Maury Ballstein Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Joe Webb is not a passer. Anyone who watches football knows this. Pretty terrible comp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 And Matt Simms had a killer quarter against Pittsburg too. What's your point? LOL...thanks for proving my point. You EJ haters really do seem like such a sad and pathetic bunch. Putting some extra mustard on that EJ hate when the Bills starting QB has had no NFL starts or TD passes ever? Talk about creating some bad vibes before the big opener. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 who brought this out of the dust bin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 LOL...thanks for proving my point. You EJ haters really do seem like such a sad and pathetic bunch. Putting some extra mustard on that EJ hate when the Bills starting QB has had no NFL starts or TD passes ever? Talk about creating some bad vibes before the big opener. Then I guess the entire Bills coaching staff are EJ haters because he's third string? Or maybe they know a bit more than you do in making their decision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 LOL...thanks for proving my point. You EJ haters really do seem like such a sad and pathetic bunch. Putting some extra mustard on that EJ hate when the Bills starting QB has had no NFL starts or TD passes ever? Talk about creating some bad vibes before the big opener. Slow down Billy. Nobody on this board made EJ #3 in the depth charts - our coaching staff did. It's a reality. You know what comes after #3 in depth chart right? UFA. Bills > any single player. El fin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Pot meet Kettle. My crusade is not me saying EJM will succeed rather he has the tools to be good if developed properly. Which is far better than the crusade saying he never will be any good. The argument against EJ good sir if the same argument the "realists" are not using against TT. ie lack of experience. As is the example that EJM is 3rd string after 3 seasons where as TT was 2nd after 4 seasons in Baltimore. Q. - How many QBs does Balto carry? A. - Two. 5 Flacco, Joe QB 6-6 245 30 8 Delaware 8 Schaub, Matt QB 6-6 245 34 12 Virginia Kind of impossible to be #3 when you only carry 2. Not really. I predicted months ago and again recently that they would start EJ week 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Who Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Hopefully Taylor plays lights out and stays healthy. If he struggles a lot or gets injured, I think EJ will leapfrog Cassel and become the starter. Cassel is the mentor, come in in the middle of the game if the starter is injured figure. I surmise there is something ambiguous about the 2/3. If it plays out differently, so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Hopefully Taylor plays lights out and stays healthy. If he struggles a lot or gets injured, I think EJ will leapfrog Cassel and become the starter. Cassel is the mentor, come in in the middle of the game if the starter is injured figure. I surmise there is something ambiguous about the 2/3. If it plays out differently, so be it. I think you are right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Hopefully Taylor plays lights out and stays healthy. If he struggles a lot or gets injured, I think EJ will leapfrog Cassel and become the starter. Cassel is the mentor, come in in the middle of the game if the starter is injured figure. I surmise there is something ambiguous about the 2/3. If it plays out differently, so be it. For sure. Make the backup QB situation irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Slow down Billy. Nobody on this board made EJ #3 in the depth charts - our coaching staff did. It's a reality. You know what comes after #3 in depth chart right? UFA. Bills > any single player. El fin. Were you one of those obnoxious type of Bills fans during the Kelly/Superbowl years? You are right, EJ Manuel is officially listed as the third string QB on the Bills roster. Good boy Spike, do you want a treat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 LOL...thanks for proving my point. You EJ haters really do seem like such a sad and pathetic bunch. Putting some extra mustard on that EJ hate when the Bills starting QB has had no NFL starts or TD passes ever? Talk about creating some bad vibes before the big opener. You might want to look in the mirror. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 You might want to look in the mirror. I'm rooting for Tyrod Taylor to have a great game and career for the Bills. I'm not one of the fans who are so filled with hate for EJ Manuel that they feel the need to continue to trash him. You guys have issues man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JESSEFEFFER Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 All this began when the speculation about the preseason game 3 starter was ramping up. WGR hosts felt the need to trash EJ when callers suggested that it should be EJ, mostly in the name of a fair competition but also in an acknowledgement of how well EJ had showed in the prior outings. Wanted tp justify that it wouldn't happen since game 3 was so important to the #1 QB. Schopp got really annoyed with this and gave his "He's horrilble (terrible?)" X3 line. He then asked for someone to explain why EJ was getting so much support, I e-mailed this to him: Mike, You're an analytics proponent so here is an analytical case. I would assume that you are familiar with the concept of "quality start" for pitchers. Three or less earned runs and seven or more innings pitched. The idea being that the pitcher has given his team a decent chance to win. Well, apply this type of measure to NFL QBs. What to use as the criteria? I particlarly do not favor the NFL's passer rating as a comprehensive measure. It does not consider sacks, fumbles, rush yards gained nor the game context of when the stats it does track are acquired. I do favor ESPN's tQBR which was developed by Football Outsiders as a comprehensive measure of QB play. I am sure it has its flaws as any measure would have that tries to isolate a QB's play from that of the rest of the offense. The tQBR scale is 0 to 100 with 50 being midscale. I think it's fair to say this would also be a fair measure of a QB performance that gives his team a chance to win. In EJ's 14 starts, he hit 50+ 8 times. The Bills were 5 and 3 in those games with the 3 losses coming against NE (the SJ drop you mentioned earlier) Cle (EJ's 3rd quarter injury and all the bad things that happened after he left) and Atlanta (4th quarter and OT fumbles by SJ and Chandler.) This tells me that the 50+ measure is fair in that EJ played decently enough to give his team a chance but other factors made the result a loss. What is 8 of 14 as a measure? What does it say? Here are how some others stack up. Kyle Orton was 4 of 12 in 2014. This is the guy that was giving the Bills the best chance to win? Joe Flacco was 6 of 16 his rookie year and 9 of 16 in 2013, the year after the Super Bowl win. He starts 16 games every year so credit the Bills for identifying Tyrod Taylor as someone that could be a great QB candidate without much direct evidence. Matt Cassel is 6 of 18 in his last 3 years. As you said today, this is not compatible with "game manager." He would have to play much better to earn that title. I think "game manager" is the title he gets when projecting him as a successful QB in this offense. If they decide to start him, "game manager" is the hoped for outcome. I do not think it's racial. It's the best we could hope for from him. Geno Smith is 8 of 30 for his career. He and EJ have not had similar careers to date. Ryan Tannehill had 8, 8 and 7 of 16, respectively, in his 3 years although he has seen an improvement in that he has had fewer "crappy games." Derek Carr was 7 of 16 in 2014. Blake Bortles was 4 of 14 in 2014. Eli Manning was 9 of 16 in 2007, his 4th NFL season, with 3 games at <10. In 2013, he was 5 of 16. In 2014, Aaron Rodgers was 13 of 16 with 2 other games in the 40's and one other, against the Bills, at 12.4. So, what to think of EJ? I think he has played decently in more games than most would think. His last two games were disastrous but they were heavily influenced by 1) 30+ mph winds and poor protection and 2) extremely poor protection and JJ Watt. In that last game, EJ took 18 hits but only 2 sacks which is an odd, 9:1 ratio. The WRs were credited with 5 drops and the coaching staff called pass to run plays at an inexplicable 2:1 ratio. Even with all that, EJ had the Bills driving to get the lead when a gutless, PI nocall on Robert Woods (that's my opinion, but check it out--it was PI that lasted over 15 yards and probably for 2+ seconds) that lead to the int that sealed the loss. It's these last two games that have most heavily weighed in on how most percoieve EJ. Fans remember them quite well but back-to-back poor games are not uncommon, especially for QBs earlier in their careers. It's not the norm for a HC to bench them for a 4 of 12 talent like Kyle Orton. I see him as a guy that was considered a decent QB prospect that needed development. Give him Nate Hackett as his QB coach his rookie year, sign Kevin Kolb to be the template, mentor QB but see him get concussed out of the NFL in preseason, have him suffer 3 separate knee injuries which forced him to miss 6+ weeks of game prep practice, set him up behind an unsettled, deteriorating o-line which offered particularly poor protection up-the-middle and then ask him to play well with JJ Watt in his face and at his knees. With all these bad circumstances, EJ still managed to be 8 of 14 for "quality starts" in his brief career. A 6 and 8 career record which is really 6 and 7 when you consider that he did not finish the game in Cle (a baseball pitcher does not get credit for a loss like that.) A career 7 and 6 record if either of his teammates protected the ball from trailing defenders. When did patience become so obsolete? How many other QBs took 3 or 4 years in the league to show some progress toward the upper echelons of NFL QBs? This is actually the norm with a few notable exceptions. None of this says he has to start. It all says that he is worth keeping on the roster should they need to go 3 deep like they did in 2013. Retaining him while on his rookie contract to see if he will continue the improvement he has shown this preseason seems prudent. And maybe it says that it would be worth it to give him a chance in game action with the starting group. Regards, I never heard back from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Not really. I predicted months ago and again recently that they would start EJ week 1. my apologies for mis remembering Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Just wondering if anyone heard Schopp say today that he wishes guys who drive recklessly would just crash into a tree and kill themselves, regarding Dareus. He cited overpopulation as a justification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Grundy Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Just wondering if anyone heard Schopp say today that he wishes guys who drive recklessly would just crash into a tree and kill themselves, regarding Dareus. He cited overpopulation as a justification. I can't even respond to this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Just wondering if anyone heard Schopp say today that he wishes guys who drive recklessly would just crash into a tree and kill themselves, regarding Dareus. He cited overpopulation as a justification. I could not believe what I was hearing, at least bulldog had enough sense to disagree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 (edited) I could not believe what I was hearing, at least bulldog had enough sense to disagree schopp - "Do you ever think that?" Bulldog -" Umm.. no, I don't hope he dies. I just hope the police see him." Schopp - "Oh." Edited September 10, 2015 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Just wondering if anyone heard Schopp say today that he wishes guys who drive recklessly would just crash into a tree and kill themselves, regarding Dareus. He cited overpopulation as a justification. Not only that but he didn't have the good sense to pump the brakes when it got weird. He doubled down instead and rolled with it. Maybe to make it seem like he didn't just step in it? Today was a bad day on the sports radio for me. I spent the 2:30-3:00 hour listening to Maurice Jones Drew on Sirius NFL Radio incoherently ramble on about how Kurt Warner, Andrew Luck and Peyton Manning were only good QBs because of the players around them and that Bryan Hoyer was a Super Bowl QB with those same weapons. Then I switch it over to WGR and Schopp is talking about how we wishes death on people who drive like idiots. I gave up and listened to a Bear Hands CD! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted September 10, 2015 Share Posted September 10, 2015 Not only that but he didn't have the good sense to pump the brakes when it got weird. He doubled down instead and rolled with it. Maybe to make it seem like he didn't just step in it? Today was a bad day on the sports radio for me. I spent the 2:30-3:00 hour listening to Maurice Jones Drew on Sirius NFL Radio incoherently ramble on about how Kurt Warner, Andrew Luck and Peyton Manning were only good QBs because of the players around them and that Bryan Hoyer was a Super Bowl QB with those same weapons. Then I switch it over to WGR and Schopp is talking about how we wishes death on people who drive like idiots. I gave up and listened to a Bear Hands CD! i kept waiting for the backtrack "oh I was just kidding!" But it never came. I was driving while listening and just shook my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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