26CornerBlitz Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 @FOXSportsLive Patriots Owner Robert Kraft on #DeflateGate
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 does anyone think this will hurt Brady with the HOF? I would love for him to not be a first ballot guy or better yet, never get in like Pete Rose. If I was a voter I would never vote for him, but thats me. If he gets the four games this year I'd say no. The body of work is too good. However, I've heard a strategy floated by some Pats* fans that Brady should get the injunction and ride out the year, and the retire as a big "eff you!" To Goddell. If he does that, I can't imagine him being first ballot.
plenzmd1 Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 I keep referring to it because that's what the commissioner's report said. Read page 11 'C. Did Mr. Brady Refuse to cooperate with the Investigation' Long story short, Brady did not provide the relevant information from the specific phone Wells requested months earlier. GO BILLS!!! Okay , then I misunderstood. I thought he supplied the texts from the destroyed phone, not from the one he replaced.
NoSaint Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) I'm just quoting your words and making suppositions based on them. You said that perhaps brady didn't agree because the league reportedly would not agree to seal the records of the appeal. We all like to pick nits from time to time, don't we?its been reported that brady declined the negotiations in part because it wasnt going to seal the record. im not sure what nits you are trying to pick here, but consider me sufficiently moderated. you asked why i thought it would be public, i replied that it was because the league allegedly refused to make it private, so no matter what it would end up public. im not sure what you are even trying to argue at this point by saying "so you're hung up on the fact that the information may have become public?" I am not hung up on anything there, but it sounds like brady is, i guess. Edited July 29, 2015 by NoSaint
stevewin Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 For all those wondering how we'd react in similar circumstances I offer one, Orenthal James Simpson. At the risk of showing my age here, he was a god in my house growing up, but neither I nor anyone else on this board have any illusions about what he did. It's just a special kind of stupid in Boston..... Ha - was just talking about this with my kids last night - how OJ was my hero, and it is a little known fact that he is innocent and his son did it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfZ82i1rJPs (I remember watching the full documentary on youtube a while back but don't think it is still on there)
Augie Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 Skip Bayless saying he's talked to people who felt Brady wanted to go to court as part of a play to get rid of Goodell.
eball Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 We have to agree to disagree on this. In my view, the penalty essentially boils down to three things (not one of which is the transgression itself, which is as minor as the ones I've cited above): a) the Patriots' and Brady's behavior in reaction to the allegations; b) the team's previous transgressions in the Belichick era; and c) the concerted efforts of pretty good teams that have historically struggled to beat the Patriots to nail them once and for all. Jim Irsay is the leader of that pack, and he's a jackass who is terrible at team building but supremely lucky at drafting QBs. But he appears to have won this round. Has everyone suddenly forgotten the study about the Pats** fumble rate over the past dozen or so years? Come on, people, they've been doing this forever and finally got caught. It does make a difference, and it is a competitive advantage. And Brady* is a damned liar and a cheat.
Beerball Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 i wouldnt be surprised. at first reaction, i likely agree with everything there. has football been as aggressive as baseball in that regard? if it were baseball, id think it to almost be a gimme, honestly. Numbers matter to baseball hall voters & so does integrity. I think that it is much less in football, possibly because it's so obvious that we (& the teams) care about winning more than anything. We overlook roids, HGH etc (maybe only after much hand wringing that ends when the player becomes ours & helps us win). The voters are, IMO, much the same. This case is a bit different because integrity of the game comes into play, but, as things now stand I believe brady skates in.
K-9 Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 For the sake of argument though: knowing the defense's calls and having a ball deflated beyond an acceptable standard would...you know...help render a QB "one of the best to ever lace 'em up." I understand. But even with those advantages, it comes down to execution. Somehow, I don't see J P Losman being able to do what Brady does with the same advantages. Brady has just made too many great plays at clutch times for me to think its all about advantages he gained through cheating. That said, I don't think they would have beaten the Ravens without the trick of the "ineligible receiver" plays now since outlawed by the league. While technically not against the rules, those plays clearly violated the spirit of the rule in allowing equal substitutions by the defense. But still, that's more on the coaches than it is on Brady. GO BILLS!!!
Kelly the Dog Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 its been reported that brady declined the negotiations in part because it wasnt going to seal the record. im not sure what nits you are trying to pick here, but consider me sufficiently moderated. you asked why i thought it would be public, i replied that it was because the league allegedly refused to make it private, so no matter what it would end up public. im not sure what you are even trying to argue at this point by saying "so you're hung up on the fact that the information may have become public?" I am not hung up on anything there, but it sounds like brady is, i guess. That's a tough one. The way I read it, Brady was simply saying this needs to be sealed and never released. The league wasn't saying it's going public, just that we are not sealing it. Surely some of it would leak at some point. That happens everywhere. But the league was not going to make it public.
YoloinOhio Posted July 29, 2015 Author Posted July 29, 2015 Here is the transcript of what Kraft said. He's such an ass, and disingenuous creep and scumbag, but his admission is just an incredible thing to say. That I accepted losing a number one and four pick, and a million dollar fine, and said it was for the good of the league, just to exonerate Brady, but they didn't exonerate him when I thought they would. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/category/rumor-mill/ yep. It is what we all assumed, but makes me sick he lays it right out there.
stevewin Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 Kraft is gonna go to war against the NFLmthis could get very interesting The one wild card that no one talks about is that Goodell knows the full extent of Spygate. There's no doubt in my mind the scope was much larger than what was reported. If Kraft really wants to push things too far, Roger has all that info (and maybe more) on him. But - revealing too much (or anything) could really be a huge black eye for the league. What a position to be in....
NoSaint Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 Numbers matter to baseball hall voters & so does integrity. I think that it is much less in football, possibly because it's so obvious that we (& the teams) care about winning more than anything. We overlook roids, HGH etc (maybe only after much hand wringing that ends when the player becomes ours & helps us win). The voters are, IMO, much the same. This case is a bit different because integrity of the game comes into play, but, as things now stand I believe brady skates in. id say its a slam dunk he makes it still, but i could see a handful wanting to "make him wait" a year. i think its only like 10 no votes to hold him out. it wouldnt be shocking if writers in a few of the AFC cities had enough of a coalition to make a point.... but like you said, the nfl hasnt had near the push back from voters that baseball sees with candidates with flags.
stevewin Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 I should hope not. Regardless of this episode, Brady is still one of the best to ever lace 'em up and deserves to be a first ballot HOFer. But the process is political, so who knows how the electors will vote. GO BILLS!!! What if he was one of the best as a result of things he and the Pats** did over his career to systemically cheat? Is he still a HOFer then?
NoSaint Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 That's a tough one. The way I read it, Brady was simply saying this needs to be sealed and never released. The league wasn't saying it's going public, just that we are not sealing it. Surely some of it would leak at some point. That happens everywhere. But the league was not going to make it public. im not sure the last half is true at all, and i guess its something we can really delve into if wanted, but since even this is a third hand rumor about something that never came to fruition - im fine letting it slide.
K-9 Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 Okay , then I misunderstood. I thought he supplied the texts from the destroyed phone, not from the one he replaced. Perfectly understandable in the wake of all the crap we have to sift through in this case. I think Goodell's final report is masterful. I wonder how much Brady's team revealed of their strategy at the appeal hearing, because Goodell is strong on every point he makes. It's hard for me to see where else Brady can take this that isn't addressed in the report. GO BILLS!!!
1billsfan Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 First, Robert Kraft needs to be shown the door. If I'm an owner I'm done with him and his over decade long cheating franchise. Secondly, Tom Brady and the Pats' ball carriers had better look good this year (i.e. inaccurate passes, fumbles) using properly inflated balls because if I was a HOF voter I would seriously consider never voting for Brady if he stinks it up and the Pats are fumbling the football left and right in 2015.
NoSaint Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 Perfectly understandable in the wake of all the crap we have to sift through in this case. I think Goodell's final report is masterful. I wonder how much Brady's team revealed of their strategy at the appeal hearing, because Goodell is strong on every point he makes. It's hard for me to see where else Brady can take this that isn't addressed in the report. GO BILLS!!! its becoming clear its worth reading the full thing before i delve further, instead of the snippets and sections in the press.
Alphadawg7 Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 Brady is without a doubt going to still be a first ballot HOF player IMO and still one of the 3 greatest to ever play the position. Everyone knows that the deflation part of this story, assuming it actually occurred, is such a minor infraction and is not the reason Brady is as good as he is. He destroyed the Colts even more with the correct ball in the second half and beat one of the best teams in NFL and defending champs to win another SB. The guy is just a great player, and one of the best to ever play. His reputation is going to suffer as a person, but anyone who has played the game, knows the game, etc is very aware about how ridiculous the air pressure of the ball has been exaggerated. And there are many players in the HOF who are guilty of far more impactful "bending of the rules" or "cheating", and several have even openly admitted to it during this debacle. At the end of the day, this should have been a small fine and then moved on. But what he is tarnishing is his image, not his resume because at the end of the day, his resume wasn't built on a ball with a little less air. But I do love watching the Pats going through all this turmoil On the other hand, every time they get pissed they come out and destroy teams on the field, so maybe its not so good for us lol.
jimmy10 Posted July 29, 2015 Posted July 29, 2015 And the other problem is now people try to compare all penalties for relative fairness, even if it's apples and oranges. If I saw one more pro-Pats** talking head say last night "Greg Hardy got 4 games and it doesn't compare to this" I was going to scream. Amazed at the ignorance, that people didn't comprehend some of Brady's punishment is for being non-cooperative - and it was about integrity of the game, not how much of an actual advantage a ball with lower PSI gives you. Every case is different with different circumstances. Not to mention Hardy was found guilty in a court of law, in the real world. And then faced sanctions within the very separate world of the NFL.
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