PortlandiaEast Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 If this took place in 2015, Clements would have been flagged 15 yards, ejected, suspended the remainder of the season and fined an ungodly amount of money. I've seen that clip a bunch and this thought never crossed my mind, but I think you are right on the flag, maybe a 2 game suspension, and at least 50k fine. If you slow that clip down, he doesn't "launch" himself, and it looks like the hit is with his shoulder. But 1) its TB12, 2) Helmet comes off means the NFL wets themselves and does everything to protect Brady in the future. Looks like a sweet hit to me. Worth the penalties all day long.
Jobu Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 (edited) After this season is up, it will be very interesting to take a look at Brady's stats and NE fumbling stats for that matter. The league is probably going to be watching pressure closer than a crack smoker watches his rocks. They will now be doing things like adjusting for atmosphere and using NIST approved gauges, My guess is that this season footballs will be more inflated than ever. Wonder how Tommy's little girl hands will deal with that? Edited September 3, 2015 by Show Me The Baby
DC Tom Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Now that's !@#$ing interesting. I'll have to ponder that one. My first inclination is to say there must be some standard - I mean, who's to say that wearing a Speedo at the beach isn't conduct unbecoming - but that's a tough one. There may be policies that outline "conduct unbecoming" in greater detail, but I haven't found them. It's important to note, too, that Berman's support of "prior notice" relies on the extreme detail of the Substance Abuse Policy (which detail he describes) to establish the unfairness and lack of standing of Goodell's decision. So he is, at a basic level, saying that any policy for "conduct unbecoming" must outline the same detail for investigation and punishment. Which would also lead to the conclusion that anything NOT detailed in such a policy can't be punished. So if you find a new way to cheat...go for it! It's an absolutely asinine section of the CBA, as I said. But I would have preferred seeing the NFLPA get slapped down for agreeing to it, rather than Goodell get slapped down for exercising it.
PortlandiaEast Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 In general though, its getting harder and harder to take professional sports seriously, NFL in particular. I really like the new NBA commish and the way he handles himself and the NBA. Roger is nothingness in the NFL after this, the court system just neutered his authority. Every decision on conduct violations will now be challenged. He should step down. His reign was a failure.
DC Tom Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 I've seen that clip a bunch and this thought never crossed my mind, but I think you are right on the flag, maybe a 2 game suspension, and at least 50k fine. If you slow that clip down, he doesn't "launch" himself, and it looks like the hit is with his shoulder. But 1) its TB12, 2) Helmet comes off means the NFL wets themselves and does everything to protect Brady in the future. Looks like a sweet hit to me. Worth the penalties all day long. Except that he doesn't launch himself (if you go through it frame-by-frame, his feet never leave the ground), he doesn't lead with the helmet, he doesn't seem to go headhunting (even frame-by-frame it's hard to tell). But he'd still get the flag, suspension, and fine anyway, nowadays. Hell, a full third of Bruce's sacks would result in penalties and fines nowadays. And Leon Seals' pancaking of Hostetler in the Superbowl doesn't even bear thinking about.
shrader Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 There may be policies that outline "conduct unbecoming" in greater detail, but I haven't found them. It's important to note, too, that Berman's support of "prior notice" relies on the extreme detail of the Substance Abuse Policy (which detail he describes) to establish the unfairness and lack of standing of Goodell's decision. So he is, at a basic level, saying that any policy for "conduct unbecoming" must outline the same detail for investigation and punishment. Which would also lead to the conclusion that anything NOT detailed in such a policy can't be punished. So if you find a new way to cheat...go for it! It's an absolutely asinine section of the CBA, as I said. But I would have preferred seeing the NFLPA get slapped down for agreeing to it, rather than Goodell get slapped down for exercising it. Is the domestic abuse stuff in there at all? I'm getting random annoying emails from the wife's Boston area family saying that the league needs to focus on the real problems like all of the domestic abuse. I find all of this funny because if that stuff's not in there either, this ruling just effectively stopped him from being able to take a tougher stance against it. Or have they officially laid out how they plan on punishing for that?
26CornerBlitz Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 @nflcommish makes a statement on Brady’s suspension being nullified. He respectfully disagrees
machine gun kelly Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Next step, the NFL takes this to appeal. He may have wished he accepted two games and be done with it. Now if overturned to the suspension it will be towards the end of the season when it counts.
NoSaint Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 There may be policies that outline "conduct unbecoming" in greater detail, but I haven't found them. It's important to note, too, that Berman's support of "prior notice" relies on the extreme detail of the Substance Abuse Policy (which detail he describes) to establish the unfairness and lack of standing of Goodell's decision. So he is, at a basic level, saying that any policy for "conduct unbecoming" must outline the same detail for investigation and punishment. Which would also lead to the conclusion that anything NOT detailed in such a policy can't be punished. So if you find a new way to cheat...go for it! It's an absolutely asinine section of the CBA, as I said. But I would have preferred seeing the NFLPA get slapped down for agreeing to it, rather than Goodell get slapped down for exercising it. In the bright side, both sides have motivation to fix the system these days
stevewin Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Again, so you're saying that the NFL has to come up with all conceivable ways that players can try give themselves and advantage and apply a punishment for each and every one? How ridiculous is that? So everyone gets a get out of jail free card as long as it's the first time it happened? Dumb dumb dumb The Cheaters are doubling the amount of listening devices all over their facility as we speak
NoSaint Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 In general though, its getting harder and harder to take professional sports seriously, NFL in particular. I really like the new NBA commish and the way he handles himself and the NBA. Roger is nothingness in the NFL after this, the court system just neutered his authority. Every decision on conduct violations will now be challenged. He should step down. His reign was a failure. He's lost out on the last several big decisions- you just won't see anyone champion an abuser, while this is insignificant enough to be visibly advocated by people without fear of confining spousal or child abuse.
HamSandwhich Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 That's not it exactly, but think about it in terms of law. You can use broad language to encompass types of behavior without spelling out every detail as long as the prohibited conduct is reasonably identifiable by the rule, but you can't make a rule after the fact and punish someone accordingly. In law that's called ex post facto and it's unconstitutional. Or more simply, how can you break a rule that doesn't yet exist? This is semantics. There was language about conduct detrimental to the league, but apparently cheating is not detrimental.
26CornerBlitz Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 @nflnetwork Statement from Patriots Chairman and CEO Robert Kraft on today’s decision
Kelly the Dog Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 That's not it either. The league didn't conclude that he did that. They concluded it was likely that he was aware of it. The rules didn't provide for punishment for mere awareness of misconduct, not did it provide for punishment for noncooperation with an investigation. Those were the two things he was penalised for. One of the many mistakes the league made, although I'm not sure you can fault them for it, is the "generally aware" of wording. That is what they termed it but that is not what they determined. They determined that he did it and they knew he did it and they knew he was lying about it. But Wells had just used a legal definition and standard so that they didn't have to come out and say "We know you did this." In retrospect it wasn't strong enough. But the league did not in any way believe that he just had a general knowledge of it. Otherwise there would not have been the severe penalty. And the conclusions that Wells laid out in his report would not have come out that way. They knew he did it and was the ringleader.
NoSaint Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 One of the many mistakes the league made, although I'm not sure you can fault them for it, is the "generally aware" of wording. That is what they termed it but that is not what they determined. They determined that he did it and they knew he did it and they knew he was lying about it. But Wells had just used a legal definition and standard so that they didn't have to come out and say "We know you did this." In retrospect it wasn't strong enough. But the league did not in any way believe that he just had a general knowledge of it. Otherwise there would not have been the severe penalty. And the conclusions that Wells laid out in his report would not have come out that way. They knew he did it and was the ringleader. Clearly they either felt less confident than you that they proved that, or they thought their power stretched further than others agree -- that phrasing is certainly one of the most intentional pieces of any of the documents they've released
PlayoffsPlease Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Next step, the NFL takes this to appeal. He may have wished he accepted two games and be done with it. Now if overturned to the suspension it will be towards the end of the season when it counts. Unlikely to get a date on the appeals calendar that is earlier than the end of this season. This is not a federal emergency.
Direhard Fan Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Roger has to go. Why didn't they get the equipment men in the court? Why did NE fire them if they didn't so anything?. Why hasn't ESPN gotten the Equipment men on TV. We are going to see the same Brady this year. Protected and crying all the way to the bank. Sad- very sad. Resign Roger.
PlayoffsPlease Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 @nflcommish makes a statement on Brady’s suspension being nullified. He respectfully disagrees Roger needs to let it go. As a taxpayer I am a bit pissed off about anymore tax dollars being used to litigate a soft football.
Kelly the Dog Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Mario should have a ballboy steal all the balls before the Pats game and stick a tiny chip in them, then Mario could employ and hide a sharpshooter at the Ralph with an air rifle, and every pass that Brady throws over ten yards the sniper will just shoot it out of the sky with help from the GPS chip. They really can't fault Mario or punish him for it because they didn't ever establish that there is a punishment for hiring snipers to blow the balls out of the sky before. Clearly they either felt less confident than you that they proved that, or they thought their power stretched further than others agree -- that phrasing is certainly one of the most intentional pieces of any of the documents they've released I think they surely felt that they had the power. It wasn't a confidence factor. The litany of problems that Wells had with the entire thing and everything he meticulously laid out made it very clear what they thought.
Tuco Posted September 3, 2015 Posted September 3, 2015 Next step, the NFL takes this to appeal. He may have wished he accepted two games and be done with it. Now if overturned to the suspension it will be towards the end of the season when it counts. I'd be surprised. The appellate court will not be so accommodating as to issue a ruling based on any deadlines. More likely Brady will be retired and remarried by the time it gets resolved now.
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