BADOLBILZ Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Thanks. I'm sure they knew about CW's back. But his ended up being just a 1-year $3.5M deal. Not in the same ballpark. Actually it added up to $7.5M for 3 games played. His signing bonus alone was an inexplicable $5.5M.
Doc Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Actually it added up to $7.5M for 3 games played. His signing bonus alone was an inexplicable $5.5M. Spotrac has it as $3.5M signing bonus/guaranteed.
BADOLBILZ Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Spotrac has it as $3.5M signing bonus/guaranteed. Rotoworld says 4 year $13.5M with $5.5M guaranteed for PFF's 74th rated OG(out of 81 ). The Titans aren't pleased with Levitre but they have held on to him because they have a rookie QB starting and they actually hope he will bounce back. He had knee and hip injuries and then appendectomy before the season last year and that subsequently was the first season where he hasn't ranked as a high quality player on PFF scale since his rookie season. Chris Williams is just purdy bad. When healthy.
Doc Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Rotoworld says 4 year $13.5M with $5.5M guaranteed for PFF's 74th rated OG(out of 81 ). The Titans aren't pleased with Levitre but they have held on to him because they have a rookie QB starting and they actually hope he will bounce back. He had knee and hip injuries and then appendectomy before the season last year and that subsequently was the first season where he hasn't ranked as a high quality player on PFF scale since his rookie season. Chris Williams is just purdy bad. When healthy. I think the "guaranteed" money refers to the SB plus first year salary and bonus. They were both bad deals but CW didn't cost as much.
QCity Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 The guy was an early draft pick.......very athletic.....durable......visually, clearly the Bills best blocker.....statistically, clearly the Bills best blocker........but his ability was "middling" and "average at best"? Yeah right, he was only about the 16th best LG in the NFL. You forgot emotionally. Was he emotionally the Bills best blocker? And 16th best overall guard is about right.
BADOLBILZ Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 You forgot emotionally. Was he emotionally the Bills best blocker? And 16th best overall guard is about right. Yes the best there too. In fact that and his #1 overall pass blocking ranking with PFF were what raised him up to middling.
Bill from NYC Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) I don't know if you're functionally illiterate, but I didn't say he was average. I said he was above average but not great. Sorry to put a damper on your EJ Manuellian man crush on Levitre and this fantasy of him as an all world OG you seem to cling to.Nobody on this board is as good at expressing his views as Badol, but let me jump in if I may.... Badol and I discussed Levitre BEFORE the draft. I heard announcers on Sirius rave about him. We were, as usual, desperate for OL help and I watched what little you tube material I could find. He played LT in college and his athleticism was apparent. When I asked Badol about AL he was VERY familiar with him whereas he is really into college football. He said that normally, he prefers big, bruising guards, but the rule changes were taking hold and that the game was more about passing. This made him a good fit. My point? Sure, AL lacked brute strength. He wasn't a mauling type like Steve Hutchinson. But he was extremely valuable in this passing era. On running plays, he often got great angles. There is no way to prove it, but I think that he was a big help to Glenn. Btw, the Bills traded UP to select him. He didn't miss games and was very good at his job. Those are the players a team needs to keep. Look at Jerry Hughes.....I know that we didn't draft him but he came in and did his job. If we were counting pennies we could look at who he lines up with and discredit him, but a team needs to keep players like this, not create holes that are hard to fill. Edited August 22, 2015 by Bill from NYC
Rob's House Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Nobody on this board is as good at expressing his views as Badol, but let me jump in if I may.... Badol and I discussed Levitre BEFORE the draft. I heard announcers on Sirius rave about him. We were, as usual, desperate for OL help and I watched what little you tube material I could find. He played LT in college and his athleticism was apparent. When I asked Badol about AL he was VERY familiar with him whereas he is really into college football. He said that normally, he prefers big, bruising guards, but the rule changes were taking hold and that the game was more about passing. This made him a good fit. My point? Sure, AL lacked brute strength. He wasn't a mauling type like Steve Hutchinson. But he was extremely valuable in this passing era. On running plays, he often got great angles. There is no way to prove it, but I think that he was a big help to Glenn. Btw, the Bills traded UP to select him. He didn't miss games and was very good at his job. Those are the players a team needs to keep. Look at Jerry Hughes.....I know that we didn't draft him but he came in and did his job. If we were counting pennies we could look at who he lines up with and discredit him, but a team needs to keep players like this, not create holes that are hard to fill. I don't see how that's all that different from my assessment. A guy with good fundamentals and about average physical ability for an NFL starter - above average quickness, average to below average strength). We could squabble over the margins, but the disparity between our assessments isn't so glaring that it rises to the level of knee slapping condescension. IIRC, Badol's big on treating people on the board the way you would in person. If that's how he truly acts in person I imagine he has few friends and even fewer teeth.
JohnC Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Btw, the Bills traded UP to select him. He didn't miss games and was very good at his job. Those are the players a team needs to keep. Look at Jerry Hughes.....I know that we didn't draft him but he came in and did his job. If we were counting pennies we could look at who he lines up with and discredit him, but a team needs to keep players like this, not create holes that are hard to fill. You make the salient point that Badol is constantly reminding others: The Bills took a position of strength and then let him go and replaced him with players who made that position not only a position of weakness but a position of vulnerability that affected other positions on the offense. Even for those people who are arguing that he was too costly from a cost-benefit ratio it was a significantly better return on value than what the dismal replacements gave the team.
Bill from NYC Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) I don't see how that's all that different from my assessment. A guy with good fundamentals and about average physical ability for an NFL starter - above average quickness, average to below average strength). We could squabble over the margins, but the disparity between our assessments isn't so glaring that it rises to the level of knee slapping condescension. IIRC, Badol's big on treating people on the board the way you would in person. If that's how he truly acts in person I imagine he has few friends and even fewer teeth. Nah Bro, other posters will back me on this...;..Badol is a great guy. The thing is, he studies this stuff more than virtually anyone I have ever met. He tailgates at every game and would give you the shirt off his back with a smile. My friends actually write down football questions for him to ask at the tailgate lol! If you are looking for a 5th round inside lb or a 4th round guard, he has names!!! I dare say that I know just a bit about football. Badol is on another planet. Edited August 22, 2015 by Bill from NYC
JohnC Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 . We could squabble over the margins, but the disparity between our assessments isn't so glaring that it rises to the level of knee slapping condescension. IIRC, Badol's big on treating people on the board the way you would in person. If that's how he truly acts in person I imagine he has few friends and even fewer teeth. If you think the level of discourse is too rough and uncivil in this thread you should avoid the topic on Brady and the four game suspension. That topic that runs into the thousands is laced with vitriol. As the saying goes: Water on a duck's back.
Bill from NYC Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 You make the salient point that Badol is constantly reminding others: The Bills took a position of strength and then let him go and replaced him with players who made that position not only a position of weakness but a position of vulnerability that affected other positions on the offense. Even for those people who are arguing that he was too costly from a cost-benefit ratio it was a significantly better return on value than what the dismal replacements gave the team.Right on John!
Rob's House Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 If you think the level of discourse is too rough and uncivil in this thread you should avoid the topic on Brady and the four game suspension. That topic that runs into the thousands is laced with vitriol. As the saying goes: Water on a duck's back. I don't mind rough discourse at all. Quite the contrary. Unwarranted condescension just rubs me the wrong way.
Gugny Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 I don't mind rough discourse at all. Quite the contrary. Unwarranted condescension just rubs me the wrong way.
Coach Tuesday Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 (edited) You make the salient point that Badol is constantly reminding others: The Bills took a position of strength and then let him go and replaced him with players who made that position not only a position of weakness but a position of vulnerability that affected other positions on the offense. Even for those people who are arguing that he was too costly from a cost-benefit ratio it was a significantly better return on value than what the dismal replacements gave the team. This is really all that needs to be said. The Bills in the Littman-Overdorf era were very good at examining individual players in a vacuum, determining their market worth without regard to the rest of the roster or how losing that player would be compensated for. Team-building is a skill that was sorely lacking. I continue to have my concerns about Whaley in this regard (scout vs. architect/GM) but am trying to be patient. Edited August 22, 2015 by Coach Tuesday
Doc Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Nobody on this board is as good at expressing his views as Badol, but let me jump in if I may.... Badol and I discussed Levitre BEFORE the draft. I heard announcers on Sirius rave about him. We were, as usual, desperate for OL help and I watched what little you tube material I could find. He played LT in college and his athleticism was apparent. When I asked Badol about AL he was VERY familiar with him whereas he is really into college football. He said that normally, he prefers big, bruising guards, but the rule changes were taking hold and that the game was more about passing. This made him a good fit. My point? Sure, AL lacked brute strength. He wasn't a mauling type like Steve Hutchinson. But he was extremely valuable in this passing era. On running plays, he often got great angles. There is no way to prove it, but I think that he was a big help to Glenn. Btw, the Bills traded UP to select him. He didn't miss games and was very good at his job. Those are the players a team needs to keep. Look at Jerry Hughes.....I know that we didn't draft him but he came in and did his job. If we were counting pennies we could look at who he lines up with and discredit him, but a team needs to keep players like this, not create holes that are hard to fill. I agree with keeping good young players. But there's a cost-benefit analysis that needs to be done. Paying top OG money to a guy who was in the bottom top-third/top middle-third of OG's because the Bills had no one better isn't a smart decision and I'm sure you'd hear Titans execs saying that they have buyer's remorse over signing him to that rich of a contract.
Coach Tuesday Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 I agree with keeping good young players. But there's a cost-benefit analysis that needs to be done. Paying top OG money to a guy who was in the bottom top-third/top middle-third of OG's because the Bills had no one better isn't a smart decision and I'm sure you'd hear Titans execs saying that they have buyer's remorse over signing him to that rich of a contract. Yes it is a good decision if they had no one better. Yes it is.
Gugny Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 Yes it is a good decision if they had no one better. Yes it is. I actually disagree. It was OT money that he was going to get if he'd stayed. No OG is worth that money. And I do not think any of the Bills' woes after Levitre's departure were due to O-line performance. This non-move has always been one of my favorite moves of Whaley's. It was good long-term/big picture thinking. I'm very happy with him as the GM.
Coach Tuesday Posted August 22, 2015 Posted August 22, 2015 I actually disagree. It was OT money that he was going to get if he'd stayed. No OG is worth that money. And I do not think any of the Bills' woes after Levitre's departure were due to O-line performance. This non-move has always been one of my favorite moves of Whaley's. It was good long-term/big picture thinking. I'm very happy with him as the GM. It was OT money in year one - but a couple of years later it's OG money. The market went up.
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