BackInDaDay Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 I have got to disagree on the basis that I said from the moment he was signed that Kolb was a tomato can brought in for EJ to easily kick over and that Kolb was basically handicapped and was unlikely to even make it out of camp uninjured. I may have even suggested that it was unaccountable of the Bills to let the thoroughly busted up guy suit up again. Then it happened...of course.....and then we had to hear stories about how Kolb's ears ring 24 hours a day like he has a jet taking off next to him. Fitz and TJax are HOF's compared to that dude and that's just in terms of production when healthy......let alone durability. I just can't even buy that Buddy and Whaley were that stupid. Had to be a setup for the rookie QB. i don't think the Bills FO knew how bad off Kolb was at that point.. he threw for close to 13,000 yards at Houston while playing for Baylor coach Art Briles, and was drafted into the league by WCO disciple Andy Reid to run his quick hitting passing game in Philly - before he became the best player never to play. they took a shot that he could revive Marone and Hackett's offense and mentor EJ. like a lotta things - it didn't work out.
Kelly the Dog Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 Here is proof: Whaley says flat out on the Bills site the plan was for EJ to sit and learn behind Kolb but it got thrown out the window when Kolb got hurt. http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2015/08/05/how-the-original-plan-for-ej-was-compromised/
PolishDave Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 Here is proof: Whaley says flat out on the Bills site the plan was for EJ to sit and learn behind Kolb but it got thrown out the window when Kolb got hurt. http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2015/08/05/how-the-original-plan-for-ej-was-compromised/ Well, then Whaley just lost a notch in my book because only an idiot would sign Kolb and expect to win with him as QB. They saw the film from Arizona - the dude sucked. Only an idiot talent evaluator would have thought Kolb could still be a starting quarterback.
Kelly the Dog Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 Well, then Whaley just lost a notch in my book because only an idiot would sign Kolb and expect to win with him as QB. They saw the film from Arizona - the dude sucked. Only an idiot talent evaluator would have thought Kolb could still be a starting quarterback. There wasn't a lot out there. And Nix was still the GM then. Whaley was commenting on what the plan was the year before. It wasn't a good idea. I never liked Kolb myself.
jeffismagic Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 The EJ Manuel story in Buffalo looks like it is coming to an end. BUT...the lack of anyone that can play QB in front of EJ leads me to think he makes the team. If things go south for Taylor or Cassel then EJ could very well end up playing this year. I hope he realizes that and keeps pushing. He should look dominant against the Browns. Let's see what he has. So far in the scrimmage and the Panthers game there wasn't much to criticize EJ for. His problem has been his incredible inconsistency in the practices where he often goes 3-4 practices in a row with duds.
BackInDaDay Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 (edited) Well, then Whaley just lost a notch in my book because only an idiot would sign Kolb and expect to win with him as QB. They saw the film from Arizona - the dude sucked. Only an idiot talent evaluator would have thought Kolb could still be a starting quarterback. hard to argue the choice of Kolb - especially in regard to his ability to stay on the field and be productive - but he was available, and his skill set did fit what the coach's wanted at that time The EJ Manuel story in Buffalo looks like it is coming to an end. BUT...the lack of anyone that can play QB in front of EJ leads me to think he makes the team. If things go south for Taylor or Cassel then EJ could very well end up playing this year. I hope he realizes that and keeps pushing. He should look dominant against the Browns. Let's see what he has. So far in the scrimmage and the Panthers game there wasn't much to criticize EJ for. His problem has been his incredible inconsistency in the practices where he often goes 3-4 practices in a row with duds. as fans, we should realize that not even good results are always the correct results. that's why i really would like to know how far is EJ from making the 'correct' decisions on a consistent basis.. it has to play a large part in why he couldn't dominate the competition. Is it correctable, and is it correctable here? seems like a simple question.. Edited August 20, 2015 by BackInDaDay
PolishDave Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 There wasn't a lot out there. And Nix was still the GM then. Whaley was commenting on what the plan was the year before. It wasn't a good idea. I never liked Kolb myself. Whaley was in charge and everyone knows that. Nix was nothing more than a figure head at that point. There is no way Nix brings Kolb in without Whaley's approval. Absolutely no friggin way. hard to argue the choice of Kolb - especially in regard to his ability to stay on the field and be productive - but he was available, and his skill set did fit what the coach's wanted at that time The only part of his skillset that matched anything the Bills wanted was he had veteran experience. His play during his previous year in Arizona proved Kolb should be permanently benched or else demoted into a backup position where he could be called on in an emergency situation only.
Rob's House Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 (edited) Because Whaley and Nix and Marrone all said it, and then they signed Kolb to be the starter. And Kolb soon got hurt, even though he was playing very poorly in OTAs and training camp and EJ was actually beating him out. You did say that and were proven to be right. That's not what Nix and Whaley said and intimated though. It was a bad plan, like the not bringing in anyone to challenge EJ the next year turned out to be a bad plan. http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2015/08/05/how-the-original-plan-for-ej-was-compromised/ I remember that being kind of the prevailing thought at the time, but the circumstances don't support that theory but so strongly, & I don't believe Whaley said that until after EJ stumbled. Kolb was more of a serviceable veteran who could start if Manuel wasn't ready by the beginning of the season, but if the intent was to have Manuel ride the pine, why cut Fitz? And why roll into The season w/ only EJ & Tuel? It's my belief that Kolb was the contingency plan, not the presumptive starter. Edited August 20, 2015 by Rob's House
3rdand12 Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 May i inquire sincerely how this thread got turned around and the ship righted? I have read some significantly good posts. actually alot of them. Not because a stance has been taken although intimated . Maybe because of the civil nature. from reasonable folks. ps i think the draft history pre Nix, then Nix then Whaley, tell the story of why we are where we are as Bills fans> there is s distinct separation from those periods of time from one another.
BackInDaDay Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 The only part of his skillset that matched anything the Bills wanted was he had veteran experience. this is one of many such articles written about Kolb before our roof fell in.. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000157815/printable/kevin-kolb-expects-unique-buffalo-bills-offense " Kolb does not have great arm strength, but this offense could play more to his theoretical strengths of timing and accuracy."
3rdand12 Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 I remember that being kind of the prevailing thought at the time, but the circumstances don't support that theory but so strongly, & I don't believe Whaley said that until after EJ stumbled. Kolb was more of a serviceable veteran who could start if Manuel wasn't ready by the beginning of the season, but if the intent was to have Manuel ride the pine, why cut Fitz? And why roll into The season w/ only EJ & Tuel? It's my belief that Kolb was the contingency plan, not the presumptive starter. Fitz wanted to leave Nix messed that up. In e better world Fitz would have started EJ's rook season. They paid him that contract! But the fans were screaming that we cant throw deep. for two years or so. and then the phone call. dreaded phone call. Nix screwed the pooch this is one of many such articles written about Kolb before our roof fell in.. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000157815/printable/kevin-kolb-expects-unique-buffalo-bills-offense " Kolb does not have great arm strength, but this offense could play more to his theoretical strengths of timing and accuracy." Kolb seemed like reasonable placeholder, noticing the injury prone aspect. so there needed to be another layer before EJ
BackInDaDay Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 Fitz wanted to leave Nix messed that up. In e better world Fitz would have started EJ's rook season. They paid him that contract! But the fans were screaming that we cant throw deep. for two years or so. and then the phone call. dreaded phone call. Nix screwed the pooch Kolb seemed like reasonable placeholder, noticing the injury prone aspect. so there needed to be another layer before EJ oh yeah.. the phone call.. “We just can’t afford to pay that kind of money for a guy who’s fighting for probably a backup job.”
PolishDave Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 (edited) this is one of many such articles written about Kolb before our roof fell in.. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000157815/printable/kevin-kolb-expects-unique-buffalo-bills-offense " Kolb does not have great arm strength, but this offense could play more to his theoretical strengths of timing and accuracy." I get your point and can totally see what you mean. I just like to make a mockery of anyone (in the football GM world) who thought Kolb could be a starting quarterback. I just don't believe it. The only reason the fans in Buffalo didn't revolt over that signing was because very few people around here watch Arizona football. In fact, very few people around the league in general watch Arizona play football. So it is a great place to sign a bad player from. Kolb's stats in AZ didn't reveal his lack of talent, watching him play revealed that. IF you didn't watch him play game after game and you just looked at his stats you might think he could be servicable. But if you watched him play you would be calling to put anybody else in but him. Edited August 20, 2015 by PolishDave
Solomon Grundy Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 Well, then Whaley just lost a notch in my book because only an idiot would sign Kolb and expect to win with him as QB. They saw the film from Arizona - the dude sucked. Only an idiot talent evaluator would have thought Kolb could still be a starting quarterback. Kolb=Cassel? this is one of many such articles written about Kolb before our roof fell in.. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000157815/printable/kevin-kolb-expects-unique-buffalo-bills-offense " Kolb does not have great arm strength, but this offense could play more to his theoretical strengths of timing and accuracy."[/size] Whaley was in charge and everyone knows that. Nix was nothing more than a figure head at that point. There is no way Nix brings Kolb in without Whaley's approval. Absolutely no friggin way. The only part of his skillset that matched anything the Bills wanted was he had veteran experience. His play during his previous year in Arizona proved Kolb should be permanently benched or else demoted into a backup position where he could be called on in an emergency situation only. Whaley's title was Asst.GM. How was he in charge?
BackInDaDay Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 I get your point and can totally see what you mean. I just like to make a mockery of anyone (in the football GM world) who thought Kolb could be a starting quarterback. I just don't believe it. The only reason the fans in Buffalo didn't revolt over that signing was because very few people around here watch Arizona football. In fact, very few people around the league in general watch Arizona play football. So it is a great place to sign a bad player from. Kolb's stats in AZ didn't reveal his lack of talent, watching him play revealed that. IF you didn't watch him play game after game and you just looked at his stats you might think he could be servicable. But if you watched him play you would be calling to put anybody else in but him. yeah.. there's the perception - and then there's the reality.. might have been interesting to see what he could have done - but like you say, probably not much at that point. remember when he was backing up McNabb? he was in every trade rumor - like Cousins was for awhile.
Kelly the Dog Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 I remember that being kind of the prevailing thought at the time, but the circumstances don't support that theory but so strongly, & I don't believe Whaley said that until after EJ stumbled. Kolb was more of a serviceable veteran who could start if Manuel wasn't ready by the beginning of the season, but if the intent was to have Manuel ride the pine, why cut Fitz? And why roll into The season w/ only EJ & Tuel? It's my belief that Kolb was the contingency plan, not the presumptive starter. Kolb was signed well before the draft. They didn't know who was going to be available at the time, if they could make a trade down, etc. All they knew at that time was that EJ was the top guy on their board. They still had Tarvaris Jackson when they signed Kolb, too. He signed for 6m with playing time incentives to 12-13m. If they really wanted EJ to start they never would have traded down. Everyone knew he was a project. The bad move was that Kolb was the guy they signed because he was an injury waiting to happen (although again there was not a lot to choose from).
3rdand12 Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 oh yeah.. the phone call.. “We just can’t afford to pay that kind of money for a guy who’s fighting for probably a backup job.” and Bills did want to renegotiate his contract. But that came out after the phone call. By then he was pissed, I could imagine
Solomon Grundy Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 Fellas, unless you're not seeing it, this is the continuation of their initial plan to develop EJ Manuel. They have a win now roster so they want to win NOW, but continue to develop EJ. This is why they're trying to catch lightning in a bottle with Taylor. They're hoping that the combination of Taylor/Cassel can break the playoff drought. The problem is that EJ is not going down without a fight(hence the shadow boxing at camp yesterday).Rex and Co. are seeing improvement in EJs play and if he has a good showing tomorrow then all bets are off.
Kelly the Dog Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 and Bills did want to renegotiate his contract. But that came out after the phone call. By then he was pissed, I could imagine They told Fitz that he would have to take a huge pay cut, they were drafting a QB high and he would have to fight for his job. The phone call really pissed Fitz off. So he wasn't going to agree.
PolishDave Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 (edited) Whaley's title was Asst.GM. How was he in charge? It was already public knowledge that Nix was stepping down and Whaley was assuming the GM role. Once they made that public, then there is no way Nix makes a move without Whaley's approval. Think about it. No way Whaley says "yeah I'll take the job in a year and sure you can let Mr. Nix do whatever he wants between then and now." It just isn't going to happen because if Nix did that, he would be burning his bridge in Buffalo and essentially destroying his reputation as being a good ole boy. And the other management in charge at that time would have never asked Whaley to be put in a position where that could happen. Edited August 20, 2015 by PolishDave
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