stevestojan Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 The Bills have never gotten rid of guys who end up performing better on other teams, ESPECIALLY running backs...
Kelly the Dog Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 The NFL has faulty economics involved. Freddy is a better player. Period I think so, too. I love Fred. I like him as a player more than I like CJ. A lot more. And yet on the same team, CJ averages more yards per carry and Fred has never had an entire season as good as CJ's best season.
FireChan Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 (edited) I think so, too. I love Fred. I like him as a player more than I like CJ. A lot more. And yet on the same team, CJ averages more yards per carry and Fred has never had an entire season as good as CJ's best season. Fred's ability is not just demonstrated by numbers. Football IQ, vision, balance and blocking all go into the metric of "football player." None of those things get stat lines. Fred's brain in Spiller's body is one of the best RB's of all time. Whereas the converse is Tashard Choice. Edited June 25, 2015 by FireChan
dave mcbride Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 (edited) The difference between Fred and CJ: Fans love Fred for what he's done. Fans love CJ because of what he's capable of doing. I think that's mostly true, but Spiller did have a terrific season in 2012 -- better than any of Fred's seasons. Fred would have bested him if he had remained healthy in 2011, but he got hurt. Edited June 25, 2015 by dave mcbride
The Big Cat Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 I think so, too. I love Fred. I like him as a player more than I like CJ. A lot more. And yet on the same team, CJ averages more yards per carry and Fred has never had an entire season as good as CJ's best season. Yet, anyone in their right mind would call CJ's best season an aberration, at worst and a product of a very specific taylored-scheme, at best. He's never come CLOSE to replicating the production he enjoyed that year. I'll take a guy who's a steady stream of 7's and 8's over a guy who gets one 10 and comes in around 3 the rest of the time.
FireChan Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Yet, anyone in their right mind would call CJ's best season an aberration, at worst and a product of a very specific taylored-scheme, at best. He's never come CLOSE to replicating the production he enjoyed that year. I'll take a guy who's a steady stream of 7's and 8's over a guy who gets one 10 and comes in around 3 the rest of the time. I'd call it a tyroded-scheme, at best
Kelly the Dog Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Yet, anyone in their right mind would call CJ's best season an aberration, at worst and a product of a very specific taylored-scheme, at best. He's never come CLOSE to replicating the production he enjoyed that year. I'll take a guy who's a steady stream of 7's and 8's over a guy who gets one 10 and comes in around 3 the rest of the time. No, haters think that. As many or more other people think that was easily the only season he was healthy and used correctly - because his talents and his weaknesses are glaringly clear. If you read national reports and articles about him, they will say he was glaringly misused by Doug Marrone. When he was a rookie, he was in a backfield with Marshawn and Fred in his prime.
Malazan Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Superstar...no. Star...maybe. Superstars don't need coaches to "figure out how to use them". There's no question if someone is a superstar.
dave mcbride Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Yet, anyone in their right mind would call CJ's best season an aberration, at worst and a product of a very specific taylored-scheme, at best. He's never come CLOSE to replicating the production he enjoyed that year. I'll take a guy who's a steady stream of 7's and 8's over a guy who gets one 10 and comes in around 3 the rest of the time. Actually, after Jackson went down over halfway through game 10 of 2011, Spiller assumed the starting role and in the next six games had 446 yards on 86 carries (5.2 ypc). Extrapolated over 16 games, that adds up to 1190 yards - almost identical to what he had in 2012 (stats, Dog!). The problem for Spiller was the departure of an experienced NFL offensive coordinator and a QB who knew how to run an offense. He was also used horribly by Marrone/Hackett. I wouldn't be shocked if he puts up 1200-1400 yards from scrimmage this season, with 5+ ypc and 8+ yards per reception. No RBs in the NO offense get massive numbers, but they'll be highly productive if they're talented given the excellent offensive coaching and the elite QBing.
Kelly the Dog Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Actually, after Jackson went down over halfway through game 10 of 2011, Spiller assumed the starting role and in the next six games had 446 yards on 86 carries (5.2 ypc). Extrapolated over 16 games, that adds up to 1190 yards - almost identical to what he had in 2012 (stats, Dog!). The problem for Spiller was the departure of an experienced NFL offensive coordinator and a QB who knew how to run an offense. He was also used horribly by Marrone/Hackett. Raw stats without context are bad! Not all stats are bad!! That had context.
NoSaint Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Superstar...no. Star...maybe. Superstars don't need coaches to "figure out how to use them". There's no question if someone is a superstar. agree and disagree. plenty of greats would be ordinary or worse if dropped in the wrong system. how broad the range is for guys is certainly up for debate but if you drop a guy in a spot that plays to his weaknesses and doesnt have the right support -- even greats can and will struggle.
Kirby Jackson Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 agree and disagree. plenty of greats would be ordinary or worse if dropped in the wrong system. how broad the range is for guys is certainly up for debate but if you drop a guy in a spot that plays to his weaknesses and doesnt have the right support -- even greats can and will struggle.Wes Welker, Jerome Bettis, Haloti Ngata, Revis (maybe the best example), Sherman, Marshawn and Marvin Harrison are all examples of guys that would have been good players anywhere but are (or were) enhanced by the environment in which they play(ed).
Mr. WEO Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Does CJ eclipse that elusive 2 TD benchmark this year with the Saints? It's never been about TDs for Spiller---it's about "home runs"!! I prefer pepperoni on my pizza. Sausage is okay sometimes, and if my wife is in a bad mood and I just want to appease her, I'll spring for green peppers and onions. Who knows more about cars, you or Santa Clause? Ba BOOM!. Very nice....
3rdand12 Posted June 25, 2015 Posted June 25, 2015 Actually, after Jackson went down over halfway through game 10 of 2011, Spiller assumed the starting role and in the next six games had 446 yards on 86 carries (5.2 ypc). Extrapolated over 16 games, that adds up to 1190 yards - almost identical to what he had in 2012 (stats, Dog!). The problem for Spiller was the departure of an experienced NFL offensive coordinator and a QB who knew how to run an offense. He was also used horribly by Marrone/Hackett. I wouldn't be shocked if he puts up 1200-1400 yards from scrimmage this season, with 5+ ypc and 8+ yards per reception. No RBs in the NO offense get massive numbers, but they'll be highly productive if they're talented given the excellent offensive coaching and the elite QBing. be careful.with that prediction my friend, they are running by committee is my understanding. Payton is probably the best thing that could have happened to CJ Spiller. wishing him well. and now i have a reason to watch a Saints game or too. and to see if Byrd's injured his footie agree and disagree. plenty of greats would be ordinary or worse if dropped in the wrong system. how broad the range is for guys is certainly up for debate but if you drop a guy in a spot that plays to his weaknesses and doesnt have the right support -- even greats can and will struggle. I think that is one of the most interesting features of the NFL. the cocktail that makes a successful player long term. its not just a Jack and Coke. QB is the extreme of that.
Bill from NYC Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 He played at the goaline. That is to be expected. The point is obvious anyway. This would lower his ypc stats.
Maury Ballstein Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 (edited) Unbelievable some of the CJ hate I see here. Trashing him with numbers accumulated while hurt ? Yea that tells the whole story. Wonder if he's as bad as that crappy skittles eating rb we traded to Seattle. Fail city. Go CJ! Edited June 26, 2015 by Ryan L Billz
MyHorseAteTheKid Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 CJ Spiller... I would love to see this guy take off and be the same kind of special player that Marshawn Lynch has become!!!
C.Biscuit97 Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 Spiller was arguably the best offensive player in his draft and one of the best offensive weapons in the NFL before the Syracuse coaching staff showed up. Some of you put way too much stock into the opinions of Jacksonville Jags assistant coaches. Barring injury, Spiller will have at least 1,200 total yards from scrimmage. PM me if you want to be some jelly beans on it. Unbelievable some of the CJ hate I see here. Trashing him with numbers accumulated while hurt ? Yea that tells the whole story. Wonder if he's as bad as that crappy skittles eating rb we traded to Seattle.Fail city. Go CJ! You don't get it. Marrone and his staff ran an electric offense. If you can't thrive under Marrone, you suck. Marrone >>>>>> Payton
NoSaint Posted June 26, 2015 Posted June 26, 2015 Roman didn't want Spiller either. The bills allegedly were willing to offer a nice contract, weren't they?
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