jethro_tull Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 except the 85 bears got whipped by the dolphins I think the 2002 bucs deserve honorable mention Sapp, rice, Brooks, barber, Lynch... they could bring it and with Brooks ability to drop back they were versatile. yes
BillsPride12 Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 Though the question is can the Bills get to that level? I think the talent is on the field to get there. Now it is scheme, desire, a little help from the offense (limited turnovers and decent time of possession) and luck (guys staying healthy) We obviously have alot of talent on our defense. Primarily our bread and butter is within the front 4 and everybody else benefits from the pressure they generate. I think if we would have pulled the trigger on another stud playmaker like Khalil Mack then that would've put us on that elite level of the Golden Defenses of Chicago, Baltimore, Tampa. With that said drafting Sammy was a huge addition for us as well so I really don't have any complaints. The big thing with the Watkins pick is will we ever find a Qb good enough to allow Sammy Swat to truly flourish with us?
OCinBuffalo Posted June 28, 2015 Author Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) How does the 2000 Ravens D stack up? Ok, I did my own research: 12-4 W-L 165 Points Allowed 247.9 Yards Allowed/Game 60.6 Rushing Yards/Game 23 INT (but 49 total turnovers) 35 Sacks Pretty damn good As I said: I have more than enough to prove the 1985 Bears are the best, I just didn't post it. The reason they are better than the 2000 Ravens, who were very good(the other all-time candidate is the 1976 Steelers, btw), is the schedule. The Ravens played mostly weak teams, while the Bears played 5 eventual playoff teams(in an era where 5, not 6, teams made the playoffs per conference, if now, they would have beaten a 6th in the Redskins), including the Monata 49ers, the Marino Dolphins, and beat Dallas 44-0 in their own stadium, which remains their all time worst beating. Yes, the Bears lost to Miami, but, they said they were too cocky going in, that losing that game got them re-focused, and is the biggest reason they won the SB. If you look at total offense on the season, it's not even close: the Ravens played lesser teams. The reason the Steelers aren't the best? Their O had 5 HOFers. The Bears had Walter Payton...with McMahon and Willie Gualt? Please. EDIT: Fun fact. The 1985 Bears D outscored the opposing offense, 3 games in a row. So the Bears success was about studs like Duerson, Fencik, Frazier, and Richardson? And not about guys like Singletary, Dent, McMichael, Marshal, Perry, Wilson, and Hampton? Yeah, ok. A dominate front 7 can make any DBs look great. The same cannot be said about dominate DBs for the front 7. But to your main point, yeah they were unbelievable and so were the Ravens as pointed out above. The Bears success was about the ENTIRE TEAM on D. The 46 required Fencik and Marshall, at minimum, to blitz, while it left the CBs in single coverage islands, every single play. Everybody on that team was going after the QB, except the CBs and 1 S. So, yeah, it's a team effort. Teams knew it was coming, and would try to shift protection, only to have Singletary shift the defense. If they shifted again, he would shift again. You can only do that with highly intelligent, and athletic D lineman, LBs, and SS...and also shut-down CBs. You need an entire team, working together. The reason why the 1985 Bears are the best is that the whole was greater, despite the HOF value of many of the the parts, than the sum. Which...is why I even dared to bring up the 1985 Bears as a potential comparison in the first place. We certainly have the pieces. Whether we have the team, which depends on coaching, attitude, and hustle, remains to be seen. As you mentioned, the rules have changed. Hence the reason why we weren't close to them last year and won't be again this year. No. I had faith in my fellow TSW posters, and figured that they would figure some ways to do the statistical adjustments, as they did. I certainly could have done it myself, but, that would be a very long OP, and, it takes the fun out of it for everybody else. It's June. I'm trying to conduct an interesting thread, rather than yet another "list the best/worst X in the NFL" article. Would you rather have me conduct a draft of TV shows instead? rules are different now. cannot compare to teams 30 years ago. the NFL is vastly different than in the early 80's . not worth pursuing this discussion. Sure it is, for 3 reasons: 1. As already shown above, adjustments can be made to the stats, that, if we can all get behind their method, serve as useful indicators 2. As was already said, the 1986 Bears D was statistically better, but...nobody cares. 3. Everybody knows about the rules changes, even since 2000(and the Ravens), and, everybody knows about FA now. However, if you ask anybody with reasonable football knowledge, and certainly, if you ask anybody in the media: the 1985 Bears are still the best. If we want to take their place as "the best" in the consciousness of NFL fans, we have to beat them/make a sound statistical, as well as games won, case. Edited June 28, 2015 by OCinBuffalo
Kelly the Dog Posted June 28, 2015 Posted June 28, 2015 The Ravens had a whole staff of very good coaches but the 85 Bears had Buddy Ryan who was a defensive genius, and the 46 defense was something that teams really didn't know how to prepare for it yet. Ryan's defensive teams on the Eagles and even the Cardinals were killers. The Bears were able to terrorize and confuse offenses more than the Ravens defense could.
jethro_tull Posted June 29, 2015 Posted June 29, 2015 "in closing,..." what, is this a junior high term paper? but seriously, you could be on to something. our coach is the son of the '85 Bears defense architect!!!!!
LB3 Posted June 30, 2015 Posted June 30, 2015 (edited) This seems like as good a place as any to put this. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/06/29/bills-think-they-can-have-the-greatest-defense-ever/ Asked about the defenses goal for the season,Marcell Dareus answered, "Best ever. Its so obtainable. All we have to do is continue to do what we want, and not what we can. If we do what we want, and do everything to head in that direction, why cant we? Why cant we?" Edited June 30, 2015 by LBSeeBallLBGetBall
YoloinOhio Posted June 30, 2015 Posted June 30, 2015 (edited) This seems like as good a place as any to put this. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/06/29/bills-think-they-can-have-the-greatest-defense-ever/ saw this too. Wow the expectations are huge internally. I'll take it! Much better than " it's hard to win in the nfl" Edited June 30, 2015 by YoloinOhio
LB3 Posted June 30, 2015 Posted June 30, 2015 saw this too. Wow the expectations are huge internally. I'll take it! Much better than " it's hard to win in the nfl" Exactly. Nothing wrong with having big goals.
3rdand12 Posted June 30, 2015 Posted June 30, 2015 I might be lead to believe. that Rex and Thurman Hendy and company will achieve greatness this year. if not legendary status. and if continuity can be maintained 2016 might be even better. we all know the contracts. but we still have strong players up and coming on that side of the ball. its potential is pretty darned good IMO. We say window , but KW is injury free and M W is peaking nearly.. we have Hughes locked in. MD is the only ? contractually. not bad. maybe the best combo up front in the game. especially under a Ryan D. thats still has plenty O' wrinkles yet to be revealed Go Bills
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