YoloinOhio Posted May 3, 2015 Author Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) Yes and he let him walk.Because TT wanted to play somewhere he had a chance to start? He wasn't staying there. I'm not saying he will start here but he thinks he has a chance. That doesn't exist in baltimore. Why would Ozzie bother to try to overpay for a backup when he has a durable, franchise SB winning qb as the starter? Kubiak tried in Denver and TT turned it down. Edited May 3, 2015 by YoloinOhio
The Wiz Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 not buying it put the odds at zero. But buying it still puts your odds at 1 in 175 million. Considering there are only 255ish players drafted every year your odds of finding it at later than the top 10 picks are a waste. Think of it this way, you can buy a lottery ticket that might payoff over your lifetime or a 24oz beer that will payoff for the night. The safe bet is the beer.
YoloinOhio Posted May 3, 2015 Author Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) EXACTLY. By some of the posts, I thought "TT" was the second coming of Supermansuperman? Don't see any posts remotely saying that? Simply that signing a young qb like TT who they really like and fits the scheme is about the same as drafting some guy in the mid to late rounds. Edited May 3, 2015 by YoloinOhio
BillsCelticsAngelsBama Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 Analogy... a little flimsy. You think finding a good QB is 1 in 175 million ? But not bringing a QB until you hitting pay dirt has a probability of zero, if all the young QB's are in 31 other NFL camps each summer.
QuoteTheRaven83 Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 Every other QB is a project so I don't see it being that big of a deal. I'm not even overly impressed with Winston or Mariota either. We can wait til next year to draft another one EARLY, hopefully Christian Hackenberg and Kevin Hogan are the 2 QBs that I'd like to get in next year's draft.
#34fan Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 D-grade draft for Bills Nation... The Jesters went big, and it's likely to pay dividends sooner rather than later... Smith doesn't know it yet, but he's already in a fight for that starting job, AND the locker-room. Patsoes are still top of the food chain, despite having an average draft.. Fins would be much scarier with Davante Parker IF they had an actual QB. -Jay Ajayi is the scariest weapon they've got BY FAR... Guy runs with reckless abandon and is an injury threat to anyone who tries to bring him down... Unless something magical happens, it's fourth-place finish for us, and one-and-done for Buddy's kid..
PromoTheRobot Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 Sundays Buffalo News...Jerry Sullivan rips Bills for no QB in draft class.
Cynical Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 This way you go into every draft saying "OK, we're taking a QB, who's the best guy at the best draft position". Now you end up taking Pat White, Colt Mccoy, Andy Dalton, and then Russell Wilson. Now boom, you have a franchise QB and a good young backup QB in Dalton you can trade for a high pick. In exchange this would have cost us Eric Wood, Alex Carrington, Aaron Williams, and T.J Graham. Are those 4 guys worth more than Russell Wilson and Andy Dalton? In your scenario, do these teams stop drafting a QB once they have a franchise QB? If so, what happens when they determine a QB like Colt McCoy is a franchise QB? How many years do they give him before pulling the plug?
Gugny Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 I know this is really unpopular, but I'm a big believer in drafting a QB every year. Every invention in history has been accomplished by trial and error experimenting. The odds of you being successful are FAR lower when you select a QB every 5 years, than if you select one every year. Similar to you trying only 1 idea every 5 years, than 1 idea every year. If the value of a good QB is X times higher than any other position on the field (and we have a mostly stacked team in every other position), I see no reason to pass on a Petty/Grayson/Hundley in the 3rd, 4th, or 5th round every year. At that point you can cut Tuel and have 4 promising QBs face off and you cut the one who shows the least potential or provides the worst results. Run the QBs like an A/B test until you find a winner. I see spending 4th round picks as similar to spending $100 in a marketing campaign to find the best advertisement. To make money, you need to spend money and to get good QBs, you need to use draft picks. This way you go into every draft saying "OK, we're taking a QB, who's the best guy at the best draft position". Now you end up taking Pat White, Colt Mccoy, Andy Dalton, and then Russell Wilson. Now boom, you have a franchise QB and a good young backup QB in Dalton you can trade for a high pick. In exchange this would have cost us Eric Wood, Alex Carrington, Aaron Williams, and T.J Graham. Are those 4 guys worth more than Russell Wilson and Andy Dalton? Dalton? Really? He sucks. Polian is yesterday's news. It's like Namath talking about the Jets. Blah, blah, blah, kiss, blah.
Gestes72 Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 For everyone that says we missed our chance at a franchise QB when they didn't take Russell Wilson well he would have been flat out lousy if the Bills took him with what the team was at that time. With the current team you have to hope Taylor winds up winning the job by a mile because he has athletic similarities to Wilson.
dave mcbride Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 Watching the post draft analysis on espn and polian said he thought the bills had a good draft, but then went all melancholy about the fact they didnt take a Qb and would be entering the season with EJ manuel and "retread" Matt Cassel. He sounded like Eeyore. Imo the bills signing TT is just like drafting a qb. The benefit is he's been a disciple already behind a SB winning qb for a few years. I didn't think any of the QBs left after the top 2 would be able to play in the NFL this year. The experts said all had big flaws and were all projects, none projected starters. So wth is Polian's issue. Plus we have 3 project QBs as it is. I completelty agree with Polian. The Packers alwaystake qbs regardles of their qb starter. Look at the outcome. Watching the post draft analysis on espn and polian said he thought the bills had a good draft, but then went all melancholy about the fact they didnt take a Qb and would be entering the season with EJ manuel and "retread" Matt Cassel. He sounded like Eeyore. Imo the bills signing TT is just like drafting a qb. The benefit is he's been a disciple already behind a SB winning qb for a few years. I didn't think any of the QBs left after the top 2 would be able to play in the NFL this year. The experts said all had big flaws and were all projects, none projected starters. So wth is Polian's issue. Plus we have 3 project QBs as it is. Seriously -- look at the Packers drafts since around 1994-1995. The info is available on the web.
Kelly the Dog Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 Yes and he let him walk. We don't really know that, and it's probably not really true. I think they did want him back but he, rightfully, as anyone would, wanted a place with a chance to play before he gets old. He was never going to beat out Flacco so he came to a place they told him he would have a chance to compete for a starting job.
purple haze Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 i too hope Hackenburg shows improvement but he has all the tools to be a franchise qb type. I love connor cook as well, a pro style guy. Another pro style is Cody Kessler at USC. I see all of Kessler's games. He is very underwhelming, in spite of them winning some games. He's a guy. "It" is not something he will be accused of having. Maybe this years changes things.
Deranged Rhino Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 Kessler is strictly a short passer. He has no arm for the 20 plus yard throws. If you want a dink and dunk QB, he is your man. The top 10 all have major issues. Connor Cook is the top QB now. Hogan from Stanford could be the star of the 2016 draft. We'll see this year, but I think you're going to be surprised. Kessler's got more game than just the short throws. He can fling it. I like Hogan as well and Cook is the guy I really covet (at this stage, which I understand is silly being it's so far away), but I think Kessler is a sleeper in terms of first round talent.
ALF Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) A solid OL and running game has to happen before any QB can have a chance. Going against Suh and Jets DL 2X a season will be a bigger challenge now. Edited May 3, 2015 by ALF
YoloinOhio Posted May 3, 2015 Author Posted May 3, 2015 (edited) I completelty agree with Polian. The Packers alwaystake qbs regardles of their qb starter. Look at the outcome. Seriously -- look at the Packers drafts since around 1994-1995. The info is available on the web. thats very different imo. The packers have been able to draft QBs to be disciples. The Bills would be drafting QBs to be saviors. The only "QB needy" team to take one of the "next tier" QBs this year was NYJ and that's because they only had 2 QBs, and had to use a 4th rd pick to do it. The others will play behind established starters, two of them future hall of famers. The packers and bills could not have two more different Qb situations over the last 20 years. Saying we should copy their backup Qb drafting philosophy is like copying NE's RB philosophy. They have luxuries we do not, because we don't have a future HOF qb at the helm. GB can draft as many QBs as they want but they've had 2 starters in 20 yrs. As I said many times though, he wasn't talking about drafting guy for a 2-3 yr project on day 3 like the packers did. He was referring to drafting a guy to compete for the job today, like the Jets did. We'll see this year, but I think you're going to be surprised. Kessler's got more game than just the short throws. He can fling it. I like Hogan as well and Cook is the guy I really covet (at this stage, which I understand is silly being it's so far away), but I think Kessler is a sleeper in terms of first round talent. if cook had declared this year, Kiper or one of those guys said he would have been a top 15 pick. I'm glad he went back though because he only had 1 1/2 yrs experience as a starter. And because we have a 1st rd pick next yr Edited May 3, 2015 by YoloinOhio
thewildrabbit Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 He's right, they've mismanaged the position and continue to do so. DRAFT ONE EVERY YEAR UNTIL YOU FIND ONE. Overdraft if you have to - BPA is less important when you don't have any QB. Mettenberger last year. Grayson, Hundley or Petty this year. You can't win the lottery without buying tickets. It's the most important position. Believe it or not it's more important than nickel corner or the fourth RB. He does have a point, and its what Seattle did in finding Russell Wilson. Looking at the way Derek Carr beat the Bills in Oakland last year left me wondering if this scouting dept has the first clue about QB talent. OTOH there are only so many reps in training camp / preseason and perhaps the FO wants to see what EJ will look like being guided by an actual NFL coordinator. Time will tell with this regime, and if Whaley can't find a franchise QB or manage to protect the maybes then I don't see him keeping his job.
Coach Tuesday Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 We don't really know that, and it's probably not really true. I think they did want him back but he, rightfully, as anyone would, wanted a place with a chance to play before he gets old. He was never going to beat out Flacco so he came to a place they told him he would have a chance to compete for a starting job. Maybe, but there is evidence to the contrary. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000345582/printable/ozzie-newsome-weve-gotten-calls-about-no-17-pick "After Harbaugh said last month that he was "disappointed" with Tyrod Taylor's progress under center, the coach named quarterback depth as one area needing an upgrade. Don't be surprised when the Ravens add a signal-caller in the later rounds." That was Harbaugh's quote, and they did go ahead last year and draft another backup QB. I just feel that if Newsome thought Taylor was the real deal, he'd at least have tried to trade him for picks or assets or re-sign him to a modest extension rather than letting him go for nothing. But perhaps Yolo is right, the Bills didn't draft a QB because they feel that TT fills that void as a young developmental QB. I'm skeptical - especially when I read things like this: http://bills.buffalonews.com/2015/05/02/bills-put-their-trust-in-talent-scouting/ Quarterback consideration: Whaley said the Bills gave “tremendous consideration” to drafting a quarterback. “Obviously, we talked to some guys,” Whaley said. “We went to see” Baylor quarterback “Bryce Petty,” whom the New York Jets made a fourth-round draft pick. “It just didn’t fall the way we wanted it to and then we were a little hamstrung without some of the picks with the ammo to be able to move around to get some guys or have some guys fall to us compared to the value we put on them.” The reason they were "hamstrung" without "ammo" is because they traded away draft picks for guys like Bryce Brown, which quite frankly was reckless and stupid. And his statement about the QBs coming off of the board earlier than they wanted them to - that happens EVERY YEAR, because almost EVERY OTHER TEAM understands that you have to over-value QBs because it's such an important position. And the quotation also suggests that they did, in fact, want to draft a QB, suggesting that they may not feel that they're set with TT and EJ and MC.
YoloinOhio Posted May 3, 2015 Author Posted May 3, 2015 He does have a point, and its what Seattle did in finding Russell Wilson. Looking at the way Derek Carr beat the Bills in Oakland last year left me wondering if this scouting dept has the first clue about QB talent. OTOH there are only so many reps in training camp / preseason and perhaps the FO wants to see what EJ will look like being guided by an actual NFL coordinator. Time will tell with this regime, and if Whaley can't find a franchise QB or manage to protect the maybes then I don't see him keeping his job. im trying not to beat a dead horse but there weren't any russell wilsons in that draft. He dropped because of height, not because he was a "project." He was a 1st rd talent who was considered short. I can continue to criticize a former FO and coaching staff for not taking him 4 years ago but that's nothing to do with this year's class. Imo.
Best Player Available Posted May 3, 2015 Posted May 3, 2015 He was making the point that our qb situatiion as it stands is dreadful. Most people would agree with that point. If he would have stated which qb he would have taken and where in the draft his qb selection would have been made his comment would have been more interesting. It's apparent that he doesn't consider EJ to be a credible option as a starter. His comments pretty much mirror what he said the night EJ was drafted when Berman said seonds after the pick was in "What do you think of the pick Bill". polian may be long in the tooth but I remember he did draft a couple of decent QB's in his day.
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