Church Shooting

[boyst]

I thought this was the sc state flag? It's all you see there.

[B-Man]

Governor Haley gave recognition to the different “viewpoints” of the meaning of the flag, but, she said, “It’s time to move the flag from the capitol grounds.” That brought huge applause. She said , “Some people will see this as a sad moment… but this flag, while an integral part of our past, does not belong in our future…. By removing a symbol that divides us, we can move forward in harmony,” honoring the “9 souls… who are in Heaven.”

 

Haley stressed that this was a decision for South Carolina to make and that many people outside of the state have been distorting the meaning of the flag. It doesn’t mean hate, she assures us, but it has caused “pain to so many,” and that is the reason for banishing it from the state house grounds.

 

This is not a “ban” of the flag, as some people say. Individuals remain free to to display the flag themselves, a freedom Haley mentioned in her speech. This is the speech of the government’s, for the people as a whole, as it decides what to display on the grounds, and government gets to choose how it will speak. Governor Haley is taking the best position, I think.

[Magox]

 

Because no one's otherwise benign views or political philosophies should be invalidated because some people have decided to lable their sybolism as racist, and then have decided to be offended by it in our hyper-PC culture.

 

The Confederate flag is not objectively a symbol of racism. Conversely, it is objectively a symbol of State's Rights and of self determination.

 

Further, it will not help with racial divide, as it's just one more example of individuals and institutions which are not racist being labled as racist by race baiters for political purposes, and politicians capitulating because it's politically expediant.

That's your opinion that is not shared by many others. The elected officials that represent the state of South Carolina made a decision to remove the flag from government property, and I support that decision.

 

I'm just tired of us, as a country, turning one tragedy after another into some moronic topic or symbol that most Americans really couldn't care less about.

 

When the flag is down, and the event is passed, and discussing it carries no more political weight, what is the next thing we'll need to get rid of when the world realizes that getting rid of the flag doesn't stop idiots from murdering people?

 

If it's not that important to you, then why get so upset? Clearly for many African Americans and others its an important symbolic move, that in my view was long over due.

[TakeYouToTasker]

Governor Haley gave recognition to the different “viewpoints” of the meaning of the flag, but, she said, “It’s time to move the flag from the capitol grounds.” That brought huge applause. She said , “Some people will see this as a sad moment… but this flag, while an integral part of our past, does not belong in our future…. By removing a symbol that divides us, we can move forward in harmony,” honoring the “9 souls… who are in Heaven.”

 

Haley stressed that this was a decision for South Carolina to make and that many people outside of the state have been distorting the meaning of the flag. It doesn’t mean hate, she assures us, but it has caused “pain to so many,” and that is the reason for banishing it from the state house grounds.

 

This is not a “ban” of the flag, as some people say. Individuals remain free to to display the flag themselves, a freedom Haley mentioned in her speech. This is the speech of the government’s, for the people as a whole, as it decides what to display on the grounds, and government gets to choose how it will speak. Governor Haley is taking the best position, I think.

 

And I feel that a state doing away with a symbol of State's Rights under pressure for race baiters who's real goal is absolute federal supremacy, and to lable opposition as racist to squash dissent, is a terrible idea.

[Magox]

Governor Haley gave recognition to the different “viewpoints” of the meaning of the flag, but, she said, “It’s time to move the flag from the capitol grounds.” That brought huge applause. She said , “Some people will see this as a sad moment… but this flag, while an integral part of our past, does not belong in our future…. By removing a symbol that divides us, we can move forward in harmony,” honoring the “9 souls… who are in Heaven.”

 

Haley stressed that this was a decision for South Carolina to make and that many people outside of the state have been distorting the meaning of the flag. It doesn’t mean hate, she assures us, but it has caused “pain to so many,” and that is the reason for banishing it from the state house grounds.

 

This is not a “ban” of the flag, as some people say. Individuals remain free to to display the flag themselves, a freedom Haley mentioned in her speech. This is the speech of the government’s, for the people as a whole, as it decides what to display on the grounds, and government gets to choose how it will speak. Governor Haley is taking the best position, I think.

 

Absolutely Bman. The speech she made, in my view was about as well said as could have possibly been made.

 

And I feel that a state doing away with a symbol of State's Rights under pressure for race baiters who's real goal is absolute federal supremacy, and to lable opposition as racist to squash dissent, is a terrible idea.

 

The elected officials of South Carolina disagree with you.

[TakeYouToTasker]

That's your opinion that is not shared by many others. The elected officials that represent the state of South Carolina made a decision to remove the flag from government property, and I support that decision.

 

When your view is in lock step with the Huffington Post, it's generally time to reconsider.

 

Further, popularity should never be conflated with accuracy: a mistake you're making here.

 

A carefully constructed narative has been constructed, and is now being executed. The ultimate goal being the painting of small government as inherently racist. It's history is under attack, and unfortunately General Lee is surrendering yet again.

[boyst]

Irony! Your free speech oppresses my free speech! Muh freedoms!

 

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/confederate-statues-defaced-charleston-shooting-black-lives-matter/

 

Confederate statues in South Carolina, Maryland and Texas were discovered defaced this week with the words "Black Lives Matter."

 

The discoveries come just days someone vandalized a Confederate monument less than 2 miles from the racially-inspired mass shooting in Charleston, S.C.

 

In that case, a Confederate monument near the Emanuel A.M.E. Church was also spray-painted with the phrase "Black Lives Matter," as well as the message "This is the problem. #RACIST."

 

CBS affiliate WCSC in Charleston reports that a second Confederate monument was discovered defaced on Tuesday.

[TakeYouToTasker]

The elected officials of South Carolina disagree with you.

 

No they didn't. The statement was that the flag did not symbolize racism, but that they were capitulating rather than being labled as racist. It's hard to maintain your political power when you're being falsely labled a racist.

[Magox]

 

When your view is in lock step with the Huffington Post, it's generally time to reconsider.

 

Further, popularity should never be conflated with accuracy: a mistake you're making here.

 

A carefully constructed narative has been constructed, and is now being executed. The ultimate goal being the painting of small government as inherently racist. It's history is under attack, and unfortunately General Lee is surrendering yet again.

 

Oh, so if you agree with the removal of the confederate flag from government property, you are now in lock step with the Huffington post?

 

I tell you what, next time you vote, vote for someone who supports placing the Confederate flag on government property. Problem solved.

 

No they didn't. The statement was that the flag did not symbolize racism, but that they were capitulating rather than being labled as racist. It's hard to maintain your political power when you're being falsely labled a racist.

 

No, you are wrong.

[birdog1960]

_{history explains the symbolism of the flag:}

 

 

_{"After the war ended, the symbol became a source of Southern pride and heritage, as well as a remembrance of Confederate soldiers who died in battle. But as racism and segregation gripped the nation in the century following, it became a divisive and violent emblem of the Ku Klux Klan and white supremacist groups. It was also the symbol of the States' Rights Democratic Party, or "Dixiecrats," that formed in 1948 to oppose civil-rights platforms of the Democratic Party. Then-South Carolina Gov. Strom Thurmond was the splinter group's nominee for president that same year; he won 39 electoral votes"}

 

_{http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2015/06/22/416548613/the-complicated-political-history-of-the-confederate-flag}

Edited June 23, 2015 by birdog1960

[TakeYouToTasker]

 

Oh, so if you agree with the removal of the confederate flag from government property, you are now in lock step with the Huffington post?

 

No, you're in lock step with the Huffington Post when you mirror their sentiments, which you're done here.

 

 

 

No, you are wrong.

Channeling gatorman?

Edited June 23, 2015 by TakeYouToTasker

[3rdnlng]

http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/2015/06/23/obama-logic-racism-is-genetic-gender-is-a-choice/?subscriber=1

 

It’s highly ironic that Obama would lecture others about racism, since he was admittedly “schooled” in anti-white racism by communist atheist Frank Marshall Davis. One Davis poem, “Christ is a Dixie !@#$,” dismissed Jesus Christ as “another New White Hope.”

Another Davis poem, “Onward Christian Soldiers,” mocks the Christian hymn by the same name and talks of Africans being killed with a “Christian gun” instead of a spear by the missionaries following “the religion of Sweet Jesus.”

So is Christianity one of the institutions that Obama says is saturated with racism? That surely can’t be the case since mass murderer Dylann Roof, a deranged drug abuser, opened fire in a black Christian church. The response from the families of those killed has mostly been Christian forgiveness and mercy.

We see in the Obama interview with comedian Marc Maron the same kind of anger and bitterness that was drilled into him at a young age by Frank Marshall Davis in Hawaii. The enemy, from the point of view of Marxist community organizers, is white supremacy. This is what has to be emphasized, over and over again, in order to get more black people agitated.

Roof targeted black Christians and said in his alleged manifesto that he became upset over the evidence of black-on-white crime he found on a website. That was no excuse for mass murder, but the fact is that crime of that nature is a terrible reality, as Colin Flaherty has documented in two books. The failure by the liberal media to even cover this problem is a source of frustration to those who seriously seek answers to criminal behavior in modern society and want to restore law and order in our major cities. The answer must be found, if the inner cities of America are to be saved.

Instead, our media act as if such crime doesn’t exist.

As investigative journalist Jim Simpson wrote in an AIM special report, “The media have relentlessly fanned the flames of racial hatred, while engaging in a systematic pattern of misinformation and blatant suppression of facts surrounding the perpetrators and victims of crime.” The media, blinded by political correctness, refuse to face reality.

So who was this white man named Dylann Roof? He committed mass murder, in an act that can be accurately described as terroristic in nature, and wanted to ignite a race war. He was photographed holding a Confederate flag and had sympathy for white-ruled nations. But he was also a drug abuser who came from a dysfunctional family. Significantly, he was also photographed with his feet planted on and burning an American flag. He hated what America had become in fighting a civil war to overcome the confederacy.

So while he hated America for what it is, the agitators on the left still complain about what America used to be. These extremists are strange bedfellows who need one another to make sure racial progress can be frustrated and that racial divisions can be exploited for political purposes.

Not surprisingly, the Confederate flag has now become the center of media preoccupation, when we have had six years of an administration in Washington, D.C. that has faulted white people, “gun violence,” or the police for the systematic problems in the black community. Public interest lawyer Larry Klayman noted, “Barack Obama and Eric Holder created much of this atmosphere of anger, bitterness and bile with their disdain of whites and not too transparent belief and actions that we must now pay what are in effect reparations to the black community, even though this generation does not practice or advocate slavery.”

[TH3]

 

And I feel that a state doing away with a symbol of State's Rights under pressure for race baiters who's real goal is absolute federal supremacy, and to lable opposition as racist to squash dissent, is a terrible idea.

 

 

Dood, the race baiters were the angry white guys in the SC legislature who decided that the con flag should go on the SC state house in the early sixties as a direct response to civil rights legislation - you know - shove it in the face of minorities - you knew that right?

 

You also surely know that SC was the port of entry for most slaves from Africa - SC is the cradle of American Slavery.....

Edited June 23, 2015 by baskin

[birdog1960]

 

http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/2015/06/23/obama-logic-racism-is-genetic-gender-is-a-choice/?subscriber=1

 

It’s highly ironic that Obama would lecture others about racism, since he was admittedly “schooled” in anti-white racism by communist atheist Frank Marshall Davis. One Davis poem, “Christ is a Dixie !@#$,” dismissed Jesus Christ as “another New White Hope.”

Another Davis poem, “Onward Christian Soldiers,” mocks the Christian hymn by the same name and talks of Africans being killed with a “Christian gun” instead of a spear by the missionaries following “the religion of Sweet Jesus.”

So is Christianity one of the institutions that Obama says is saturated with racism? That surely can’t be the case since mass murderer Dylann Roof, a deranged drug abuser, opened fire in a black Christian church. The response from the families of those killed has mostly been Christian forgiveness and mercy.

We see in the Obama interview with comedian Marc Maron the same kind of anger and bitterness that was drilled into him at a young age by Frank Marshall Davis in Hawaii. The enemy, from the point of view of Marxist community organizers, is white supremacy. This is what has to be emphasized, over and over again, in order to get more black people agitated.

Roof targeted black Christians and said in his alleged manifesto that he became upset over the evidence of black-on-white crime he found on a website. That was no excuse for mass murder, but the fact is that crime of that nature is a terrible reality, as Colin Flaherty has documented in two books. The failure by the liberal media to even cover this problem is a source of frustration to those who seriously seek answers to criminal behavior in modern society and want to restore law and order in our major cities. The answer must be found, if the inner cities of America are to be saved.

Instead, our media act as if such crime doesn’t exist.

As investigative journalist Jim Simpson wrote in an AIM special report, “The media have relentlessly fanned the flames of racial hatred, while engaging in a systematic pattern of misinformation and blatant suppression of facts surrounding the perpetrators and victims of crime.” The media, blinded by political correctness, refuse to face reality.

So who was this white man named Dylann Roof? He committed mass murder, in an act that can be accurately described as terroristic in nature, and wanted to ignite a race war. He was photographed holding a Confederate flag and had sympathy for white-ruled nations. But he was also a drug abuser who came from a dysfunctional family. Significantly, he was also photographed with his feet planted on and burning an American flag. He hated what America had become in fighting a civil war to overcome the confederacy.

So while he hated America for what it is, the agitators on the left still complain about what America used to be. These extremists are strange bedfellows who need one another to make sure racial progress can be frustrated and that racial divisions can be exploited for political purposes.

Not surprisingly, the Confederate flag has now become the center of media preoccupation, when we have had six years of an administration in Washington, D.C. that has faulted white people, “gun violence,” or the police for the systematic problems in the black community. Public interest lawyer Larry Klayman noted, “Barack Obama and Eric Holder created much of this atmosphere of anger, bitterness and bile with their disdain of whites and not too transparent belief and actions that we must now pay what are in effect reparations to the black community, even though this generation does not practice or advocate slavery.”

those and some other not very admirable, desirable or attractive traits comprise a fairly accurate profile of many american racists.

 

 

 

Dood, the race baiters were the angry white guys in the SC legislature who decided that the con flag should go on the SC state house in the early sixties as a direct response to civil rights legislation - you know - shove it in the face of minorities - you knew that right?

 

You also surely know that SC was the port of entry for most slaves from Africa - SC is the cradle of American Slavery.....

 

they almost certainly know. but conceding this would concede the more fundamental reasons for the defense of the symbol.

Edited June 23, 2015 by birdog1960

[TakeYouToTasker]

 

 

Dood, the race baiters were the angry white guys in the SC legislature who decided that the con flag should go on the SC state house in the early sixties as a direct response to civil rights legislation - you know - shove it in the face of minorities - you knew that right?

 

It was erected as a symbol of southern soveriegnty, during a time of unprecedented federal intervention. The fact that you've decided that State's Rights are racist doesn't make it so, it just makes you a moron.

 

 

 

You also surely know that SC was the port of entry for most slaves from Africa - SC is the cradle of American Slavery.....

You surely know that the importation of slaves was banned in 1808. No, wait, you surely don't know that, as you don't seem to have any understanding of the subject matter.

[/dev/null]

With all due respect, the fact is, we had four nine dead Americans! Was it because of a protest flag or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided they'd go kill some Americans?

 

What difference at this point does it make?

Edited June 23, 2015 by /dev/null

[TakeYouToTasker]

those and some other not very admirable, desirable or attractive traits comprise a fairly accurate profile of many american racists.

 

 

they almost certainly know. but conceding this would concede the more fundamental reasons for the defense of the symbol.

 

I've never seen a more ghettoized mind.

 

You, and those of your ilk, are precisely the problem with race relations in this country today. You don't like my stance on State's Rights, so of course I'm a racist.

 

This is exactly why there can be no conversation about issues, and why the counrty is irrepairably fractured. I'm not willing to dicuss issues with anyone who begins discussions with ugly, unfounded charges of racism. Instead, I dismiss you, and your views, since there is no possibility of comming together with you.

 

As an aside, this is why the concept of "disunity" has so much merit, and is such a good idea. We can't reconcile our differences, so we should go our own separate ways.

[Magox]

No, you're in lock step with the Huffington Post when you mirror their sentiments, which you're done here.

 

 

 

Channeling gatorman?

 

[birdog1960]

 

It was erected as a symbol of southern soveriegnty, during a time of unprecedented federal intervention.

so you mean like the assurance of equal rights under the law? that kind of federal intervention?

 

was strom thurmond a hero of yours?

 

In opposition to the Civil Rights Act of 1957, he conducted the longest filibuster ever by a lone senator, at 24 hours and 18 minutes in length, nonstop. In the 1960s, he opposed the civil rights legislation of 1964 and 1965 to end segregation and enforce the constitutional rights of African-American citizens, including suffrage. He always insisted he had never been a racist, but was opposed to excessive federal authority. He attributed the movement to practice constitutional rights to Communist agitators.^[5] In 1948, Thurmond stated:

"all the laws of Washington and all the bayonets of the

Army cannot force the Negro into our homes, into our schools, our churches and our places of recreation and amusement."

[

5

]

Starting in the 1970s, he moderated his position on race, but continued to defend his early segregationist campaigns on the basis of states' rights in the context of Southern society at the time.^[6] He never fully renounced his earlier viewpoints.^[7][8]

Six months after Thurmond died in 2003, his mixed-race, grown daughter Essie Mae Washington-Williams revealed that he was her father. Her mother Carrie Butler had been 16 years old and working as his family's maid when she became involved with Thurmond, who was 22. Although Thurmond never publicly acknowledged Essie Mae Washington, he paid for her education at a historically black college and passed other money to her for some time. She said that she kept silent out of respect for her father^[9] and denied that the two had agreed that she would not reveal her connection to Thurmond.^[10] His children by his marriage eventually acknowledged her.^[9] Her name has since been added as one of his children to his memorial at the state capital

 

so i suppose the laws and the army didn't have to force a negro into his bed, then.

Edited June 23, 2015 by birdog1960

[Deranged Rhino]

 

The Confederate flag is not objectively a symbol of racism. Conversely, it is objectively a symbol of State's Rights and of self determination ... to own slaves.

 

 

 

Amended for accuracy.

 

The underlying State's Right at issue was slavery. You just cannot separate the two.

 

 

Channeling gatorman?

 

Not channeling, he just forgot he wasn't logged in as gator.