BuffaloHokie13 Posted May 17, 2015 Posted May 17, 2015 Erm. We could wish. Cassel is longer in the tooth and has been up-and-down, up-and-down. He's way past the "lightbulb finally went on" stage Smith was at. Except for being 6'1" to Kaepernick's 6'4" and never having done anything in the league, sure Taylor is just like Kaep I think EJ Manuel is in the mix somewhere, myself Not saying he will or won't be, but Kaep hadn't done anything in the league when he came in either. Smith got hurt in order for Kaep to get his shot IIRC.
truth on hold Posted May 17, 2015 Author Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) @ Hopeful, the spirit of a dead great is my way of saying his performance was so pathetic last year, that nothing more than an other-worldly turnaround is going to save him. I was at the Houston game last year -worst I ever felt watching a Bills game. Then I watched it on tape ( local game here). I hope you'll believe me when I say it was worse seeing it live and watching the reactions of teammates, coaches and Orton -who stood by himself the entire game. Granted, just one game. But he wasn't sharp from San Diego on -goofy scramble play notwithstanding. Mostly, Rex & Roman aren't beholden to him at all and for his new HC to say in a Presser "I wish he'd get the ball out sooner, before the receiver makes the cut" is telling -to me, even after following it up with some praise. I'm not concerned with cost vs cost exchanging Manuels' rookie contract for another vet. Certainly not -if OBD isn't. As for 'who', final cuts always seem to see effective vet players at every position on the street. My point is, given the quality of the players we amassed on Offense, this fan will feel much better with a vet who's seen and dealt with challenging situations in getting us in the right play or not turning it over -vs a kid who's trying to regain confidence and learn some new skills. Good post all the way around. I know what you mean about seeing a game live vs watching on TV. Live you get to see how a play develops and what the QB could/should have done, vs what actually happened. And also how much (or little) confidence the team mates have in him. That said the open question is why EJ regressed yr1 to yr2, and dramatically so within yr2? Hopefully since they're gone it was coaching. But stakes are high for him too given the new staff have no ties to him. If it comes to it hopefully we get a 6th or 7th (again gabbert got a 6th), and worst case if no offers then the cap hit seems manageable. We're not talking Cutler $25 million over 2 years stuff Edited May 17, 2015 by JTSP
3rdand12 Posted May 17, 2015 Posted May 17, 2015 EJ to philly for OG Mathis EJ to Philly for Kiko EJ is a year older and wiser. He should have the advantage unless he is a complete flop in pre-season. Why would Baltimore release their QB, and then he automatically becomes our starter? Cassell may be adequate, but EJ has to be our man. He needs more game experience, mistakes or not. If we grind the ball, EJ has to be the man, even I can make adequate hand-offs. I didn't like the Spiller situation, and I don't like this situation. EJ has to have more exposure, and needs fan support. Trading him or releasing him would be stupid at this point. No safety nets, no conservative play calling, let him go, scramble to your hearts content. Hopefully, the new coaches let you open up. Go Bills And why the hell not? If he can show comprehension of the new offense, trust his receivers to come open AFTER the throw and settle the heck down. There is always Cassel. Its tough to yank a QB during the season. complicated play wise and the on the field stuff , and difficult for the team as a whole and the politics of it.. i think Bills should keep him around , regardless
dayman Posted May 17, 2015 Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) Cassel is longer in the tooth and has been up-and-down, up-and-down. He's way past the "lightbulb finally went on" stage Smith was at. Except for being 6'1" to Kaepernick's 6'4" and never having done anything in the league, sure Taylor is just like Kaep I think EJ Manuel is in the mix somewhere, myself Of course he's in the mix. At worst he gets as fair a shot as Cassell and Taylor, and he may get a slightly better opportunity. The question is whether you think he has a better chance of winning than Cassell or Taylor. You answer is? Edited May 17, 2015 by Rex'sOffense
dave mcbride Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) The truth is he's entering year 3 and next year is year 4 of a 4 year fully guaranteed deal. The 5th year option is not being discussed. Thanks! It feels later than that, so my bad. Is it really guaranteed? I thought no one received guaranteed contracts in the NFL. Anyway, I guess the question is if they decide to cut him loose, can they can afford to do it this year? If they can, it clears up a fair amount of space next year -- a year they'll need to re-sign Dareus. Assuming you're right, he'll represent a solid cap hit next year too if they keep him. Edited May 18, 2015 by dave mcbride
YoloinOhio Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 Thanks! It feels later than that, so my bad. Is it really guaranteed? I thought no one received guaranteed contracts in the NFL.new rookie deals since 2011 - 4 yrs gtd
NoSaint Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 new rookie deals since 2011 - 4 yrs gtd Not all though- there's a ledge in there where you see guys haggling to not be the first not fully guaranteed, if I recall.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 Not saying he will or won't be, but Kaep hadn't done anything in the league when he came in either. Smith got hurt in order for Kaep to get his shot IIRC. Hey, Hokie, check out the Panic thread. Chap there had some stuff to say about Taylor in college, I had some questions, would love to hear your take. I know you're a Taylor fan, and I'm not trying to diss your boy, really I'm not. No QB has done anything in the league until he gets a chance. My point is that Kaep was seen (at draft time) in a different place than Tyrod - he had more passing yards as a freshman than Taylor achieved until he was a Sr. He has that big, physical build. So he was seen as "looking the way you want your QB to look" and as being more of a passer in college, and it was reflected in his draft status (2nd round vs 6th round). And when he came off the bench his 2nd season he lit the place up, 65-70% completions. (then of course, he regressed a bit) In his only real NFL appearance, Taylor has not looked so impressive. That's not to say he couldn't be more impressive given more of a chance. The point is that I don't think it's fair to see him as Kaep 2.0. For better or for worse, he's a different QB. Wilson, might be a better comparator?
Deranged Rhino Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 Baltimore didn't release him. He was a free agent that left for a better opportunity in Buffalo. He had NO CHANCE at playing in front of Flacco. None. He is promised a legit chance to earn the starting job here. GO BILLS!!! It amazes me how many people don't understand this.
kota Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 News flash when you don't have a starting QB you bring in competition. Rex liked Tyron Tyler years ago. He was on the market so they signed him. They also traded for a Vet with experience at winning some games so if one of the younger guys doesn't rise to the top you have someone. Penning anyone in as the starter now is stupid. They are in shorts.
ALF Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 Give EJ a OL like Dallas and he and the running game would be fine.
BuffaloHokie13 Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) Hey, Hokie, check out the Panic thread. Chap there had some stuff to say about Taylor in college, I had some questions, would love to hear your take. I know you're a Taylor fan, and I'm not trying to diss your boy, really I'm not. No QB has done anything in the league until he gets a chance. My point is that Kaep was seen (at draft time) in a different place than Tyrod - he had more passing yards as a freshman than Taylor achieved until he was a Sr. He has that big, physical build. So he was seen as "looking the way you want your QB to look" and as being more of a passer in college, and it was reflected in his draft status (2nd round vs 6th round). And when he came off the bench his 2nd season he lit the place up, 65-70% completions. (then of course, he regressed a bit) In his only real NFL appearance, Taylor has not looked so impressive. That's not to say he couldn't be more impressive given more of a chance. The point is that I don't think it's fair to see him as Kaep 2.0. For better or for worse, he's a different QB. Wilson, might be a better comparator? Dropped a response over there, and yeah I definitely think they're different. But I do think that Tyrod's skillset would translate well to the version of Roman's offense that Kaep ran. In the end though, it is up to him to earn the shot and we'll see where it goes from there. BTW, Kaep might be feeding Tyrod some inside info on Roman Colin Kaepernick @Kaepernick7 · May 14 They will tell you that you can't make it! tytaylor2 #tbt #KeepGrindin #AgainstAllOdds… https://instagram.com/p/2rilFINBMm/ Edited May 18, 2015 by BuffaloHokie13
Webster Guy Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 When we play the colts in the opener, just watch our Oline for the first series. If they do well, our qb will have a good season. If they get pushed around it doesn't matter who is qb....long year.
ChanOverChin Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 It's simply ridiculous to write off manuel like this. Give the guy a freakin' break. He's working hard to improve himself. He deserves a fair shot to compete for the starting job. I think the starting QB position is completely up for grabs. Cassel is a former Pro Bowl player who has done very well in the right setting (i.e. when paired with a good surrounding cast and a very good OC), which I believe is what he has in Buffalo. He's a very smart, engaging guy. He's more athletic than most give him credit for. He beat out T. Bridgewater in Minnesota, helped the Pats to an 11-5 season. He has started almost 100 NFL games and is in his tenth NFL season. For those reasons he's the favorite. Manuel just needs to play with more confidence. He has all of the physical attributes to succeed. I think he needs to allow himself to be more mobile. He can run so he should incorporate that more as part of his game to give opposing teams something to think about. He could be very successful in Roman's scheme. If you're a true Bills fan you should be rooting for this guy because he has the most potential of the three top QBs on the roster. He has a great attitute and a willingness to lead. I think he just needs the right coach to believe in him and set him up to succeed. I definitely don't see the Bills cutting him or giving him away for a late round pick if he doesn't end up being the starter this year. That would be very stupid. Taylor is just an outstanding athlete. Truly outstanding. Think Michael Vick in his heyday, only right handed. Watch some tape on him at VT. He's the best athlete on the field in every game against the highest level of competition. He can beat you with his feet for sure. He has a strong arm and can throw accurately on the run. In fact, what he often likes to do is to make it look like his going to take off and run, but then throw the ball as he approaches the LOS. The main question is, how well can he read NFL defenses?? Ray Lewis said that Taylor was the steal of the Ravens' draft the year that Taylor was drafted. He was never going to surpass Flacco and his mammoth contract in Baltimore. People may not want to hear this, but I think we may be looking at a three headed monster in Buffalo at QB. I can see all three guys playing this year. The preseason games will determine who starts the season. It would be great if it were Manuel and he turned out to be our franchise QB.
Beef Jerky Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 If EJ isn't the starter then I won't care what happens to him. I only care about who will start at the QB position, all the other backup QBs are nothing.
K D Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 But but but... EJ has been working with the great Steve DeBerg so now he is fully equipped to be the best backup journeyman QB in the league. I can't wait to see some real games. Is summer over yet? We need football
papazoid Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 If EJ isn't the starter then I won't care what happens to him. I only care about who will start at the QB position, all the other backup QBs are nothing. except that through occupational hazards, half the backups become starters in this league
LOVEMESOMEBILLS Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 Don't matter if it's EJ or Tyrod, but please let it be one of them and not Cassel.
YoloinOhio Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) But but but... EJ has been working with the great Steve DeBerg so now he is fully equipped to be the best backup journeyman QB in the league. I can't wait to see some real games. Is summer over yet? We need football i was in denial last year during OTAs and TC, I'll admit. EJ wasn't hitting R v A and was checking down in 7 on 7. I kept saying I didn't care, just wait for the games. Preseason came and went and he looked bad more than he looked good. I kept saying, just wait for the real games. He started out 2-0 and then it went downhill. Despite all of that, I DO want to see what he does in camp because it's a whole new offense, new coaches, new ol, new weapons. I do have an open mind. I'm not assuming it will be the same. But this year, if he over throws Sammy in R v A or won't make the throw in 7 on 7, I won't be in denial. I won't need to see it in games. I will accept it and move on. Edited May 18, 2015 by YoloinOhio
YoloinOhio Posted May 18, 2015 Posted May 18, 2015 Joe Buscaglia took his speculation to the next level Friday on Rochester radio. He said this season's team is Cassel's to lose, adding he doesn't think Taylor can win the starting job unless Cassel is abysmal in camp. He went on to say he believes EJ has an uphill battle in front of him not to become the starter bust just to make the 53-man roster. He specially said he can foresee EJ getting cut. I know cutting EJ costs the Bills more than if they just kept him on the roster. I'd think a trade or finding a way to put EJ on IR would be ideal if they really don't want him to have a roster spot. I have to believe this speculation is way too early even for reporters on the Bills beat. @JoeBuscaglia: COLUMN: Without progress, EJ Manuel could very well be done with the Buffalo #Bills http://t.co/tDagTHH1ab
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