Deranged Rhino Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 I think it's 1 part not seeing how good Gilmore is and 1 part not realizing that shutdown corners actually give up catches too. Great point. There are some unreasonable expectations.
NewEra Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 (edited) I said it before, and I'll say it again: Gilmore's an excellent player. That GB game was the best performance by a Bills' CB that I can remember. This will ruffle some feathers: I think that many of the folks that criticize him simply don't know what they're watching with regard to DB play and responsibilities. This. He's a bad man and only getting badder. Kids gonna get laid 12+ mill a year by someone. Better be us Edited April 20, 2015 by NewEra
Wayne Cubed Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 I think it's 1 part not seeing how good Gilmore is and 1 part not realizing that shutdown corners actually give up catches too. Yup. Darelle Revis gave up a TD Doug Baldwin in the Super Bowl.... Shut down does not mean no catches ever.
Agent 91 Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 I said it before, and I'll say it again: Gilmore's an excellent player. That GB game was the best performance by a Bills' CB that I can remember. This will ruffle some feathers: I think that many of the folks that criticize him simply don't know what they're watching with regard to DB play and responsibilities. To be fair bandit. He was not as good his first 2 years so we know what we are watching. I still don't see him as elite. But... if he builds on last year he is on his way.
Gugny Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 I said it before, and I'll say it again: Gilmore's an excellent player. That GB game was the best performance by a Bills' CB that I can remember. This will ruffle some feathers: I think that many of the folks that criticize him simply don't know what they're watching with regard to DB play and responsibilities. Can I get an amen? This. He's a bad man and only getting badder. Kids gonna get laid 12+ mill a year by someone. Better be us That's getting laid 32,877 times/day. I hope he has time to practice.
thebandit27 Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 To be fair bandit. He was not as good his first 2 years so we know what we are watching. I still don't see him as elite. But... if he builds on last year he is on his way. Perhaps not quite as good, but he did have an 11-game stretch as a rookie where he didn't allow a single TD. He also went the final 6 games of 2013 without allowing one. I think NoSaint hit the nail between the eyes on this one...even the best give up catches.
elroy16 Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 Gilmore is up and down. Yes, the GB game was pretty good. Others, maybe avg at best. Still, he doesn't look like the shutdown corner we all expected out of college. Learning curve is long for CB's, and gilmore is coming up on his prime. He may yet get there, but he certainly has not lived up to his hype yet. The Bills have been desperate to sell him as a shutdown....he just hasn't done it yet. Yeah, you're right. Giving up one catch on eight throws in a half and then not being tested the second half by a HOF QB is pretty good. Give me a break, the man had two fantastic games against HOF QB's, and you give him a, "it was pretty good." I wish you could stand in front of the secondary and Donnie Henderson and tell them your thoughts. They'd laugh so hard they'd probably pee their pants.
Mr. WEO Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 This. He's a bad man and only getting badder. Kids gonna get laid 12+ mill a year by someone. Better be us Yeah, he could be the next Nate Clements or Asoumugha..... Funny thing about "shut down corners": everyone wants one, but as soon a they have to pay for one, they want them any more. Clements: 4 teams in his final 7 seasons Asomugha: 3 teams in his last 4 years Revis: 4 teams in the past 4 years (counted the Jets twice because 3 teams in a row let Revis walk).
JohnC Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 (edited) Yeah, he could be the next Nate Clements or Asoumugha..... Funny thing about "shut down corners": everyone wants one, but as soon a they have to pay for one, they want them any more. Clements: 4 teams in his final 7 seasons Asomugha: 3 teams in his last 4 years Revis: 4 teams in the past 4 years (counted the Jets twice because 3 teams in a row let Revis walk). Revis left teams in pursuit of more money. It had nothing to do with his former teams not wanting him. All the teams he played for coveted him and dealt for him. His departures were mostly due to him pursuing his financial interest. In that respect he is a wise business man.He is a tremendous player who will probably end up in the HOF. Edited April 20, 2015 by JohnC
Mr. WEO Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 Revis left teams in pursuit of more money. It had nothing to do with his former teams not wanting him. All the teams he played for coveted him and dealt for him. His departures were mostly due to him pursuing his financial interest. In that respect he is a wise business man.He is a tremendous player who will probably end up in the HOF. As I said, he left because each team didn't want to pay him (didn't see the value). They all wanted him, then they didn't want him the next year. He would still be on NE if they paid him what he wanted. They chose not to. Same with Tampa. In fact the Bucs signed him for 16 million a season for 6 years. After one year, they couldn't even trade him. So...every team wants one until they have to pay for them.... Yeah, he may go on to the HOF. But as for his impact--take NE for instance, one of the stat lines for NE is their passing game with and the other is without Revis the past 2 seasons. Can you guess which is which? Rank: 17 YPG: 240 AttPG: 36 TD: 24 INT: 16 % compl: 60 Sacks: 40 20+ yard receptions: 62 QB rating: 84 Rank: 15 YPG: 239 AttPG: 37 TD: 25 INT: 17 %compl: 57 Sacks: 48 20+: 48 QB rating: 81
JohnC Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 As I said, he left because each team didn't want to pay him (didn't see the value). They all wanted him, then they didn't want him the next year. He would still be on NE if they paid him what he wanted. They chose not to. Same with Tampa. In fact the Bucs signed him for 16 million a season for 6 years. After one year, they couldn't even trade him. So...every team wants one until they have to pay for them.... Yeah, he may go on to the HOF. But as for his impact--take NE for instance, one of the stat lines for NE is their passing game with and the other is without Revis the past 2 seasons. Can you guess which is which? Rank: 17 YPG: 240 AttPG: 36 TD: 24 INT: 16 % compl: 60 Sacks: 40 20+ yard receptions: 62 QB rating: 84 Rank: 15 YPG: 239 AttPG: 37 TD: 25 INT: 17 %compl: 57 Sacks: 48 20+: 48 QB rating: 81 With respect to the stats you presented for the two years it doesn't matter to me. What is apparent to me (not necessarily you) is that he was an important factor on defense and the team in their SB run. Revis is a max player. The Pats were able to fit him in from a cap standpoint on a rich one year deal but from the way they manage their cap they couldn't do it on a long term deal. On all the teams that Revis played for he played at a very high level. Even on the teams he left he departed mostly because of financial considerations for himself. The Pats were very public that they wanted to keep him but they wouldn'ty deviate from how they managed their cap stucture to keep him. As I stated in the prior post he is a HOF player and a very costly player. The teams he played for were more than satisfied with his high level of performance but from a business standpoint they couldn't/wouldn't fit his expansive constract into their respective franchise's salary structure.
Mr. WEO Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 With respect to the stats you presented for the two years it doesn't matter to me. What is apparent to me (not necessarily you) is that he was an important factor on defense and the team in their SB run. Revis is a max player. The Pats were able to fit him in from a cap standpoint on a rich one year deal but from the way they manage their cap they couldn't do it on a long term deal. On all the teams that Revis played for he played at a very high level. Even on the teams he left he departed mostly because of financial considerations for himself. The Pats were very public that they wanted to keep him but they wouldn'ty deviate from how they managed their cap stucture to keep him. As I stated in the prior post he is a HOF player and a very costly player. The teams he played for were more than satisfied with his high level of performance but from a business standpoint they couldn't/wouldn't fit his expansive constract into their respective franchise's salary structure. I'm not arguing that Revis is not a great corner. I'm saying it's clear that paying top dollar for a "shut down corner" is not necessarily money well spent--history has shown this. Revis had another great year on a great team, but the overall performance of their defense was no better with him than without him the previous year (slightly worse in several categories). Their FO obviously saw this as well and made little attempt to keep him, an All Pro CB.
Fadingpain Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 http://buf.scout.com/story/1538821-all-22-stephon-gilmore-lockdown-cornerback?s=24 "How good was Gilmore in 2014? The analytics site, Pro Football Focus, gave Gilmore a positive rating from Week 8 to the end of Gilmore's season in Week 16. Even Gilmores negative ratings weren't bad. Of Gilmore's six negative ratings, five were between -0.2 and -0.9 (0.0 is considered average)." Gilmore is not a lock-down, shutdown corner. Yet. But he will be. He's a very good player and his star is on the rise.
3rdand12 Posted April 20, 2015 Posted April 20, 2015 Gilmore is not a lock-down, shutdown corner. Yet. But he will be. He's a very good player and his star is on the rise. I am not arguing with you. But the lock down shut down corner label grates on my nerves. If Gilmore can play man coverage with no help from snap to whistle and succeed then he is one hell of a corner. I agree he is becoming just that. He was so much better against the run last year , that i really noticed and was pretty darned impressed. Go Gilmore !
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