Pats signed Chandler because Belichick is a genius.

[Andrew Son]

 

I guess it's trolling to suggest that Chandler might have a good year with the Patriots?

 

No, not just by saying that. It's the body of work

[Mr. WEO]

I'd say that not signing a player who could help you immediately because you wanted to get an end-of-7th rounder a year later, who likely wouldn't even make it out of pre-season, is the opposite of genius.

 

Chandler could have helped them immediately last year, despite the presence of Gronk and Hananmmanmanooi? You left out the part where instead of jumping on Chandler last year (who quickly re-signed with the Bills in March) they picked up Wright (the best rookie TE the year before) AND a 4th round pick in tomorrow's draft for an end-of-career Mankins.

 

So....NE got Wright AND a 4th round pick tonight (and shed 14 million in cash offloading Mankins) AND Chandler AND that 7th rounder. That may not be to your "genius" standards, but it's pretty good.

 

By the way, aren't you the guy who told us all what a stupid move trading Mankins would prove to be?

[Doc]

 

I'm not sure if this is directed at me or not, but I didn't claim it was a genius move. I think the article is crap, but I do expect Chandler to do well in NE.

It was directed towards the article. And how well he does depends on playing time (see below) and picking up the system.

 

Chandler could have helped them immediately last year, despite the presence of Gronk and Hananmmanmanooi? You left out the part where instead of jumping on Chandler last year (who quickly re-signed with the Bills in March) they picked up Wright (the best rookie TE the year before) AND a 4th round pick in tomorrow's draft for an end-of-career Mankins.

 

So....NE got Wright AND a 4th round pick tonight (and shed 14 million in cash offloading Mankins) AND Chandler AND that 7th rounder. That may not be to your "genius" standards, but it's pretty good.

 

By the way, aren't you the guy who told us all what a stupid move trading Mankins would prove to be?

So wait, Chandler wouldn't have helped last year behind Gronk and Hananmmanmanooi, but he'll help them this year behind those 2 plus Wright?

 

As for getting Wright for Mankins, they could have dealt Mankins for someone else and gotten a better pick, and could have easily gotten Wright's 259 yards and 6 TD's from Chandler, at the expense of a throwaway 7th rounder.

 

And yes I said that about Mankins and it looked true...for the first quarter of the season.

[Mr. WEO]

It was directed towards the article. And how well he does depends on playing time (see below) and picking up the system.

So wait, Chandler wouldn't have helped last year behind Gronk and Hananmmanmanooi, but he'll help them this year behind those 2 plus Wright?

 

As for getting Wright for Mankins, they could have dealt Mankins for someone else and gotten a better pick, and could have easily gotten Wright's 259 yards and 6 TD's from Chandler, at the expense of a throwaway 7th rounder.

 

And yes I said that about Mankins and it looked true...for the first quarter of the season.

 

Who was offering more for Mankins than the best rookie the year prior and a 4th?

 

Wright is a better TE than Chandler. Chandler is a small character actor in that offense now. Maybe they will get rid of Hammy. Face it, BB got everything he wanted and gave up nothing.

 

And yes, you were 25% right on your Mankins miscalculation. But you again lose credit because you said they would suffer from the loss of Scarnecchia as well.

[Doc]

Who was offering more for Mankins than the best rookie the year prior and a 4th?

 

Wright is a better TE than Chandler. Chandler is a small character actor in that offense now. Maybe they will get rid of Hammy. Face it, BB got everything he wanted and gave up nothing.

 

And yes, you were 25% right on your Mankins miscalculation. But you again lose credit because you said they would suffer from the loss of Scarnecchia as well.

Look, the premise that Belicheat avoided signing Chandler last year because he wanted to keep that end-of-7th-rounder this year is silly. Even you know that. Chandler would have helped immediately whereas a future throwaway pick that likely wont even make it to the final round of cuts a year later...wouldn't, ever. He, like every other team but the Bills just didn't think that much of him. And I can't tell you what else they could have gotten for Mankins, but even if Wright was all they could get for him, they could have had Chandler AND your "best rookie" last year, which would have made more sense since Gronk was coming back from injury. Yet a year later Belicheat pays him more than Wright., but only to be a "small character in that offense"? Doesn't make sense. Maybe Belicheat isn't all that impressed with your "best rookie" after seeing him up close for a year. And Hoomanwanui is the best blocking TE on that team so I doubt he goes anywhere.

 

As for the Pats' OL, yep, I was wrong. I could give you a list of all the things you've been wrong about.

[Mr. WEO]

You said they could have gotten a better pick for Mankins. Now you say you don't know if they could.

 

BB and the rest of the NFL didn't think much of Chandller, yet Chandler would have helped NE "immensely". How?

 

I don' think BB cares much for a blocking only TE.

 

You also left out your repeated insistence that BB/NE/Brady would never win another SB.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

They may have made bad decisions, but they didn't sign those guys not expecting them to play.

 

I don't think that the Pats signing Chandler means he is now good. I think he was a good player already. There is a difference. You are implying that he sucks, and that they signed him without intending to use him.

This thread started as "the Patriots always know what they are doing." There are tons of examples to the contrary as mentioned above.

 

I do think that he sucks. I think that he was given a ton of opportunities for a player of his skill level because our TEs are always awful. Don't forget he was cut (I think multiple times) prior to coming to the Bills. He then tested FA last year and no one brought him in for a visit. He signed a deal to be a role playing vet. His deal is smaller than that of Lee Smith!!! He is a nice guy but not a good football player.

 

Where do you see him fitting in in New England? That is a huge part of the reason that I think that he is in for a bad year. He is their 3rd pass catching TE and probably 4th to dress on game day. I just do not see the fit. Maybe you see the fit differently than I do. What am I missing?

[Prickly Pete]

This thread started as "the Patriots always know what they are doing." There are tons of examples to the contrary as mentioned above.

 

I do think that he sucks. I think that he was given a ton of opportunities for a player of his skill level because our TEs are always awful. Don't forget he was cut (I think multiple times) prior to coming to the Bills. He then tested FA last year and no one brought him in for a visit. He signed a deal to be a role playing vet. His deal is smaller than that of Lee Smith!!! He is a nice guy but not a good football player.

 

Where do you see him fitting in in New England? That is a huge part of the reason that I think that he is in for a bad year. He is their 3rd pass catching TE and probably 4th to dress on game day. I just do not see the fit. Maybe you see the fit differently than I do. What am I missing?

Why would they sign him, if he can't possibly fit their scheme?

 

This is all pre-season talk....we won't really know until the season plays out, will we?

 

I'm on record as believing he will do well. We can revisit this discussion as the season unfolds.

 

Thank you very much.

Edited May 1, 2015 by HoF Watkins

[Kirby Jackson]

Why would they sign him, if he can't possibly fit their scheme?

 

This is all pre-season talk....we won't really know until the season plays out, will we?

 

I'm on record as believing he will do well. We can revisit this discussion as the season unfolds.

 

Thank you very much.

I don't know? I am the one that doesn't think that it makes sense.

 

I guess that he is there as insurance if/when Gronk gets hurt. He will dress for those games and play a role as a traditional pass catching TE. Wright is more of a slot guy.

 

The move does not make a lot of sense for the Pats. That is the point that I have been trying to make. Just because it is the Pats that did it doesn't make it a good decision. I know why Chandler went there. When he was a FA last year no one even brought him in for a visit. He jumped at a 2 year $5+M deal.

[Doc]

You said they could have gotten a better pick for Mankins. Now you say you don't know if they could.

 

BB and the rest of the NFL didn't think much of Chandller, yet Chandler would have helped NE "immensely". How?

 

I don' think BB cares much for a blocking only TE.

 

You also left out your repeated insistence that BB/NE/Brady would never win another SB.

If they signed Chandler and didn't trade for Wright they could have traded Mankins for Glennon, possibly gotten a better pick back, and saved that 2nd rounder they used on Garrrropppppppollo. Maybe they could have traded for Wright and Glennon (instead of the 4th rounder) and again saved that 2nd rounder.

 

And I didn't say "immensely" I said "immediately," as in Chandler would have produced last year whereas that 7th rounder would at best have belped them this year, and most likely won't help them at all.

 

How do you explain carrying Hooman on the roster for the past 3 years then? In 5 years in the league, he has 40 catches for 518 yards and 4 TD's, and just 20 catches for 289 yards and 1 TD with the Pats. That's a blocking TE.

 

Yep, they won the SB. Again I underestimated the number of ways they could cheat. And I overestimated Russel Wilson's abilities.

Edited May 1, 2015 by Doc

[Prickly Pete]

I don't know? I am the one that doesn't think that it makes sense.

 

I guess that he is there as insurance if/when Gronk gets hurt. He will dress for those games and play a role as a traditional pass catching TE. Wright is more of a slot guy.

 

The move does not make a lot of sense for the Pats. That is the point that I have been trying to make. Just because it is the Pats that did it doesn't make it a good decision. I know why Chandler went there. When he was a FA last year no one even brought him in for a visit. He jumped at a 2 year $5+M deal.

 

I said Good Day, sir!!

[Mr. WEO]

If they signed Chandler and didn't trade for Wright they could have traded Mankins for Glennon, possibly gotten a better pick back, and saved that 2nd rounder they used on Garrrropppppppollo. Maybe they could have traded for Wright and Glennon (instead of the 4th rounder) and again saved that 2nd rounder.

 

And I didn't say "immensely" I said "immediately," as in Chandler would have produced last year whereas that 7th rounder would at best have belped them this year, and most likely won't help them at all.

 

How do you explain carrying Hooman on the roster for the past 3 years then? In 5 years in the league, he has 40 catches for 518 yards and 4 TD's, and just 20 catches for 289 yards and 1 TD with the Pats. That's a blocking TE.

 

Yep, they won the SB. Again I underestimated the number of ways they could cheat. And I overestimated Russel Wilson's abilities.

 

Wait...Glennon?? Come on! Why would they want him??--they just dumped his clone. They got the guy who Mayock announced would have been the 3rd QB taken in this year's draft. Admit it, they got good value from trading an aging Mankins.

 

NE didn't need Chandler's "production" last year.

 

NE cheated in the SB? How?

[Kirby Jackson]

 

I said Good Day, sir!!

Sound logic forced the white flag?!? Victory is mine!!!!

[Prickly Pete]

Sound logic forced the white flag?!? Victory is mine!!!!

 

Nope. There is just no way to know whether or not he will have a good season right now. Nothing more to discuss.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

Nope. There is just no way to know whether or not he will have a good season right now. Nothing more to discuss.

We can revisit in the fall.

[Doc]

 

Wait...Glennon?? Come on! Why would they want him??--they just dumped his clone. They got the guy who Mayock announced would have been the 3rd QB taken in this year's draft. Admit it, they got good value from trading an aging Mankins.

 

NE didn't need Chandler's "production" last year.

 

NE cheated in the SB? How?

The only ways in which Glennon is a clone of Mallett is they're both white and tall. If you meant speed, Glennon has a 4.9 YPC rushing avg whereas Mallett's is...negative . Glennon's rookie year was something Mallett could only dream of duplicating. Hell, his 2nd year was as well. As for Mayock, what did he say (and what does he still say) about Manziel? We know you loved him.

 

No they didn't end up needing Chandler's production. They probably didn't even need Wright's since it's not like 26 catches for 259 yards is all that impressive. Which again, is probably why Belicheat signed Chandler to add to a crowded TE corps. Like he could have done last year when there was far greater uncertainty because Gronk was coming back from injury, for less money and at the expense of a 4-to-last comp pick the following draft.

Never said they cheated in the SB.

[Mr. WEO]

The only ways in which Glennon is a clone of Mallett is they're both white and tall. If you meant speed, Glennon has a 4.9 YPC rushing avg whereas Mallett's is...negative . Glennon's rookie year was something Mallett could only dream of duplicating. Hell, his 2nd year was as well. As for Mayock, what did he say (and what does he still say) about Manziel? We know you loved him.

 

No they didn't end up needing Chandler's production. They probably didn't even need Wright's since it's not like 26 catches for 259 yards is all that impressive. Which again, is probably why Belicheat signed Chandler to add to a crowded TE corps. Like he could have done last year when there was far greater uncertainty because Gronk was coming back from injury, for less money and at the expense of a 4-to-last comp pick the following draft.

Never said they cheated in the SB.

 

Glennon doesn't have a 4.9 rushing avg--he ran 10 (ten) times for a grand total of 49 yards in his rookie season. His rushing avg last season was....1.4. If anyone where to ever let him start a few more games, it would be less than zero.

 

Glennon just fell to #3 on the Bucs depth chart. NE wanted nothing to do with him so why would they trade for him? They drafted their guy. Even the Bucs don't really want Glennon any more. So he's essentially Mallett with more starts. I bet even Mallet would not have dreamed of Glennon's nightmare season last year.

 

So now you concede NE didn't need Chambers last season (so many wasted words to reach the obvious conclusion). Wright has a brighter future on that team than Chandler would have. If they cut Wright and keep Chandler, I will quickly concede you are right.

 

So if NE didn't cheat in the SB, why claim that their cheating confounded your annual "no SB win" declaration?

[Doc]

 

Glennon doesn't have a 4.9 rushing avg--he ran 10 (ten) times for a grand total of 49 yards in his rookie season. His rushing avg last season was....1.4. If anyone where to ever let him start a few more games, it would be less than zero.

 

Glennon just fell to #3 on the Bucs depth chart. NE wanted nothing to do with him so why would they trade for him? They drafted their guy. Even the Bucs don't really want Glennon any more. So he's essentially Mallett with more starts. I bet even Mallet would not have dreamed of Glennon's nightmare season last year.

 

So now you concede NE didn't need Chambers last season (so many wasted words to reach the obvious conclusion). Wright has a brighter future on that team than Chandler would have. If they cut Wright and keep Chandler, I will quickly concede you are right.

 

So if NE didn't cheat in the SB, why claim that their cheating confounded your annual "no SB win" declaration?

I was talking about Glennon after his rookie season, when the theoretical trade would have occurred. He fell off in his 2nd year like Wright did after his "best rookie" season. But again, Belicheat can't predict the future.

 

Mallett lived through his own nightmare season, thank you very much. It was worse than Glennon's, actually.

 

I said that the Pats could have done the same with either TE. Wright's catches and yards were unimpressive to say the least, and again orobably the reason why they signed Chandler this season (it surely wasn't for his blocking skills).

 

So cheating to help you get to the SB means nothing?

[Mr. WEO]

I was talking about Glennon after his rookie season, when the theoretical trade would have occurred. He fell off in his 2nd year like Wright did after his "best rookie" season. But again, Belicheat can't predict the future.

 

Mallett lived through his own nightmare season, thank you very much. It was worse than Glennon's, actually.

 

I said that the Pats could have done the same with either TE. Wright's catches and yards were unimpressive to say the least, and again orobably the reason why they signed Chandler this season (it surely wasn't for his blocking skills).

 

So cheating to help you get to the SB means nothing?

 

 

Glennon would never have been tempting for NE. It's a ridiculous discussion. The guy's career as a starter is dead less than 2 seasons in, just like Mallett.

 

I doubt NE cares if their TE can block.

 

How did the deflated balls help them get into the SB? They walked through the AFCE as usual--no help needed there. They were losing with the deflated balls in the Baltimore game. After the properly infalted balls were restored to play, they came back in the second half to beat on the Ravens. Then the COlts and Seattle. How did the cheating help them win the SB?

[Doc]

 

 

Glennon would never have been tempting for NE. It's a ridiculous discussion. The guy's career as a starter is dead less than 2 seasons in, just like Mallett.

 

I doubt NE cares if their TE can block.

 

How did the deflated balls help them get into the SB? They walked through the AFCE as usual--no help needed there. They were losing with the deflated balls in the Baltimore game. After the properly infalted balls were restored to play, they came back in the second half to beat on the Ravens. Then the COlts and Seattle. How did the cheating help them win the SB?

They should have been tempted instead of wasting a 2nd rounder on Garroopppolllo. Execpt in his case, it will be a couple of years before his career as a starter is dead.

 

Yeah, that's why they've kept Hooman for the past 3 years despite his not-even 7 catches a year. Must be his scintillating personality.

 

Yeah they were losing with with the deflated balls in the Baltimore game, a game they barely won. So if the balls were properly inflated...

 

And can you say which HR's steroids helped Barry hit? Which races PEDs helped Marion Jones win? Which races doping helped Lance Armstrong win?