Rex is torn TT or Cassel

[Hapless Bills Fan]

because they believe in Jerry S. Whose story aligns with theirs.

 

I'll repost the link

http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/08/30/no-smoke-from-bills-on-qb-choice/

As I’ve(JS) said before, Taylor’s rise was largely due to his modest competition, Cassel and EJ Manuel. That doesn’t mean he can’t succeed, that he wouldn’t seize the moment and turn into a solid NFL starter.

 

Ryan pushed to get Taylor. Maybe others are trying to persuade him. I’m told that offensive coordinator Greg Roman believed that Cassel was best-suited to run his offense.

 

Dude, could you be so kind as to note when it's a Sully link? (the parenthetical (JS) was too subtle for a dumb grunt like me)

Edited August 31, 2015 by Hopeful

[Dibs]

And you somehow think that this is impossible to do with Taylor? No screens, no slants, no jet sweeps, no putting Clay at LT while using 6 linemen, and having Clay be hot read off the play action?

It's like we've barely been looking at G-Ro's tape.

Slow down there. I haven't even commented on the individual QBs, let alone made some sort of stupid remark about what I think one or the other can or can't do.

[BuffaloHokie13]

So scoring less points is the best tactic for winning games. Got it.

You do realize that this preseason EJ has led us to 5 more points than Tyrod, with 4 extra possessions to do so, right? And 7 of EJ's points came from a 3 play drive involving 0 passing plays. But please, keep getting caught up in the more points argument.

[Dibs]

You do realize that this preseason EJ has led us to 5 more points than Tyrod, with 4 extra possessions to do so, right? And 7 of EJ's points came from a 3 play drive involving 0 passing plays. But please, keep getting caught up in the more points argument.

What has that got to do with the point I was making?

[Iraq Vet]

With some of these comments lately... sometimes I wonder if a few Bills players are on these message boards. Just a random thought.

Edited August 31, 2015 by Iraq Vet

[BuffaloHokie13]

What has that got to do with the point I was making?

Your point seemed to be that the long sustained drives somehow lead to less points, and subsequently less wins. I was pointing out that even with EJ's big deep ball plays, he hasn't outscored Tyrod by much despite additional attempts. If that's completely off base then my bad, I'm just getting caught up with this topic and your comment stood out.

Edited August 31, 2015 by BuffaloHokie13

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

I think you guys are taking me a bit out of context. If Fred Jackson scampers off to a long running touchdown I am sure as hell not going to ask that he walk it 20 yards back. But do you think that we are going to win in a high speed slug out with some of the more offensively minded teams? As better I feel about our quarterback situation than I did at the beginning of the offseason I still think that our best option is a control game. We have the home run playmakers who can take small short plays and turn them into big gains. That doesn't necessarily making deep throws down the field. I'll take an efficient offense moving off and that grinds the opponents down so that their dog tired later in the game.

 

Again let's go over what Rex said when he was first hired. We are going to ground and pound. Ground and pound. Ground and pound. We will run it 50 times a game if we can. Every minute we have the offense in possession is our opponents nor scoring. A long drive for points early that's awesome well in the fourth quarter. That is my biggest objection to Cassel. cassel can sustain drives but so far he hasn't scored any points.

 

What I can't figure out is why you seem to feel deep-strike or big-play potential from a QB takes away the ability to run a ground and pound control game?

[eball]

 

What I can't figure out is why you seem to feel deep-strike or big-play potential from a QB takes away the ability to run a ground and pound control game?

 

It seems that way, right? Actually, the sort of offense WWP is promoting reminds me of what Jauron used to try to do when the Bills had a bad defense in order to keep games close!

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

I never thought I'd be coming down on FireChan's side here, but yeah, what I've been saying is the Seahawk model. It was also the 49ers model. And "heavy run game and strong defense with a streaky QB" was the Giants and Ravens model.

 

Last year, I would have killed for a 92% completion rate, 9.4 YPA QB performance.

But not a 87.5% completion rate, and 21.3 YPA QB performance. If it were me, I would take the latter.

[FireChan]

I never thought I'd be coming down on FireChan's side here, but yeah, what I've been saying is the Seahawk model. It was also the 49ers model. And "heavy run game and strong defense with a streaky QB" was the Giants and Ravens model.

 

Last year, I would have killed for a 92% completion rate, 9.4 YPA QB performance.

Join me! Next debate is why CJ Spiller is the worst.

But not a 87.5% completion rate, and 21.3 YPA QB performance. If it were me, I would take the latter.

That's not sustainable, and clearly an outlier.

[Dibs]

Your point seemed to be that the long sustained drives somehow lead to less points, and subsequently less wins. I was pointing out that even with EJ's big deep ball plays, he hasn't outscored Tyrod by much despite additional attempts. If that's completely off base then my bad, I'm just getting caught up with this topic and your comment stood out.

 

My point was in direct response to Whitewalker saying that scoring on the deep pass is bad because the D has to come straight back out and defend against good QBs....and that he would prefer a longer drive that scored less(see post #403 & what I was responding to).

 

That concept is spurious logic. Aside from the obvious, if this were a legitimate concept then we should want all kickoffs to be touchbacks and all punt returns to be fair caught for fear of scoring or getting good field position which would put our D back out on the field etc.

[Fan in Chicago]

And funnily enough, he hired an OC who over the last few years had a 55-60% run play percentage. Not as skewed as we'd think but the Niners philosophy was absolutely based around the run.

 

And you're acting as if McCoy is CJ. Yes, he dances a bit, but he's been used effectively by Reid with a fullback. Plus Karlos, plus Freddy, plus Boobie.

 

We are built right now with a great stable of runners (when healthy) and players known for getting GREAT YAC. I heard relying on that was the plan all offseason. It's a good plan. It can work. I don't understand the sudden desire to throw it away because we had one great preseason game.

With the kind of horses we have in our stable, Roman would be foolish to adhere to a particular philosophy ('ground and pound') at the expense of another (exploit all areas of the field agressively). In SF, Roman had a few but not the total list of toys he now has at his disposal. With McCoy, Clay, Watkins, Woods and Goodwin, it would be an utter waste to commit to a ball control, run the clock philosophy exclusively. We are not built to be coy on offense and the QB's range should not be the limiting factor in the decision.

 

It seems that way, right? Actually, the sort of offense WWP is promoting reminds me of what Jauron used to try to do when the Bills had a bad defense in order to keep games close!

Precisely. There is no reason to hope and wish for a passive offense when you have a potential top-5 defense

[BuffaloHokie13]

 

My point was in direct response to Whitewalker saying that scoring on the deep pass is bad because the D has to come straight back out and defend against good QBs....and that he would prefer a longer drive that scored less(see post #403 & what I was responding to).

 

That concept is spurious logic. Aside from the obvious, if this were a legitimate concept then we should want all kickoffs to be touchbacks and all punt returns to be fair caught for fear of scoring or getting good field position which would put our D back out on the field etc.

Ah, fair enough. I definitely think the deep ball has a nice place in the offense we're building. I just expect it to be a wildcard, not a method to maintaining drives. I do think our best shot against Indy will be to keep Luck off the field as much as possible though.

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

OH SWEET BUTTERY CRAP, WILL YOU STOP TWISTING MY WORDS.

 

*deep breath*

 

I am not against the deep ball. I am against stalling out drives. As such, I support the QB who has done the best and most consistent drive management. Taylor has done so using the run game, his legs, and decent short to intermediate passes.

 

And there is NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.

 

Deep strikes are great, but if that ability comes with QB play which occasionally takes the risky play, and you start seeing three and outs/turnover risks you have to balance the risk and reward. You aren't wasting talent if you don't constantly go deep. You are if you load up on stalled drives and leave your D hanging.

 

Edit: Regarding "longer drives which score fewer points had one caveat: Early in the game. Beating teams down early helps if you need to speed it up in the fourth.

Edited August 31, 2015 by WhitewalkerInPhilly

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

 

That's not sustainable, and clearly an outlier.

What you have to understand is, so is the 9.4 ypa. The most any team averaged last year was 8.0(Dallas).

[TH3]

I have connections who have a neighbor who is inside OBD - always tight mouthed - but said the real issue is they really can only keep 2 of the three - they don't want/have space for 3 qb's out of the 53....

[FireChan]

What you have to understand is, so is the 9.4 ypa. The most any team averaged last year was 8.0(Dallas).

That's true, but 21.3 is gonna drop by at least 150%. It's much more of an outlier.

[ALF]

Will he gamble or play it safe , we will see.

[Dibs]

OH SWEET BUTTERY CRAP, WILL YOU STOP TWISTING MY WORDS.

 

*deep breath*

 

I am not against the deep ball. I am against stalling out drives. As such, I support the QB who has done the best and most consistent drive management. Taylor has done so using the run game, his legs, and decent short to intermediate passes.

 

And there is NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.

 

Deep strikes are great, but if that ability comes with QB play which occasionally takes the risky play, and you start seeing three and outs/turnover risks you have to balance the risk and reward. You aren't wasting talent if you don't constantly go deep. You are if you load up on stalled drives and leave your D hanging.

 

Edit: Regarding "longer drives which score fewer points had one caveat: Early in the game. Beating teams down early helps if you need to speed it up in the fourth.

 

I see by your "edit" that you realize that I wasn't twisting your words. The logic in your original post is still spurious though.

I have connections who have a neighbor who is inside OBD - always tight mouthed - but said the real issue is they really can only keep 2 of the three - they don't want/have space for 3 qb's out of the 53....

 

That's actually proper news. Those neighbors of your connections are not as tight mouthed as they might think they are.

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

 

I see by your "edit" that you realize that I wasn't twisting your words. The logic in your original post is still spurious though.

I stand by that, if you are playing a high output offense like Brady, or the Eagles the way you beat them is to keep them off the field. You gobble up time, you get their defense on the field as break them down while keeping ours fresh. You don't get that trying because 1 out of three times you're able to connect on a deep throw.