FireChan Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 You can call it hell. It's not blasphemy. So you're under the impression that there is a Brady, Kaep, Wilson every year I take it then? Clearly. I agree on taking a flyer on a late round pick. I was really hoping we drafted Mettenberger. That's what I'm saying. It doesn't work 90% of the time, but it works infinitely better than nothing.
fansince88 Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 Keep in mind folks, it wasn't some Internet jerk like myself being quoted. It is the Bills' GM. Did DC Tom tell you that?
The Wiz Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) Clearly. That's what I'm saying. It doesn't work 90% of the time, but it works infinitely better than nothing. So you're saying since they didn't take a late round pick on a QB last year that Whaley isn't doing his job then? Even after he traded for 2 QB's, prior to the draft. Edited August 6, 2015 by The Wiz
YoloinOhio Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) So you're saying since they didn't take a late round pick on a QB last year that Whaley isn't doing his job then? Even after he traded for 2 QB's, prior to the draft. I've always viewed Taylor as his "late round QB draft pick" - it's pretty much what he is, he just comes with the benefit of 4 years of NFL film room, training and practice. Edited August 6, 2015 by YoloinOhio
HalftimeAdjustment Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 You get some honesty from the GM and people are upset? Would you be MORE upset if he said "no way will we need a quarterback, I refuse to answer, our QBs are Pro Bowl caliber?" Let's not forget this gem: "We don't have Lebron James at QB".
Kirby Jackson Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) I agree that the Bills' QB situation isn't a surprise, but what is surprising is that you have Whaley admitting, implicitly if not explicitly, that the Bills have little if any faith that the three guys competing for the job this year will amount to anything. That isn't surprising in the case of Cassell since no one expects him to be anything more than he has been all these years. An acknowledgment from the Bills' GM about Taylor and particularly Manuel, however, is surprising in the sense you don't expect that to be publicly acknowledged.I don't know it's still not surprising. What did you expect to hear, "these guys are killing it out there?" The Bills are trying to be transparent. They aren't saying the sky is falling but they are approaching it realistically. The "franchise guy" probably isn't on the roster today. The team is really good and it's hard to find a franchise guy when you are a .500 or better team. It's not shocking to me that the team seems to agree with the assesment of most. Edited August 6, 2015 by Kirby Jackson
YoloinOhio Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 You get some honesty from the GM and people are upset? Would you be MORE upset if he said "no way will we need a quarterback, I refuse to answer, our QBs are Pro Bowl caliber?" Let's not forget this gem: "We don't have Lebron James at QB".i agree, it would be unsettling if Whaley acted like the QB situation was just peachy, no need to talk about potentially needing to draft one next year, "lalala" with hands over his ears.
stony Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 Clearly. That's what I'm saying. It doesn't work 90% of the time, but it works infinitely better than nothing. Whaley's built a championship-level roster outside of the QB position. The QB position is the most difficult to play in all of professional sports. As a result of this, it's easily the most difficult position to find within the sport. Late round flyers are swell, but given their minuscule rate of success, and the huge number of holes Whaley was tasked with filling, I can't fault the guy.
dave mcbride Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) FYI: http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/179641-85-doug-whaley-on-wgr/ No need to do this, imo. I wasn't aware of that thread and there's nothing wrong with starting a new one. No offense. Edited August 6, 2015 by dave mcbride
stony Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 I've always viewed Taylor as his "late round QB draft pick" - it's pretty much what he is, he just comes with the benefit of 4 years of NFL film room, training and practice. Shhhhhhh. The type of acquisition be damned, if it ain't a draft pick, the GM ain't doing his job!!!
Kirby Jackson Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) I have yet to hear what some of the harshest critics would've done in Doug's shoes. They needed to take a shot at a QB in 2013, so they took EJ (and scored extra picks in doing it). He looked okay as a rookie, so they didn't draft any of the so-so prospects last year, opting instead to amp up his weaponry. Who exactly was inspired by any of the options available this offseason? Yep, this is pretty much spot on (and I'm not an EJ guy). The one thing that is more frustrating that than the guys that make excuses for the QB's poor play is the people that say "just get a guy." If you don't have a plan for who that guy is then you really can't criticize what's been done. If you don't like what's been done, fine. If you don't have a better option put your pitchfork down. Edited August 6, 2015 by Kirby Jackson
26CornerBlitz Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) No need to do this, imo. I wasn't aware of that thread and there's nothing wrong with starting a new one. No offense. Regardless of your opinion, there was a need for some people IMO to listen to the interview with many taking what was said out of context. Have a lovely evening. Edited August 6, 2015 by 26CornerBlitz
John from Riverside Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 Just keep in mind...... The Vikings QB was very highly rated at this time last year As was Raiders QB Where were they drafted.......we have our 1st round pick back.....and a EXTREMELY stacked roster so we can afford to package picks to move up. I take exception to the OP taking what Whaley saying and twisted it.......all he said was we were not going to be picking at the top of the draft because quite frankly....this team is too good
FireChan Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 So you're saying since they didn't take a late round pick on a QB last year that Whaley isn't doing his job then? Even after he traded for 2 QB's, prior to the draft. Matt Cassel? Thank god for our QB of the future. Whaley's built a championship-level roster outside of the QB position. The QB position is the most difficult to play in all of professional sports. As a result of this, it's easily the most difficult position to find within the sport. Late round flyers are swell, but given their minuscule rate of success, and the huge number of holes Whaley was tasked with filling, I can't fault the guy. What hole did Karlos Williams fill? Or Dezmin whatever? Or Jonathan Meeks? etc etc. I've always viewed Taylor as his "late round QB draft pick" - it's pretty much what he is, he just comes with the benefit of 4 years of NFL film room, training and practice. 2 > 1, or so they say.
Sumin Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 They doubled down the next year, by not getting anymore QB's. It's strange that no one sees this. The only way to ensure you don't hit on the QB lottery is to not play. Gamblers fallacy-- your chances of acquiring a franchise QB do not, in fact, increase with every QB you take, as each pick is independent of the one prior. The answer is simply not "hey, let's draft as many Quarterbacks as we can, maybe one will stick." What IS the answer is solid scouting, and building a proper environment for a young QB to step into. Believe it or not, there are other positions that have to be addressed on an NFL team.. I do realize that the QB is the most important piece. Pray tell, how was Carr's rookie season any better than EJ's? I will give you Bridgewater-- I was also of the opinion that the Bills should have traded up to take him but NOT because I felt that taking another QB would increase our chances of hitting. It's quite possible that Bridgewater could regress, or he could take the next step. Tough to say after one year.
dave mcbride Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 Carr sucks and frankly, Bridgewater leaves a lot to be desired. EJ showed similar flashes his rookie year. If these guys continue their progression off merely adequate rookie seasons, you'll have poor-man Tannehills. I understand your position, but there's no clear cut alternative, thus we remain in "QB Purgatory." Carr doesn't suck. He played very well late last year with an absolute garbage offense and has looked great this year in TC. There's a reason why people employed by nfl teams who don't post on message boards think his ceiling is high. Read the espn qb rankings (based on a survey of 15 nfl coaches and personnel people) to see what actual professionals think of him.
NoSaint Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 I don't know it's still not surprising. What did you expect to hear, "these guys are killing it out there?" The Bills are trying to be transparent. They aren't saying the skit is falling but they are approaching it realistically. The "franchise guy" probably isn't on the roster today. The team is really good and it's hard to find a franchise guy when you are a .500 or better team. It's not shocking to me that the team seems to agree with the assesment of most. Right- and heaven forbid they try to light a fire under a guytoo
FireChan Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 (edited) Gamblers fallacy-- your chances of acquiring a franchise QB do not, in fact, increase with every QB you take, as each pick is independent of the one prior. The answer is simply not "hey, let's draft as many Quarterbacks as we can, maybe one will stick." What IS the answer is solid scouting, and building a proper environment for a young QB to step into. Believe it or not, there are other positions that have to be addressed on an NFL team.. I do realize that the QB is the most important piece. Pray tell, how was Carr's rookie season any better than EJ's? I will give you Bridgewater-- I was also of the opinion that the Bills should have traded up to take him but NOT because I felt that taking another QB would increase our chances of hitting. It's quite possible that Bridgewater could regress, or he could take the next step. Tough to say after one year. Gamblers fallacy-- your chances of acquiring a franchise QB do not, in fact, increase with every QB you take, as each pick is independent of the one prior. Yes it does. Because you can't win if you don't gamble. Your chance of hitting heads doesn't increase if you get two coin flips, but you still have the possibility of getting heads if your first flip is tails. The answer is simply not "hey, let's draft as many Quarterbacks as we can, maybe one will stick." Has anyone said it was that simple? Or said "as many as we can?" What IS the answer is solid scouting, and building a proper environment for a young QB to step into. Believe it or not, there are other positions that have to be addressed on an NFL team.. I do realize that the QB is the most important piece. Great, we're there. All our QB's suck. Where's the QB who's gonna step into here? Wait 2-3 years for another project? Pray tell, how was Carr's rookie season any better than EJ's? I will give you Bridgewater-- I was also of the opinion that the Bills should have traded up to take him but NOT because I felt that taking another QB would increase our chances of hitting. It's quite possible that Bridgewater could regress, or he could take the next step. Tough to say after one year. Carr played on the worst team in the NFL and had stats equal or better to EJ's rookie year. Teddy could regress, sure. But that's better than having a QB who already stinks. Edited August 6, 2015 by FireChan
John from Riverside Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 Gamblers fallacy-- your chances of acquiring a franchise QB do not, in fact, increase with every QB you take, as each pick is independent of the one prior. Yes it does. Because you can't win if you don't gamble. Your chance of hitting heads doesn't increase if you get two coin flips, but you still have the possibility of getting heads if your first flip is tails. The answer is simply not "hey, let's draft as many Quarterbacks as we can, maybe one will stick." Has anyone said it was that simple? Or said "as many as we can?" What IS the answer is solid scouting, and building a proper environment for a young QB to step into. Believe it or not, there are other positions that have to be addressed on an NFL team.. I do realize that the QB is the most important piece. Great, we're there. All our QB's suck. Where's the QB who's gonna step into here? Wait 2-3 years for another project? Pray tell, how was Carr's rookie season any better than EJ's? I will give you Bridgewater-- I was also of the opinion that the Bills should have traded up to take him but NOT because I felt that taking another QB would increase our chances of hitting. It's quite possible that Bridgewater could regress, or he could take the next step. Tough to say after one year. Carr played on the worst team in the NFL and had stats equal or better to EJ's rookie year. Teddy could regress, sure. But that's better than having a QB who already stinks. Where to start with this..... At what point in this last draft (which was WIDELY considered to be a poor QB draft) would you have taken a QB? With the 2nd pick.....were we took Ronald Darby? That Darby pick is lookin REALLY good right now for several reasons With the 3rd pick.....where we took John Miller? Miller is going to START on this offensive line and the coaches love him Did we have a 4th round pick? Now we are getting into players that that you draft for value........a QB that probably gets cut or goes to the practice squad or Karlos Williams........a running who is looking very good in camp....provides special teams.......and came out of a running back ritch draft Maybe we take the QB where we took the LB (even though our GM has shown a propensity to be VERY good at drafting linebackers My point is.....we had limited picks.....Whaley made every one of them count........then he went and got two veterans to compete in camp with EJ........ Sometimes....you just cant get everything you want.
NoSaint Posted August 6, 2015 Posted August 6, 2015 Carr played on the worst team in the NFL and had stats equal or better to EJ's rookie year. Teddy could regress, sure. But that's better than having a QB who already stinks. To be fair the offense EJs rookie year had marrone/Hackett, a spotty line, and injury issues across every skill position (except tight end, who isn't a starter in the league these days). That Jets game with hogan, Goodwin and graham as starting WRs, and the backs combining for 25 carries for 40 yards not being a great argument for EJ being surrounded by offensive talent. Lee smith, tashard choice, and frank summers had catches.
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