open,
Tyrod's Tailor Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 So what. We'll just have to knock him out of the game in week 2. Then he'll wish he had been suspended.
JohnC Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Flubs, yes. Major flubs? I'm not sure. The Judge was going a little overboard in his explanations from what I have seen so far. Although granted I don't know this. But I just read one of the major reasons was the players were not given the guidelines for the deflation but the teams were (and Brady even admitted getting them and using them with the referees). That's not a major flub. Brady wasn't aware he could get four games for doing something no one figured a team would do? That's not a major flub. Not making Pash available to be interviewed? the Pats didn't allow the guyOne The league established equipment guidelines for teams, not players. (As you noted.) But when it was determined that a team violated rules associated with equipment transgressions the standard punishment was a miniscule fine, usually $25,000. How does that compare to a four game suspension against a player for a rule that doesn't even apply to a player? There is a pattern that is evident when Goodell's disciplinary rulings are reviewed by outside authorities: his rulings are consistently overruled due to the aribtrary and capricious manner in which he handles his disciplinary responsibilites. Make no mistake about the judge's ruling, he found the evidence unconvincing (although that was not his primary focus) and the overall process very unfair. attached is his ruling: http://cdn-jpg.si.com/sites/default/files/download/tom-brady-suspension-overturned-ruling.pdf
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