Kelly the Dog Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Deflate, heat, paste with stickum - they're all equivalent transgressions. You know that! The heating was not close to the same. You are allowed to heat the ball with a hand warmer, just not stand next to a machine. They were trying to get the ball more normal not less. The wiping of the ball to get the film was not remotely close to the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 thats part of the trouble when the league offers reductions based on publicly accepting penalties, or increases potentially for fighting them (have seen the threat in the past) if the rumor is true that brady would have to publicly apologize to have it reduced to 2 and if he grovelled enough it could be 1, its not that crazy for an owner to think that if the franchise steps up and accepts penalty it may help in other considerations. Unfortunately, cheating is part of the league culture. Does anyone here think that the league is not corrupt? It's going to be a tough road to change that culture. Any efforts by the NFL to change it will look hypocritical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Kraft is retarded. bless his soul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) Plea deals are common practice, aren't they? As part of a plea deal isn't admitting culpability also common?again, my point simply being that kraft wasnt crazy for thinking that him owning the punishment might help other aspects. and honestly, it may have but not enough that brady was willing to accept it. but if you want to discuss the brady admission stuff directly, ill take the side track with you. plea deals are incredibly common in court cases, and come with admission of guilt. im not sure the last time ive seen a player forced to issue a press release or press conference apologizing and the quality of that apology effecting their punishment. Im not implying its wrong to do, given their press conferences mocking the nfl especially, but i wouldnt call it common practice either. Edited July 29, 2015 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Kraft: "It is routine for discipline in the NFL to be reduced upon appeal."[/size] Thats what the problem is in the NFL today. Everyone thinks that just by appealing their suspension that it will get reduced.[/size] Does this mean Dareus can appeal and have his suspension lifted?[/size] CBF[/size] I suspect Mr Kraft would not be on board with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Who deflates balls? After taking them from the officials without authorization. And lies about only needing to go to the bathroom in a room with only a sink. Deflate, heat, paste with stickum - they're all equivalent transgressions. You know that! In terms of doctoring the balls, yes. In terms of how each team went about it and then to the extent to which they tried to cover it up? NOT EVEN IN THE SAME UNIVERSE! Keep pretending this is about deflated footballs if you want, but it's not. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 The heating was not close to the same. You are allowed to heat the ball with a hand warmer, just not stand next to a machine. They were trying to get the ball more normal not less. The wiping of the ball to get the film was not remotely close to the same. Oh please. This is just sophistry. They're all functionally the same transgression. As for stickum, Lester Hayes begs to disagree with you on whether it's an asset. http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-11-07/sports/sns-rt-us-nfl-chargers-finebre8a705v-20121107_1_towels-san-diego-chargers-nfl Stickum was banned in 1981. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 again, my point simply being that kraft wasnt crazy for thinking that him owning the punishment might help other aspects. and honestly, it may have but not enough that brady was willing to accept it. but if you want to discuss the brady admission stuff directly, ill take the side track with you. plea deals are incredibly common in court cases, and come with admission of guilt. im not sure the last time ive seen a player forced to issue a press release or press conference apologizing and the quality of that apology effecting their punishment. Im not implying its wrong to do, given their press conferences mocking the nfl especially, but i wouldnt call it common practice either. what makes you believe that brady's admission needed to be public in any way/shape/form? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) After taking them from the officials without authorization. And lies about only needing to go to the bathroom in a room with only a sink. In terms of doctoring the balls, yes. In terms of how each team went about it and then to the extent to which they tried to cover it up? NOT EVEN IN THE SAME UNIVERSE! Keep pretending this is about deflated footballs if you want, but it's not. GO BILLS!!! I don't disagree about the cover up--although the Chargers did refuse to surrender their stickum towels. This isn't directed at you, but people hate the Pats so much here that they develop silly legalistic arguments to wish away the fact that they aren't the only team doing this sort of thing. And by the way, I'm not pretending anything - I know what this is about. I just tire of the extreme bias on this board against the Pats. I do get it -- they beat the Bills like a drum twice a year (usually) and win a lot. And they have a record of gaming the system. But the ball thing is more widespread than the TBD prosecution team would have us believe. Edited July 29, 2015 by dave mcbride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Kraft is retarded. [/b] Take him to the zoo. Retards like the zoo. I will not come to Kraft's defense but Goodell's quote doesn't really mean anything. If he made a wink wink deal with Kraft he's never going to say publicly that was the case. Oh, wait, Kraft just did. Take him to the zoo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) what makes you believe that Brady's admission needed to be public in any way/shape/form? that the nfl, allegedly (and its a big allegedly but all we are really working with here is rumor anyway with regards to the punishment), refused to seal the records as part of the negotiation means that at the very least it wouldnt be private. Edited July 29, 2015 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Take him to the zoo. Retards like the zoo. I will not come to Kraft's defense but Goodell's quote doesn't really mean anything. If he made a wink wink deal with Kraft he's never going to say publicly that was the case. Oh, wait, Kraft just did. Take him to the zoo. Hahaha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I think you're wrong about that too. I strongly believe that this board would be pretty damn similar to the various Pats boards now. Here's why: the Pats are damn good, and this likely had no bearing on game outcomes. And we as fans would be subjected to the hatred of the millions, crying and whining about how the Pats' dominance should be asterisked. It's a natural instinct to react defensively to this sort of thing. Plus there is another easy way to rationalize it too -- just compare yourself to an old Raider fan. The Raiders did worse in their heyday, and it only made them more lovable. I agree with you wrt the fans' reactions, but please don't say their cheating likely had no bearing on game outcomes. The balls were under-inflated by at least 8%. They are easier to throw, catch, and hold on to than balls that are inflated to The League rock-hard standard. What if the First Down yard markers were "adjusted" so that their opponents would have to gain 30 feet to get a first down (using The League's standard), but the yard markers used by the Pats*** were just 8% shorter, i.e., 27.6 feet? Would an advantage like that have no bearing on game outcomes? They cheated, they lied, they got caught, they can go to hell for all I care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterpan Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 does anyone think this will hurt Brady with the HOF? I would love for him to not be a first ballot guy or better yet, never get in like Pete Rose. If I was a voter I would never vote for him, but thats me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I wonder what "The Deflator" is up to today.... writing a tell all book ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewin Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 It broke the day of the hearing, too? This is hilarious. One of the Boston guys yesterday said, after Brady claimed that it was his regular practice to destroy his old phone as soon as he got the new one, that not only did he not destroy his previous phone, but didn't destroy the previous two phones that Maryman was looking at. He's a pathological liar. And then in his facebook statement he says he replaced his broken phone with a new phone. Is his story now that the phone with the evidence just miraculously broke and needed to be replaced? I wonder how true the rumors are that the penalty would have been reduced if Disgraced QB Tom Brady** just apologized. Honestly that would have pissed me off - he cheated and didn't cooperate which led to the 4 games. Saying he's sorry doesn't change at all the circumstances which resulted in the punishment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 does anyone think this will hurt Brady with the HOF? I would love for him to not be a first ballot guy or better yet, never get in like Pete Rose. If I was a voter I would never vote for him, but thats me. Doubtful. tarnished but not enough to keep him out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Does this mean Dareus can appeal and have his suspension lifted? CBF Maybe. Or does it mean he's manned up and is taking his medicine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevewin Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I wonder what "The Deflator" is up to today.... 220 lbs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Oh please. This is just sophistry. They're all functionally the same transgression. As for stickum, Lester Hayes begs to disagree with you on whether it's an asset. http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-11-07/sports/sns-rt-us-nfl-chargers-finebre8a705v-20121107_1_towels-san-diego-chargers-nfl Stickum was banned in 1981. When Lester Hayes played there was more stickum than there was Lester Hayes. If you want to equate a ballboy at a freezing game, who is allowed to warm the ball with the hand warmer but it wasn't working sufficiently enough, so in order to keep the ball from freezing walked over to a heater - to - stealing all the game balls from the officials before a championship game and altering them all intentionally in a bathroom to become abnormal balls and to your advantage. Fine. It's not the same thing whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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