TakeYouToTasker Posted August 3, 2015 Posted August 3, 2015 No. As I said, this thread serves 2 purposes: to get posters talking about the chances of the 46 actually being a real thing, and, to do something useful with our time, instead of yet another Qb discussion. NoneofthismattersbecauseitsaQBdrivenleagueandEJhassloweyesandCassellismehandTyrodneversawthefieldinBaltimoreandthe46defensecantplayQBdoooooooomed. /thread
boyst Posted August 3, 2015 Posted August 3, 2015 (edited) But, as I pointed out raising the question to Yolo, its who we can sub in and replace that will matter most. Charles and Bryant are major factors. Our interior DL will be lining up man up, take on guys head to head a lot more and they will benefit from getting subbed. Since we are doing colors now Quote I said Manny Lawson in the next paragraph, dammit! How the F should I know about which interior lineman does what? Or who is playing where? The best part is, like you said, I don't think the other teams are gonna know either. Well, in the 46 it is harder for the DL to just attack attack attack. No Tora Tora Tora. No get on it. No go for the kill. They can't over commit to a rush and leave gaps for backs to run thru - leaving the ILB exposed and left alone for the carrier. Few ILB's can match up against an RB in this league and win half the time. That means our DT's up the middle must simply occupy not just space but bodies. They'll be able to break free and fast in the 46 when it is a pass but they can't get too aggressive and let gaps open. They must stick to their lanes and that is hard for an undisciplined DL to do which is why we read Dareus had some issues with instructions from the new DL Coach. This DL is not going to be a simple attack DL. Yeah, the depth is huge. Subbing in, and keeping things 1v1? Both concepts working together, I believe defeats the "getting tired" point. I love the fact that we can play guys like Charles and Bryant. Wish we could have kept Searcy but I cannot believe he got that much money. (4 yr, $24mm with $10.5 guaranteed). My greatest fear with regard to our depth is the drop off in quality at DB. If McKelvin is truly regressing as quickly as some claim (not me) and Gilmore doesn't come out strong and stay strong or either one of them gets hurt putting Graham outside is not awful but it changes our whole dynamic. I cringe at putting Robey outside. I know we have Darby, but I do not know how he will fair against the NFL level WR yet. Truly, Carolina will be a huge test. Out of the box, or in the box. Standard 3-4 man, 46, 4-3 zone? IF we can do all these with the same personnel, but also, no matter who is subbed in, that's downright scary. Who's our base personnel? I am asking. Pick your best 11. Then pick your starting lineup. Best 11, regardless of position. Dareus, MWilliams, KWiliams, AWilliams, Gilmore, Bradham, McKelvin, Hughes, Graham, Brown, Lawson. --Robey. When he is on the field and in the right position to succeed, no one gets the job done like he does. Starting lineup take Lawson out, Tony Steward In. I don't think Rex is brave enough to only play 3 LB's. Sure to all of this, espeically Bradham. Like we've both said, it takes all 11, and there are a few potential stress points. Bradham I can see. Brown not as much. Especially not after I saw him running step for step against a WR and make an INT 25 yards down the field last year. Brown had some awful first steps last year. Had some points, not as much later in the year, where he just got 2 or 3 steps off the bat in the wrong direction or just simply not fast enough. Think of it like he took baby steps to the play a few times. His processing speed of the play is my concern. He needs a good coach and Brandon Spikes seemed to have an impact. I hope they bring him back. Remember back with Pettine? He would line up 5 on the line, and a blitzing LB then rush only 3? Crazy dude would drop Dareus to cover the freaking flat! Yeah, That's what I love about this, because we can do just that. This time we run a 46 and rush 5 or 6. Next time we rush 2, keep our ends at home on the outside flats and cover every inch of the field. Next time we bring the safety up, run a cover 3 in the 46 with the under guys playing man up. I think the major difference with Pettine was that we couldn't stop the run...largely due to not having 2 run-stopping LBs, and, many of his plays were all or nothing, which meant nothing if they ran it. With the 46, and this unit running it, I don't see the big, frustrating, up the gut runs Pettine's D would give up at least once a game on 3rd and long. I do not know if he can last all season playing with the boom he will need. Rambo will likely make the team for this reason - a sure hitter. Gulp* Donte Whitner would be nice to have teamed with Scott in rotation at the SS. I don't know either. But, we do have S depth it seems. This is another potential stress point. But, if Williams keeps on his upwards trajectory from last year, we may have a Gary Fencik/Doug Plank hitter in him that nobody knew about, until the 46 gave him his shot. I hope, I cross my fingers, I pray to Allah. I sure worry about him on TE's though. And if you can't cover a TE as a safety on my team, I don't really want to play you on my team. Personal preference. Who says we are going to rush them that's the best part? I forget the game, maybe it was Cleveland two years ago, we literally rushed no one, and everyone basically just stayed their place in a cover 0. All 5 guys in the box just sort of went to read and react - circa 2005. The QB had no idea what to do, scrambled out of the pocket for no reason and threw to the ground. This is where I am looking forward to next week vs. Carolina. Cam can't read defenses to save his life. I promise he will have 3 bombs where you think, wow, neat. Maybe one of the WR's will actually jump 20' and catch one, too. But, the bottom line is, it will be big next week to see if our DB's can man up against some young talented WR's with an irresponsible gunslinging QB who reminds me of a stronger more mobile Bledsoe. I seriously doubt we see 46 next week, and I will crap if we do. 46 against Cam Newton is like calculus for a Kardashian. No way they get it, but, sometimes the answer actually is 2. Or 3.5. No, it's POTATO! I see 46 as minimizing the impact of losing Byrd. All you really need back there is a guy like Corey Graham. He can cover, he can hit. He's smart/not gonna bite. Is he going to be the FS???? I thought it was goign to be #3 Safety, Rex's #2 SS. His new Jim Leonhard. No. As I said, this thread serves 2 purposes: to get posters talking about the chances of the 46 actually being a real thing, and, to do something useful with our time, instead of yet another Qb discussion. By all means, take it. Chicken. The DL I already touched on a bit, if anyone has more questions, shoot. It just won't be the same go for blood that Schwartz enabled. I'll take premature cream in pants over more boring crap from mouths every time. What if we really can play 46, with this team, in 2015? I don't know, it may be more likely than we think. Much depends on how the stress points we've talked about above fare. And injuries(wood being knocked right now). If you read that first part irresponsibly then you can believe that you and Gugny would get along... doing what with cream from his pants to your mouth? If we do, I do not know its success but it will be marked as footnote in history. It will be something that is part of the future of this game and coaches will enable as educational tools. It will be fitting that it is a Ryan, of course. We can easily shift in to a 46 with a regular defense. even a nickel formation would be possibly switched to a 46. Slide the extra SS - probably Graham - up outside the hip of our OLB. Quick and strong enough to blitz or not. Yep. That's why I think drafting Darby and Graham to FS are all indicators pointing towards 46 at least some of the time. These pieces seem to fit. When you dump your FS to the slot position, leave your SS high and dare a team to go deep on you thinking they have an advantage but you just move your FS to a role of CB... to cover your 3rd CB and play a cover 4? That could be interesting. Now, what about a Tampa2 in the 46? I need to think about that one. It could be successful. Whatever. You know what I mean. Running QBs and little turd Rbs coming out of the backfield require delays, reads, etc. You stand around/move laterally against the 46 and that's an injury waiting to happen. Like others have said, the West Coast is the best way to beat it. But, you leave your QB open for a free run on just one play and any of our front 8 hits him? Dink and dunk is awfully hard to do from the hospital. That's the thing about the 46: it creates unblocked, free runs at the QB much more than most other Ds == get the meat wagon. Same thing for WRs. We set up in what looks to be a 46, but is actually a zone...the WR runs the checkdown rout, and gets destroyed by a not-blitzing LB when the ball gets there. I am very happy we play Newton early with his team. It will expose many weaknesses in our coaching and work and it will benefit us greatly. I would much rather play the Ravens week 2 and work on the short routes that Brady loves. But, I will enjoy Roethlisberger just fine week 3. COLORS!!! Edited August 3, 2015 by jboyst62
3rdand12 Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 Helga! get us a cigarette. Thats was very satisfying indeed.Thankyou. Offer one to my friends here.. Or some Brandy perhaps? I have found this to be stimulating and satisfying. This is exactly why i joined the organization. gentlemen all, i have learned. Thank You. To prove it once, the threat will remain. Go Rex Ryan.. et al ala Go Bills
BarleyNY Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 Th 46 would definitely be a sub package in Buffalo. I expect that a lot of teams run it as such. I don't know how any team could run it as a base with today's pass-friendly rules and salary cap. It sure is a nice arrow to have in your quiver, however.
YoloinOhio Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 Here is a good breakdown of different defensive fronts under Rex, including the 46 http://billsmafia.com/2015/08/03/breaking-down-buffalo-bills-hc-rex-ryans-defensive-fronts/
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 Here is a good breakdown of different defensive fronts under Rex, including the 46 http://billsmafia.com/2015/08/03/breaking-down-buffalo-bills-hc-rex-ryans-defensive-fronts/ Lol, Mr. Quinn must be a poster here and posted his article knowing we'd eat it up.
GunnerBill Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 I don't think it is going to be 46 throughout either, but like others have said here the flexibility of so many of our guys - Dareus, Mario, Bradham, Lawson, Hughes, Graham, Carrington, Duke etc means that you will not be able to look at the Bills personnel and immediately clock what is coming. I kind of feel like that is why Rex wasn't desperate to have Spikes back. You have Spikes on the field you limit your flexibility to do other stuff.... Brown, Bradham, Lawson, hell even Ty Powell are much more versatile linebackers and can do a number of things and line up in a number of spots.
YoloinOhio Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 @RQUINN619: #Bills D has several talented players with versatility to play multiple roles in Rex Ryan's defense. Should be fun http://t.co/qd9DWfcN9Z
Luxy312 Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 Here is a good breakdown of different defensive fronts under Rex, including the 46 http://billsmafia.com/2015/08/03/breaking-down-buffalo-bills-hc-rex-ryans-defensive-fronts/ I haven't seen a better article that really "dumbs down" the concepts of the 46 and what Ryan has been doing. Well posted!
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted August 4, 2015 Posted August 4, 2015 Here is a good breakdown of different defensive fronts under Rex, including the 46 http://billsmafia.com/2015/08/03/breaking-down-buffalo-bills-hc-rex-ryans-defensive-fronts/ Well, as hyped as I am about the 46 after checking out the article I really think the base will be the 4-3 under. Dareus and Kyle are quintessential 1 and 3 gappers. Mario is best as a 7 gap player, but can do 9 and the 5 you'd need for the under and Hughes is definitely a 9 tech player.
DrDawkinstein Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 Bumping this since it's the best pure football discussion we've seen here in a long time. Reading that BillsMafia article, I cant help but think (hope) that the last two years learning under the best 3-4 coach (Pettine) and then the best 4-3 coach (Schwartz) was all just preparation for this season under the Defensive Mastermind. Can't wait to see them kick it up a notch farther. We might be about to witness something very special this year!
Matt in KC Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 I am confident these are the best 3 defensive coordinators the Bills have ever had over a 3 year period.
NoSaint Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 I am confident these are the best 3 defensive coordinators the Bills have ever had over a 3 year period. typically you dont see 3 highly successful ones in 3 years is part of the issue there! its a pretty unique situation.
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 I know it's still unofficial, and we're going to be going through a lot of looks but it seems the unofficial depth chart has us looking like a 4-3 setup. They also switched SLB and WLB so take it with a grain of salt. But I'm excited to see what they come up with!
Matt in KC Posted August 11, 2015 Posted August 11, 2015 typically you dont see 3 highly successful ones in 3 years is part of the issue there! its a pretty unique situation. Actually it is 5 DCs in 5 years, if you go back to Edwards. When was the last time that happened and the defense was considered very good? When was the last time that happened for any reason?
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