BuffaninATL Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 With Harvin a question mark it might open up the door for Thigpen who's been good at returning kicks his preseason. So it could be Watkins, Woods, Harvin, Thompson, Thigpen, Easley* I'm not sure though if Easley makes it as he's been hurt this preseason and Andre Davis is making a case to make the squad too. I'd like to see Thigpen retained as a KR/PR exclusively so as not to get caught up in the WR numbers. I'd like to see us also potentially swing a trade to a team to a team who has a need at WR for us to get something back in a position of need.
MDH Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 I'd like to see Thigpen retained as a KR/PR exclusively so as not to get caught up in the WR numbers. I'd like to see us also potentially swing a trade to a team to a team who has a need at WR for us to get something back in a position of need. Bills have too much talent to keep a guy who only does KR/PR. Particularly when they have a lot of other guys who are also very good returners.
Kirby Jackson Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 I'm trying so hard to avoid the inevitable "I told you so." For the last 2 years some of us (specifically NoSaint and I) have argued that you can easily replace the last WR on your depth chart if he doesn't have a skill that differentiates himself. So after 2 years a large portion of the fan base is ready to jettison him for a PS player & and undrafted FA. The point remains that you protect talent because guys like Hogan are a dime a dozen and interchangeable. If you lose a guy like Hogan to protect someone with a(n) elite skill(s) you just replace him with the next Hogan (ie Andre Davis or Deonte Thompson).
3rdand12 Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Harvin's definitely making the team. Its the injury thing that is influencing my thinking not his abilities
NoSaint Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) I'm trying so hard to avoid the inevitable "I told you so." For the last 2 years some of us (specifically NoSaint and I) have argued that you can easily replace the last WR on your depth chart if he doesn't have a skill that differentiates himself. So after 2 years a large portion of the fan base is ready to jettison him for a PS player & and undrafted FA. The point remains that you protect talent because guys like Hogan are a dime a dozen and interchangeable. If you lose a guy like Hogan to protect someone with a(n) elite skill(s) you just replace him with the next Hogan (ie Andre Davis or Deonte Thompson).It's mildly amusing for you to have an I told you so moment when the other half of the debate crashed and burned but yes. even when hogan was at his peak last year I stood by the theory too. It's a body type and skill set and position that carries a deep enough allotment on a roster (6 deep means 180 make rosters) that the gap between 170 and 190 is pretty negligible in the grand scheme. Once you get past the initial rare talents, there's a ton of guys that are similar... it makes sense to keep taking shots at guys that could become exceptional at least. I'll sub Goodwin into the debate this year and say I'd much rather his rare skills than hogans lunch pail. Even if Goodwin ends up hurt and we sign a guy from the street in October Edited August 22, 2015 by NoSaint
GunnerBill Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Even if the Bills release Hogan you don't get to say "I told you so".. unless Hogan goes somewhere else and doesn't perform. Which won't happen.
truth on hold Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Even if the Bills release Hogan you don't get to say "I told you so".. unless Hogan goes somewhere else and doesn't perform. Which won't happen. Dude had stints with 3 other teams before coming here. All went no where. Yeah I'm really afraid of releasing Hogan and him taking his 400 yard season somewhere else lol
NoSaint Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Even if the Bills release Hogan you don't get to say "I told you so".. unless Hogan goes somewhere else and doesn't perform. Which won't happen. So you are arguing that hogan is a guy that has rare talents that will make him either a bonafide starter or a hard to replicate role player?
GunnerBill Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Dude had stints with 3 other teams before coming here. All went no where. Yeah I'm really afraid of releasing Hogan and him taking his 400 yard season somewhere else lol But he has improved every year he has been here and I still think he is on upward swing. I think he continue to be criminally underrated and not because "I want to root for the hard working underdog" but because of what I saw from him on the field last season in particular.
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Even if the Bills release Hogan you don't get to say "I told you so".. unless Hogan goes somewhere else and doesn't perform. Which won't happen. Yeah he's a good role player and his technique and ability to separate are above average. He's the kind of player that would excel with a surgical top QB
GunnerBill Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 So you are arguing that hogan is a guy that has rare talents that will make him either a bonafide starter or a hard to replicate role player? I believe he is a bonafide NFL receiver, yes. I have said before I think he would be at the very least a starter (if you are consider #1, #2 and slot as starters in the modern NFL) for a third of the league. I have also said if he stays here on this roster by the end of the season he will be more trusted as the #3 than Harvin who as usual will be found out as a receiver and end up in his gadget play role.
Kirby Jackson Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Even if the Bills release Hogan you don't get to say "I told you so".. unless Hogan goes somewhere else and doesn't perform. Which won't happen. My argument was always you protect talent because you can always find a "Chris Hogan." They just did with Davis and Thompson and now everyone is ready to move on. Hogan has been better than I thought but he is still a #4. I actually think Hogan makes the team over those guys still.
GunnerBill Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) My argument was always you protect talent because you can always find a "Chris Hogan." They just did with Davis and Thompson and now everyone is ready to move on. Hogan has been better than I thought but he is still a #4. I actually think Hogan makes the team over those guys still. And he will continue to be better than you think and get even better. He is one of the most underrated players I've known watching the Bills for 13 years. We have had lots of overrated players in that time, few underrated ones. Edited August 22, 2015 by GunnerBill
Rob's House Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 But he has improved every year he has been here and I still think he is on upward swing. I think he continue to be criminally underrated and not because "I want to root for the hard working underdog" but because of what I saw from him on the field last season in particular. That, along with the fact that he came into the league with almost no NFL experience, indicates that we don't know what his ceiling is. Maybe he's there, maybe he'll continue to improve. But even if he never becomes a pro-bowler, he could be a very valuable WR2 or WR3.
GunnerBill Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) That, along with the fact that he came into the league with almost no NFL experience, indicates that we don't know what his ceiling is. Maybe he's there, maybe he'll continue to improve. But even if he never becomes a pro-bowler, he could be a very valuable WR2 or WR3. 100% agree (except I think you mean with almost no "football" experience). Edited August 22, 2015 by GunnerBill
truth on hold Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 And he will continue to be better than you think and get even better. He is one of the most underrated players I've known watching the Bills for 13 years. We have had lots of overrated players in that time, few underrated ones. I have no clue what you're talking about. I don't see hands, route running, ability to take the top off the defense or anything. I like the catch he made against (was it lions or Detroit last year?), but that was one play. Stay on the field long enough anyone can have a couple plays. But his overall body of work is really nothing at all special
GunnerBill Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 I have no clue what you're talking about. I don't see hands, route running, ability to take the top off the defense or anything. I like the catch he made against (was it lions or Detroit last year?), but that was one play. Stay on the field long enough anyone can have a couple plays. But his overall body of work is really nothing at all special It was against the Vikings that he made the big catch down on the goalline... but he made plenty of other good plays that demonstrated the things you didn't see.
Rob's House Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 100% agree (except I think you mean with almost no "football" experience).
NoSaint Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) My argument was always you protect talent because you can always find a "Chris Hogan." They just did with Davis and Thompson and now everyone is ready to move on. Hogan has been better than I thought but he is still a #4. I actually think Hogan makes the team over those guys still. Right. Even if you think that there are upwards of 10 teams that he could be #3, if you put him in that 80-100 bucket around the league (bottom of 3s to top of 4s) the gap back to the guys floating around in free agency and practice squads isn't huge. The guys a B student - good grades, smart but not exceptional and in the talent pool he's in there are a lot of those guys. Oh well- we've had the talk plenty though. I'll let it slide. If he stays, I wish him well and I'll cheer on Sunday - if he leaves I won't think twice about it It was against the Vikings that he made the big catch down on the goalline... but he made plenty of other good plays that demonstrated the things you didn't see. Jtsp isn't saying he's god awful at any of those just that he's not particularly exceptional compared to any of the other guys fighting for roster spots around the league. Is there one of those skills you think he possesses a special talent with? Edited August 22, 2015 by NoSaint
truth on hold Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) It was against the Vikings that he made the big catch down on the goalline... but he made plenty of other good plays that demonstrated the things you didn't see. Which plays did he take the top off a defense? Like a Goodwin or at times Watkins. Edited August 22, 2015 by JTSP
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