TakeYouToTasker Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Also, let's take this.... depends on the texts, but a lot of them are very violent towards people who don't subscribe to the same belief system, or towards those who don't follow the exact letters in the text. On top of that, you have people who interpret them in various nasty ways, to further their own gains. That being said, if a religion truly is promoting love, peace, equality, and generally being good to your neighbors no matter your differences, then awesome, I'm all for it. But more often than not, it seems the major religions are too busy promoting exclusion and violence towards those who are different. So if our murder rate is higher than another developed country's, and it's not a gun/weapon problem, and it's not a culture problem, then what is it? First of all, the United States is regionally and ethnically diverse in it's many cultures. There is no single culture in the United States. Secondly, talk to me about religious violence, first in the United States, and then on a global scale. Are all religions equal in this regard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 But more often than not, it seems the major religions are too busy promoting exclusion and violence towards those who are different. Just out of curiosity, which religions are promoting exclusion and violence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 But more often than not, it seems the major religions are too busy promoting exclusion and violence towards those who are different. I can not name a single 'major religion' that promotes exclusion and violence towards those who are different. Can you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted July 6, 2015 Author Share Posted July 6, 2015 I can not name a single 'major religion' that promotes exclusion and violence towards those who are different. Can you? Liberalism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I can not name a single 'major religion' that promotes exclusion and violence towards those who are different. Can you? Liberalism. This is why I need to stay out of PPP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 This is why I need to stay out of PPP. Ignore the sarcasm. I'm genuinely interested in which religions promote exclusion and violence towards others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted July 6, 2015 Author Share Posted July 6, 2015 This is why I need to stay out of PPP. Your inability to take a joke is part of the reason. Your inability to stake out a position and defend it is the bigger one. Of course, you'd serve yourself well to take your lumps and learn how to debate effectively. And although I said that somewhat in jest, I do believe the liberalism you and many others subscribe to is based on articles of faith more akin to religious belief than scientific study. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I'm glad... the less religious the world becomes, the more peace to be had, imo. I know it's cool to look at all strife as caused by religious nuts, and today's situation reinforces the notion, but examine the body count over the last 100 years and compare how many people perished at the hands of atheist regimes vs religious nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Ignore the sarcasm. I'm genuinely interested in which religions promote exclusion and violence towards others. If you do a google search for "religious texts advocating violence" you'll have an answer... but basically the Abrahamic religions tend to be pretty violent in their texts. I don't know much about Eastern religions though. I know it's cool to look at all strife as caused by religious nuts, and today's situation reinforces the notion, but examine the body count over the last 100 years and compare how many people perished at the hands of atheist regimes vs religious nuts. Just because I think we'd be more peaceful without religion does not mean I think religion is the single cause of all violence. Your inability to take a joke is part of the reason. Your inability to stake out a position and defend it is the bigger one. Of course, you'd serve yourself well to take your lumps and learn how to debate effectively. And although I said that somewhat in jest, I do believe the liberalism you and many others subscribe to is based on articles of faith more akin to religious belief than scientific study. It's difficult to defend my opinions when they are often misinterpreted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 People aren't waking up. They're napping. Have a couple of planes fly into buildings again and watch people jump from thirty stories because it's their best option at the time, and let's take another poll. To me, that's an example of organized religion's greatest problem. People who flock to something out of fear and hopelessness are surrendering their agency in their own lives. I'm not against religion and have seen first hand the positive impact religious institutions and communities can have on their surroundings and people. It's just not the only way to impact people, the community, or individual families in a positive manner (and I realize no one is saying that it is in this thread). As with any other institution created by man, all religions are fallible and capable of as much harm as they are capable of good. Except that church is where most people in the western world learn about God as being something more than an abstract notion. We may not agree with how church portrays God, but church is where most in our society go to learn about or to find Him. Spirituality, like faith, is inspired - it doesn't exist on it's own within us. The desire to search for spirituality exists in all of us to one extent or another, but humanity has always needed to either discover or create that inspiration before spirituality can be attained. Although I'm not a very religious person, I was raised attending a protestant church most Sundays. While I never took the lessons taught in Sunday school literally, the morals learned there have been a positive influence in helping guide me through all the ups & downs in my life, and although church is certainly not the only place those values can be learned, it's been a source of spiritual inspiration for many people for many years. I hear what you're saying, and respect it. To me though, the bolded part is where religion becomes crippling to human progress. Western religions predominately preach the bolded, that humanity is dependent upon a higher being to be saved. No matter what we do below, we will eventually be saved by someone from above. All it takes is faith. That completely removes individual responsibility for our actions while also reinforcing the idea that we as individuals are spiritually inept. There's never been a more destructive myth sold to humanity. It reinforces a victim's mentality on a spiritual level in the effort to promote control rather than true enlightenment. Question: What does it mean to be spiritual but not religious? Spirituality is universal, the knowing that we're not alone. That we are all a part of something deeper and are all connected in more ways than we can possibly fathom while in this life. It's simply the acknowledgment that we are all one without a regimented or theologically derived set of preconceived notions of the divine. Religions are specific, purporting to have answers to the great unknown questions. Both are ultimately the same thing: software for accessing the divine operating system. Each one may be coded differently, each one has its own quarks and loyal users, but they all run on the same piece of hardware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Just because I think we'd be more peaceful without religion does not mean I think religion is the single cause of all violence. It's difficult to defend my opinions when they are often misinterpreted. Why would you think that we'd be more peaceful without religion? Your opinions aren't misinterpreted at all, btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Why would you think that we'd be more peaceful without religion? Your opinions aren't misinterpreted at all, btw. Because people like to fight over their god, or like to commit acts (small and large) of hate against those who don't act in accordance to their own specific belief. It's not just car bombs and beheadings. Even small things like following a gay couple and calling them names, because (a version of) their bible says that gays are bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Because people like to fight over their god, or like to commit acts (small and large) of hate against those who don't act in accordance to their own specific belief. It's not just car bombs and beheadings. Even small things like following a gay couple and calling them names, because (a version of) their bible says that gays are bad. Or hate-shaming a baker because he won't bake a wedding cake for a non-traditional marriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Because people like to fight over their god, or like to commit acts (small and large) of hate against those who don't act in accordance to their own specific belief. It's not just car bombs and beheadings. Even small things like following a gay couple and calling them names, because (a version of) their bible says that gays are bad. Quick, what was Adam Lanza's religion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Quick, what was Adam Lanza's religion? I've seen both Catholic and Atheist mentioned... but lets say for the discussion, he was Atheist. What Atheist texts are there that say certain people should be attacked/killed for non Atheist approved views/actions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I'm an atheist and jeez ... even I think if more people followed the true relgious texts the world would be more peaceful. But this world is full of apologists and those who always excuse their shortcomings. If this world practiced what it preached we would be better off - dorkington you're crazy. You can be atheist and peaceful but you can be religious and peaceful, too. The shame is that most religious people are pure hypocrites - I just spent the 4th of July with some huge hypocrites. I've never felt such hate and judgement but they're peaceful people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Or hate-shaming a baker because he won't bake a wedding cake for a non-traditional marriage. What's the definition of a "traditional marriage"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I can not name a single 'major religion' that promotes exclusion and violence towards those who are different. Can you? Islam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdnlng Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 What's the definition of a "traditional marriage"? Don't be obtuse. You know what it is and it isn't two guys or two woman or the polygamists from Montana who applied for a marriage license for all 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 (edited) Don't be obtuse. You know what it is and it isn't two guys or two woman or the polygamists from Montana who applied for a marriage license for all 3. Two consenting adults joining in a government sponsored contract? Or a non consenting child female being given over to a land owner in exchange for some cows? Edit: This is fun http://www.livescience.com/37777-history-of-marriage.html Edited July 6, 2015 by Dorkington Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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