B/R Report: Rex wants to start Tyrod, other coaches split

[metzelaars_lives]

Yep. But I was adding in the scrimmage, in addition, where EJ led the offense to more point in that one, too.

Alright enough with the scrimmage already. A few short days after the scrimmage, John Murphy, who is the biggest EJ homer of them all, said "the other two guys seem to be really progressing and learning the offense and I'm just not seeing that with EJ." So you can cherry pick a practice here or there but by and large, everyone knows that EJ Manuel was third before the Carolina game and has not done enough to move up the ladder as of yet. Maybe he will on Saturday. I will be in Yellowstone, you'll have to tell me all about it.

Edited August 24, 2015 by metzelaars_lives

[LeGOATski]

Yeah, John Murphy seems like a Tyrod Taylor homer now...

[VABills]

Yep. But I was adding in the scrimmage, in addition, where EJ led the offense to more point in that one, too.

But he didn't lead to more against Carolina.

 

Note he also fumbled in both preseason's as well as the scrimmage.

[Prickly Pete]

 

I’m not sure why Pete (metzelaars_lives) is having to defend his post(s)?

 

I predicted and hoped EJ would be the starter this year, so I suppose that makes me an EJ "fanboy". EJ is developing, but unfortunately IMO he's still a step behind TT and Cassel. It's also pretty clear that Cassel is their most known commodity and maybe the most consistent. Why wouldn't Roman want that as an OC? TT seems to have the most upside, because he can make something out of nothing.

Ultimately, none of these QB’s are the total package or we wouldn’t be having a competition or this debate.

Pick your favorite (and yes, Roman gets to have one) and argue all you want, but let's be grateful that we have coaches who are allowing these average QB's to be successful. The winning 2 pt. conversion the other night was a thing of beauty and that wasn’t EJ – it was Roman.

 

 

Ha, now when a QB completes a pass, it's the OC?

 

I certainly understand why the coaches would want the most consistent QB...it's safe. The thing is, the safe, consistent guy, often isn't the guy that can inspire their teammates, and create a belief that they can comeback from a 2 score deficit, or 2-minute drives... pressure situations.

 

Cassel better be the most consistent, because they will be inching down the field against a stacked box, and will need to convert on 3rd down more often. It's going to take lots of good game management decisions from the coaching staff to keep things going if they dink and dunk...not a Rex Ryan strength (Roman will be running the offense, but the HC gets involved).

 

I'm not going to claim that EJM or TT are great inspirational leaders, but I think they are growing. Cassel's established track record is, well....meh. I dread watching them try to come back from a two score deficit. Cassel just doesn't have the the firepower to do that "consistently".

Edited August 24, 2015 by HoF Watkins

[NickelCity]

 

Ha, now when a QB completes a pass, it's the OC?

 

I certainly understand why the coaches would want the most consistent QB...it's safe. The thing is, the safe, consistent guy, often isn't the guy that can inspire their teammates, and create a belief that they can comeback from a 2 score deficit, or 2-minute drives... pressure situations.

 

Cassel better be the most consistent, because they will be inching down the field against a stacked box, and will need to convert on 3rd down more often. It's going to take lots of good game management decisions from the coaching staff to keep things going if they dink and dunk...not a Rex Ryan strength (Roman will be running the offense, but the HC gets involved).

 

I'm not going to claim that EJM or TT are great inspirational leaders, but I think they are growing. Cassels established track record is, well....meh. I dread watching them try to come back from a two score deficit. Cassel just doesn't have the the firepower to do that "consistently".

 

The small sample of players I've chatted with indicated taylor has a lot of support from players, and this was before the first preseason game (so who knows what has happened since). However, it was a small sample, and I can't be confident their opinions truly represent the team. I also wasn't asking them specifically about the QB comp, they just mentioned it. They were defensive players too. Pittsburgh game will be plenty interesting. I'll be up in the mountains though oddly enough like metz, so I'll have to rely on reports.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

according to ESPN game stats

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=400791738

 

T. Taylor was credited 0 passing TD's and 0 rushing TD's and left the game leading the team to 2 scores of 14 pts and a RTG of 79.7

EJ Manuel was credited 1 passing TD's and 0 rushing TD's and left the game leading the team to 2 scores of 10 pts and a RTG of 123.4

Alright enough with the scrimmage already. A few short days after the scrimmage, John Murphy, who is the biggest EJ homer of them all, said "the other two guys seem to be really progressing and learning the offense and I'm just not seeing that with EJ." So you can cherry pick a practice here or there but by and large, everyone knows that EJ Manuel was third before the Carolina game and has not done enough to move up the ladder as of yet. Maybe he will on Saturday. I will be in Yellowstone, you'll have to tell me all about it.

so the scrimmage doesn't count in team performances?

Thanks for the clarification.

Edited August 24, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever

[Kelly the Dog]

Alright enough with the scrimmage already. A few short days after the scrimmage, John Murphy, who is the biggest EJ homer of them all, said "the other two guys seem to be really progressing and learning the offense and I'm just not seeing that with EJ." So you can cherry pick a practice here or there but by and large, everyone knows that EJ Manuel was third before the Carolina game and has not done enough to move up the ladder as of yet. Maybe he will on Saturday. I will be in Yellowstone, you'll have to tell me all about it.

 

Rex said before the scrimmage that the scrimmage was an important day in their evaluation. He also stated that the reason Cassel was given the start in the Car game and TT in the Browns game was that EJ got the start in the scrimmage. Personally, I think they did that on purpose so it would appear that EJ was given a fair shot. But that is a fact. He started with the ones. And he did better than both the other guys. I stated it for clarity sake anyway, I think TT should start and if he doesn't then Cassel.

[Prickly Pete]

 

The small sample of players I've chatted with indicated taylor has a lot of support from players, and this was before the first preseason game (so who knows what has happened since). However, it was a small sample, and I can't be confident their opinions truly represent the team. I also wasn't asking them specifically about the QB comp, they just mentioned it. They were defensive players too. Pittsburgh game will be plenty interesting. I'll be up in the mountains though oddly enough like metz, so I'll have to rely on reports.

 

That's the other angle I didn't mention. Having an inspiring QB pushes the defense too, because they feel they can comeback. Beyond basic competence, the leadership is the most important aspect. I'm hoping for Tyrod at this point, because EJM seems out of the race. I just don't think Tyrod can make it through a complete season without injury, and want to see EJM as the #2.

[metzelaars_lives]

according to ESPN game stats

 

http://espn.go.com/nfl/boxscore?gameId=400791738

 

T. Taylor was credited 0 passing TD's and 0 rushing TD's and left the game leading the team to 2 scores of 14 pts and a QBR of 79.7

EJ Manuel was credited 1 passing TD's and 0 rushing TD's and left the game leading the team to 2 scores of 10 pts and a QBR of 123.4

so the scrimmage doesn't count in team performances?

Thanks for the clarification.

1. Of course you won't respond to my last post where I laid out your greatest hits.

 

2. You obviously don't know the difference between passer rating and QBR.

 

3. What was Cassel's passer rating (not QBR) in the game against Carolina? Nobody cares about passer rating in tiny little preseason snippets. It doesn't matter.

 

4. No, the scrimmage counted. He made a throw or two, everyone agreed he was the best of the three in limited action. I never denied that. I said DESPITE that, John Murphy made those comments AFTER the scrimmage. Wait, are you in denial that EJ is third in this QB battle? I had a bad case of loser denial myself- until the lacrosse team shoved a parking cone up my ass.

Edited August 24, 2015 by metzelaars_lives

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

1. Of course you won't respond to my last post where I laid out your greatest hits.

 

2. You obviously don't know the difference between passer rating and QBR.

 

3. What was Cassel's passer rating (not QBR) in the game against Carolina? Nobody cares about passer rating in tiny little preseason snippets. It doesn't matter.

 

4. No, the scrimmage counted. He made a throw or two, everyone agreed he was the best of the three in limited action. I never denied that. I said DESPITE that, John Murphy made those comments AFTER the scrimmage. Wait, are you in denial that EJ is third in this QB battle? I had a bad case of loser denial myself- until the lacrosse team shoved a parking cone up my ass.

I'm just an idiot fan who posted stats. If I got them wrong via ESPN then my bad.

 

I corrected my mistake

T. Taylor led the team to 2 scores , 0 TD (per stats) totaling 14 pts with a passer RTG of 79.7

EJ Manuel led the team to 2 scores 1 TD (per stats) totaling 10 pts with a passer of RTG of 123.4

 

also my apologies for missing / not replying to your post

sorry, but when people say "despite that" it leads others to think you are ignoring what has transpired, good, bad or indifferent when that omission can be part of the big decision.

Edited August 24, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever

[metzelaars_lives]

God how I wish the EJ guys were listening to Sal on the John Murphy show right now. Him and the guy from Bills Digest are really laying it out for you. Someone tell me they're listening right now?

[JohnC]

God how I wish the EJ guys were listening to Sal on the John Murphy show right now. Him and the guy from Bills Digest are really laying it out for you. Someone tell me they're listening right now?

I don't recall one media person (radio, newspaper or TV) who covers the Bills and watch most of the practices, scrimmages and games who doesn't believe that EJ is the third qb on the roster. Everyone makes the same critical observations that he is inconsistent with his accuracy and performance in general.

 

The consensus is so overwhelming that there is little room to disagree with the assessment about him. It's obvious that the coaching staff has made the same assessment because they have a stake in making the right judgment on who is going to start.

 

At first I was leaning toward Cassel because I thought it was the safest way to go. But after watching TT I prefer him as the starter. Whether the staff selects Cassel or TT at least I would understand their rationale.

Edited August 25, 2015 by JohnC

[Kelly the Dog]

I don't recall one media person (radio, newspaper or TV) who covers the Bills and watch most of the practices, scrimmages and games who doesn't believe that EJ is the third qb on the roster. Everyone makes the same critical observations that he is inconsistent with his accuracy and performance in general.

 

The consensus is so overwhelming that there is little room to disagree with the assessment about him. It's obvious that the coaching staff has made the same assessment because they have a stake in making the right judgment on who is going to start.

 

And yet now they are giving him more reps with the ones and a greater chance this week than last week, so what does that tell you.

[metzelaars_lives]

I don't recall one media person (radio, newspaper or TV) who covers the Bills and watch most of the practices, scrimmages and games who doesn't believe that EJ is the third qb on the roster. Everyone makes the same critical observations that he is inconsistent with his accuracy and performance in general.

 

The consensus is so overwhelming that there is little room to disagree with the assessment about him. It's obvious that the coaching staff has made the same assessment because they have a stake in making the right judgment on who is going to start.

 

At first I was leaning toward Cassel because I thought it was the safest way to go. But after watching TT I prefer him as the starter. Whether the staff selects Cassel or TT at least I would understand their rationale.

That's what people don't understand. Everyone's all, "well he looked decent in the two preseason games." But Sal and the other guy acknowledged that he looked decent in the two preseason games but said that unfortunately, he dug too big a hole for himself during camp. They both said that they and every single last person they've spoken with has EJ third. Not just that the coaches have him third on the depth chart, but that he was visibly the third best QB throughout camp to anyone who was paying any attention. They also said that unless something totally unforeseen takes place that there's no chance of him starting opening day. That is reality folks. Now, back to fantasy land...

Edited August 25, 2015 by metzelaars_lives

[Doc]

God how I wish the EJ guys were listening to Sal on the John Murphy show right now. Him and the guy from Bills Digest are really laying it out for you. Someone tell me they're listening right now?

What is he saying? That EJ isn't consistent? Is TT? It's not like every throw from him in the pre-season games has been on-target.

[JohnC]

And yet now they are giving him more reps with the ones and a greater chance this week than last week, so what does that tell you.

What it indicates to me is that they want to make a decision on whether it is worth keeping him on the roster and investing in his development. The staff knows what Cassel is capable of. He is what he is without being worried about what he can do.

 

From what little I have seen of TT it is apparent (to me) he is much more advanced as a qb than EJ is. Even if EJ is given more time with the starters in practice that doesn't mean that he is moving up the ranks. At least that is how I see it at this time.

 

I would rather have TT start and have Cassel as a backup. Cassel's game can be categorized as being very cautious and limited. If that is the case then why not start TT who has more upside. The coaches can tone down his game to limit his mistakes. Although TT is relatively inexperienced he is a smart player who has tools to make plays. Cassel would make an excellent mentor and reasonable backup.

What is he saying? That EJ isn't consistent? Is TT? It's not like every throw from him in the pre-season games has been on-target.

TT stats in preseason are deceptive. The numbers are not overwhelming because the body of work is so limited. But even with an abreviated amount of playing time it is apparent that he has a good arm and throws a nice ball. He has a tendency to rely on his legs too quickly but in general his pocket presence is good. In my opinion if you are going to gamble on a qb then why not gamble on a qb who has some impressive physical skills and a versatility in his game.

 

TT is not being handed a starting job. He is winning the job against the qbs he is competing against. And that is how it should be done.

[Doc]

TT stats in preseason are deceptive. The numbers are not overwhelming because the body of work is so limited. But even with an abreviated amount of playing time it is apparent that he has a good arm and throws a nice ball. He has a tendency to rely on his legs too quickly but in general his pocket presence is good. In my opinion if you are going to gamble on a qb then why not gamble on a qb who has some impressive physical skills and a versatility in his game.

 

TT is not being handed a starting job. He is winning the job against the qbs he is competing against. And that is how it should be done.

I think TT has played well, better than I thought he would. And I was ready to roll with him since he was getting a lot of time with the starters and offers the threat of the run, and I don't see the point in starting Cassel. But EJ getting time with the starters changes things a bit. My point is that TT hasn't played perfectly either and EJ's 1st round pick is being used against him to point out his flaws and gloss over TT's.

[JohnC]

I think TT has played well, better than I thought he would. And I was ready to roll with him since he was getting a lot of time with the starters and offers the threat of the run, and I don't see the point in starting Cassel. But EJ getting time with the starters changes things a bit. My point is that TT hasn't played perfectly either and EJ's 1st round pick is being used against him to point out his flaws and gloss over TT's.

Maybe with respect to EJ's development it might be in his interest to sit and learn. Too much was expected out of him too quickly because he was a first round pick. The reality is that he never should have been a first round pick. At best he should have been a third round pick who was a developmental prospect.

 

From what little I have seen of TT what has impressed me the most is his ability to throw. He has an excellent throwing motion and he throws a nice ball. His accuracy level is immensely better than EJ's regardless what the stats might indicate.

 

My feeling is if you are going to be wrong on a qb then be wrong with the qb who exhibits the most talent and potential. If it doesn't work out then go to the next option.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

Maybe with respect to EJ's development it might be in his interest to sit and learn. Too much was expected out of him too quickly because he was a first round pick. The reality is that he never should have been a first round pick. At best he should have been a third round pick who was a developmental prospect.

 

From what little I have seen of TT what has impressed me the most is his ability to throw. He has an excellent throwing motion and he throws a nice ball. His accuracy level is immensely better than EJ's regardless what the stats might indicate.

 

My feeling is if you are going to be wrong on a qb then be wrong with the qb who exhibits the most talent and potential. If it doesn't work out then go to the next option.

I love this! People talk about the risk of playing TT and I don't get it. Cassel is a backup QB. He is a guy you can win with for a couple weeks when the starter is out at this point in his career.

[BuffaloMatt]

Sometimes you have to go with your gut. My gut says Tyrod "Drill Bit" Taylor.