jumbalaya Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 I think most would categorize the 2015 Buffalo Bills as a team without a QB - meaning a "franchise QB" or in other words having one that has proven they can consistently be relied on to win games. Clearly we understand what they're doing - they attempting to win with a strong defense and running game. It's a passing league, right? The league has clearly embraced this trend in many ways by protecting QB's and defenseless receivers. Just to be clear I'm not necessarily speaking against any of that. But the rules, height of receivers, coordinators mindsets, etc have created this pass and how to stop it phenomenon. Not a whole lot has changed in terms of opportunity to run the ball. Maybe in the midst of conceding to not having a QB a new trend is about to start. Maybe teams will find out through the 2015 Bills that it's actually not prudent to keep looking for a franchise QB or even pay one if you do get one. We've seen the diminished importance of paying RB's and not too long ago teams spent a lot of resources trying to find a running back, then they just stopped. We've seen teams with franchise QB's that have had to pay a huge salary to that QB - to only watch their teams fall apart. I think it's possible the Bills are creating not only another way to win - but THE new way to win. Stop the teams that have built around their QB and destroy the teams without one because that's all they've tried to do. Remember when the team that had the ball the most usually won the game (time of possession)? I think we'll do that too. In my opinion teams that throw the ball will be the only ones with a chance to beat us and that's going to be an uphill battle. I think we're going to create panic because they'll start to figure out it's going to be a while until they see the ball again. Am I delusional? Or do the non national headline signings like Felton and Connor once again become the way to win in the NFL? I think you are delusional. We had runners galore and solid D the last 5 years ad still sucked.
Mr. WEO Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 I know that its hard to remember the overall live action of things from year to year but..... The 2013 bills defense was fun to watch because Pettine brought the farm......a LOT.......but it was done at the expense of big plays when the house didnt get there......and we CONSISTANTLY gave up crucial 1st downs on the ground because of the "get to the QB at all costs" Pettine defense Rex Ryans defenses are not like that......they are consistantly ranked high against the run to go along with exotic pass rush schemes. This does make a difference Had last years team been effective AT ALL on offense we would have had a much better record then 9 and 7.....I truly believe that. Be that as it may The defense is the constant on our team....we KNOW they are gonna be good...with Rex Ryan's mind at the helm they might even be great....BUT this team will only go as far as its offense takes it PAST a 9 and 7 type record We MUST convert 1st downs on the ground in this scheme We MUST score touchdowns instead of field goals We MUST score in the red zone....be it run or pass Now.....the arrow is pointing up here regardless of QB - Sammy Watkins....a GENERATIONAL talent.....the bill is paid on this receiver (meaning compensation) and he is now in his 2nd year.......I expect this guy go have a big year REGARDLESS of whether we are biult to run the ball.....he is simply too good.......AJ Green good - The running back stable IS improved.....there is no other way around this.....when Fred Jackson has been relegated to a limited carry role because we have a running back that is so good he has been forced there....u KNOW that you have improved the positon - We have not had a TE of Clay's quality for years and years - Wood also should continue to improve....and is completely being looked over right now - The interior of the OL has been upgraded Now.....all they have to do is prove it on the field.....not an easy task.....but hey. We are bills fans......so we are used to wait and see. They took a small step last year...I think they continue to do that. Actually, the Bills were in the top 12 in tens who gave up the lowest % of 1st downs on the ground--in fact, they were worse in 2014 under Schwatrz than under Pettine (21.5% vs 20.8%, ranked 16th vs 12th). Sammy is not a "generational player". Not yet anyway...
BillsVet Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 Sammy is not a "generational player". Not yet anyway... Forget it, he's rolling. But it's interesting to see how often Sammy is used by Roman within an offense that'll be more run-oriented. If Cassel wins the job and they can use the PA pass (as we're told MC is adept at) Sammy should have plenty of opportunities.
LeGOATski Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 Forget it, he's rolling. But it's interesting to see how often Sammy is used by Roman within an offense that'll be more run-oriented. If Cassel wins the job and they can use the PA pass (as we're told MC is adept at) Sammy should have plenty of opportunities. Is Cassel good at throwing deep or is that just a made-up thing? Actually, the Bills were in the top 12 in tens who gave up the lowest % of 1st downs on the ground--in fact, they were worse in 2014 under Schwatrz than under Pettine (21.5% vs 20.8%, ranked 16th vs 12th). Sammy is not a "generational player". Not yet anyway... He used the term "generational talent," which Sammy definitely is. He was head and shoulders above the rest in college and the only WR in history to make first team all-american as a true freshman. Whether or not he becomes a generational NFL player will only be determined over time.
John from Riverside Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 To me Sammy doesnt get the press that he should be doing.......its interesting that it is turning out that way......more press going to Shady, Harvin, the O Line Sammy Watkins is a special player......even in a year that was loaded with one injury after another without a good qb to throw to him he still had a great season They ran virtually NOTHING that he did great in college....yet he still showed that he was nearly uncoverable
Mr. WEO Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Is Cassel good at throwing deep or is that just a made-up thing? He used the term "generational talent," which Sammy definitely is. He was head and shoulders above the rest in college and the only WR in history to make first team all-american as a true freshman. Whether or not he becomes a generational NFL player will only be determined over time. Sorry, I misquoted him-but I'm pretty sure I knew what he meant--"generational" means once in a generation, when in reality, there have been a bunch of solid, equally talented WRs coming out of college in the last few years alone. Anyway, Sammy's not a "generational talent" either. If he is, then that term has lost its meaning. He was a great college player, talented, who may or may not be a great pro. Edited June 14, 2015 by Mr. WEO
Steve Billieve Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) No way will the Bills roster become a trend, for two reasons, neither of them related to how effective we'll actually be. The first reason is that if we win many will think our QB is good regardless of the reality. Lets just say we win the Superbowl with EJ or Tyrod Taylor (I'm a little skeptical that anyone could think Meh is elite) there will immediately be the perception that they are good and as soon as their contracts are up (which is almost immediately) you would have to shell out big money to keep them or they will walk. Even if you don't need a good QB to win I doubt you can have a bad one or a new one consistently. If we lose our QB and they do poorly elsewhere it wouldn't start a trend, there's been plenty of QBs with one or two good seasons and then nothing. As for the second reason. I think it's going to be really tough to keep the level of talent we have on our roster even if we completely ignore the most important position. That being said as soon as what we're doing is seen as a viable option to win with it will become more expensive to get all these great players and it will stop being viable, not to mention the problems you'll have with available talent. We have two of the best full backs out there, not to mention all the other great players. Edited June 14, 2015 by Steve Billieve
Juice_32 Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 He didn't call it a "trend"--you just put thoise words in his mouth. This is what he actually said: "the Bills are creating not only another way to win - but THE new way to win." Creating something new is often called inventing. Go back to school. Miss the thread title? Hate when that happens. You are 100% correct.
thewildrabbit Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 Not to pee in the OP's cereal but the Viks have had AD, and ran the ball since 2007 and got to 10-6 with Gus Frerotte at QB, then 12-4 with Brett Favre at QB in 2009. They have had the unquestionable best RB, top 15 running attack in the NFL since 2007 and elite / non-elite QB's and they fared better with Favre. Needless to say the Bills drafted Lynch at the same time as the Viks drafted AD, and still stunk it up since 2007 for various reasons. For whatever reason the Bills were never able to get the production from Lynch that the Seahawks were able to get out of him. Granted he got 1000 yards in Buffalo but that was usually because he was dragging three defenders along with him. The Bills drafted RB CJ Spiller who was a phenom in college, and only Gailey was able to get great production out of him. The great running team that stands out to me was the 2009 Baltimore Ravens with rookie Joe Flacco at QB. They finished the 09 season at 9-7 and made the playoffs as a wildcard team. They went up to Foxborough Mass, and played against against the 10-6 Patriots in Gillette stadium. On the road in NE Joe Flacco threw 4 of 10 passes for 34 yards with one INT the entire game. The Ravens won that wildcard game 34-14 by running the ball 52 times with 234 yards rushing, and four TD's. Ravens OC Cam Cameron utilizing OT's to run block instead of TE's just plowed over the NE defensive line and crushed them. The Ravens giving the Bills a perfect blueprint on how to dominate the Patriots with a dominate run game that can actually move the chains, play great defense, annnnnnd apparently nobody in Buffalo was watching. As others have pointed out that Tom Brady won another SB behind a not so great O line that took a few weeks to jell. Remember that 41 to 14 drubbing by the Chiefs that had every Patriots fan crying in his beer that the dynasty was over? No RB on the Patriots had more then 412 rushing yards, and the only receiver over 1000 yards was "Gronk" with 1,124. So they got it done a good secondary, one decent pass rushing LBer with 8 sacks, and their superstar QB. Yes, delusional.
John from Riverside Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 Sorry, I misquoted him-but I'm pretty sure I knew what he meant--"generational" means once in a generation, when in reality, there have been a bunch of solid, equally talented WRs coming out of college in the last few years alone. Anyway, Sammy's not a "generational talent" either. If he is, then that term has lost its meaning. He was a great college player, talented, who may or may not be a great pro. I do wonder if your sole purpose on this board is to try and piss on any positive thing posted by anyone. Seriously If someone thinks a player might actually be good.....you find a way to say they might not be.
LeGOATski Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Sorry, I misquoted him-but I'm pretty sure I knew what he meant--"generational" means once in a generation, when in reality, there have been a bunch of solid, equally talented WRs coming out of college in the last few years alone. Anyway, Sammy's not a "generational talent" either. If he is, then that term has lost its meaning. He was a great college player, talented, who may or may not be a great pro. He was the only WR in history that made first team all-american as a true freshman. That accomplishment spans not one generation, but multiple...since 1889. No WR ever did it before him and no WR has done it yet since. Generational talent. It speaks to his ability in every facet of the game, not just the physical aspect. Now in the NFL, he hasn't shown anything that would make anyone doubt he'll be a great pro. He produced no matter who was at QB. It's ok. You can be excited about that. Nobody will think less of you. Edited June 14, 2015 by LeGOATski
Beerball Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 And even the next class after that! So, you're saying there's a chance in 2018?
LeGOATski Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 So, you're saying there's a chance in 2018? After we've fired Rex and all the talent on this team is gone. That's probably when we'll finally get our franchise QB...
Beerball Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 After we've fired Rex and all the talent on this team is gone. That's probably when we'll finally get our franchise QB... If history is an indicator you are correct.
John from Riverside Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 After we've fired Rex and all the talent on this team is gone. That's probably when we'll finally get our franchise QB...
3rdand12 Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) I do wonder if your sole purpose on this board is to try and piss on any positive thing posted by anyone. Seriously If someone thinks a player might actually be good.....you find a way to say they might not be. I thought we had accepted that already? pretty decent arguer though consistent. does not lose his temper or show emotion. I think he a contrary man and valuable to the group. May i offer you a pinch of salt for Weos blend of tea? its like the Monty Python skit in some ways. " I would like to have an argument " "No you wouldn't". http://www.montypython.net/scripts/argument.php If history is an indicator you are correct. seems to be a trend. actually Edited June 14, 2015 by 3rdand12
LeGOATski Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 seems to be a trend. actually Who started the "have a losing team, but still make tons of money" trend? Can we claim that as ours?
John from Riverside Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 I thought we had accepted that already? pretty decent arguer though consistent. does not lose his temper or show emotion. I think he a contrary man and valuable to the group. May i offer you a pinch of salt for Weos blend of tea? its like the Monty Python skit in some ways. " I would like to have an argument " "No you wouldn't". http://www.montypython.net/scripts/argument.php seems to be a trend. actually I am not doubting WEO's ability to debate........he is def pretty good at it. Just frustrating that its always the alternate view no matter when even when it makes little sense to be. Its frustrating sometimes why does he even follow this team if he hates it so much? THat is a serious question. As for QB......We cannot afford a great veteran QB with the contracts that need to be given out to keep our D great.....and our team is widely regarded as "one fo the most talented in the league" I wonder if this next year if the bills dont get VERY aggressive in drafting that next QB....giving up multiple picks to do so.
3rdand12 Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 Who started the "have a losing team, but still make tons of money" trend? Can we claim that as ours? Oh you mean , the Brandon Method ? or was it the Littman Affect? I am not doubting WEO's ability to debate........he is def pretty good at it. Just frustrating that its always the alternate view no matter when even when it makes little sense to be. Its frustrating sometimes why does he even follow this team if he hates it so much? THat is a serious question. As for QB......We cannot afford a great veteran QB with the contracts that need to be given out to keep our D great.....and our team is widely regarded as "one fo the most talented in the league" I wonder if this next year if the bills dont get VERY aggressive in drafting that next QB....giving up multiple picks to do so. I think the QB pursuit is exactly how it shakes out. per your last sentence. Not surprised if they went all in for that fellow from San Diego too. Terry P could help the family transition most comfortably and cushion the cap hit. he doesn't hate the Bills at all. its just his way of hugging.
Beerball Posted June 14, 2015 Posted June 14, 2015 he doesn't hate the Bills at all. its just his way of hugging. I think he loves the Bills and debating. You could argue which holds the #1 position.
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