The Wiz Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 @OmarKelly: I said this 2 weeks ago & I stand by it now. I'd rather have the $7M back than Charles Clay. No shade to Clay. Love him like a play cousin wtf is a " play cousin" - guess I'm behind on the lingo Maybe a play cousin is someone that's related to you but far enough away in relation that you don't see an issue fooling around with them.
BackInDaDay Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) we are going to see a lot of movement before the snap this season, and plays designed to screw with how and where the defense expects us to attack - and attack is the key word here. from an Xs and Os perspective, we shouldn't consider any of these skill position signings as individual investments - they're a combined investment in a broken offense that left a championship caliber defense out of the playoffs. the last staff thought they could fit the QB to an offense this staff is going to fit an offence to the QB Edited March 18, 2015 by BackInDaDay
eball Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 You don't pay a guy 7-8 mil a year cap hit to be a decoy. His numbers absolutely will prove his worth. Anything less than 60 catches a year, 650 yards and 6 TD's will be a disappointment. I don't think these are ridiculous expectations. If they are lower, then DW and RR are not on the same page. Mike Rodak, is that you?
smapdi Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 I really don't think the Bills overpaid for him. I think some posters dont understand just how much the salary cap has gone up the past few years. The NFL is the zenith of pro sports in America so revenue is through the roof which means the cap increases. It went up 10 million this year and probably will do the same next year. That means over this year & next, teams have an extra 20 million in cap room that didn't exist a decade ago and a cap floor that is steadily rising as well. With the cap floor in place, every NFL team has to spend money so player salaries arw going up. Hell, Kyle Rudolph, who has never had a season as good as Clay's & who has struggled with injuries, got a 5 year / 36 million dollar deal last year. That is pretty much what we're paying Clay. Miami was going to pay him 7 million a year but since we're giving him 7.5, that's over paying?? The kid is 26 years old & is the absolute perfect fit for what Roman and Ryan want to do one offense. I have zero complaints about the deal. Pagula has plenty of money & the Bills have plenty of cap space next season to resign Gilmore ans Dareus before the projected 10 million increase in cap room. I swear some of you just want to complain no matter what this team does. This team finally has a legit GM/coach/owner with a blank check after years of cash to the crap and mediocre, 2nd tier FAs. Enjoy it guys
BackInDaDay Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) I swear some of you just want to complain no matter what this team does. This team finally has a legit GM/coach/owner with a blank check after years of cash to the crap and mediocre, 2nd tier FAs. Enjoy it guys see.. even Towelie gets it!! Edited March 18, 2015 by BackInDaDay
NoSaint Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 I really don't think the Bills overpaid for him. I think some posters dont understand just how much the salary cap has gone up the past few years. The NFL is the zenith of pro sports in America so revenue is through the roof which means the cap increases. It went up 10 million this year and probably will do the same next year. That means over this year & next, teams have an extra 20 million in cap room that didn't exist a decade ago and a cap floor that is steadily rising as well. With the cap floor in place, every NFL team has to spend money so player salaries arw going up. Hell, Kyle Rudolph, who has never had a season as good as Clay's & who has struggled with injuries, got a 5 year / 36 million dollar deal last year. That is pretty much what we're paying Clay. Miami was going to pay him 7 million a year but since we're giving him 7.5, that's over paying?? The kid is 26 years old & is the absolute perfect fit for what Roman and Ryan want to do one offense. I have zero complaints about the deal. Pagula has plenty of money & the Bills have plenty of cap space next season to resign Gilmore ans Dareus before the projected 10 million increase in cap room. I swear some of you just want to complain no matter what this team does. This team finally has a legit GM/coach/owner with a blank check after years of cash to the crap and mediocre, 2nd tier FAs. Enjoy it guys if it were a standard issue 7.5, wed probably catch a little flack, 24m in the first 2 years is a lot if things dont work out and will escalate the questions. (still a fan of the signing, but trying to fill in some of the gray area between GREAT! and TERRIBLE!)
LabattBlue Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 So based on Mario Williams salary, what should his stats be? 100 tackles, 25 sacks, 10 forced fumbles 5 INTs....he should also probably play on offense considering the money he's making I am not sure what I said in my post that deserves this exaggerated response? Are the numbers I proposed for Clay outrageous? Did I say he has to have 100 catches 1200 yards and 15 TD's?
Dorkington Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) You don't pay a guy 7-8 mil a year cap hit to be a decoy. His numbers absolutely will prove his worth. Anything less than 60 catches a year, 650 yards and 6 TD's will be a disappointment. I don't think these are ridiculous expectations. If they are lower, then DW and RR are not on the same page. I wouldn't be surprised if it were Roman angling to get Clay, vs Rex. All we can do is look at Roman's history of TE use to get an idea of what to expect from Clay. Will he meet those numbers? I doubt it, simply because the opportunities will be spread out, AND we'll be running a lot. That doesn't mean he's a decoy though, imo. There's one ball for Watkins, Woods, Harvin, Clay, and McCoy. And that's before you get to other guys like Hogan, Goodwin, FredEx, Gragg/Gray. My expectation of Clay isn't in final stats, but if he performs when called upon. Does he make the key block? Does he get open when his number is called? Does he make a play with the ball after catching it? Etc. Vernon Davis, considered one of the better TEs in the league, imo... 2011 - 16 gms, 67 rec, 792 yds, 6 TD 2012 - 16 gms, 41 rec, 548 yds, 5 TD 2013 - 15 gms, 52 rec, 850 yds, 13 TD 2014 - 14 gms, 26 rec, 245 yds, 2 TD Total: 61 gms, 186 rec, 2435 yds, 26 TD Avg 16 game: 48 rec, 639 yds, 7 TD For comparison's sake... taking Clay's last two years, you get a 16 game average of 68 rec, 727 yds, 5 TD Edited March 18, 2015 by Dorkington
4merper4mer Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 Maybe a play cousin is someone that's related to you but far enough away in relation that you don't see an issue fooling around with them. so like a sibling in Canada?
The Wiz Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 so like a sibling in Canada?Yea. Or your sister/mother/wife in Arkansas.
JÂy RÛßeÒ Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 Bills offense is going to be "sum is greater than its parts"...we have players that have to be accounted for all over the place...somewhere, someone is going to be open, there is no possible way to cover all these threats... Challenge will be, do we have a QB that can recognize who is going to be open? Actually I think at this point the challenge will be do we have an O Line that can enable those skill players to do what they do best?
nucci Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) I am not sure what I said in my post that deserves this exaggerated response? Are the numbers I proposed for Clay outrageous? Did I say he has to have 100 catches 1200 yards and 15 TD's? Sorry, overreaction. I guess my point is stats are not always the true measure of a players contribution to the team. Edited March 18, 2015 by nucci
swnybillsfan Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 Yea. Or your sister/mother/wife in Arkansas. and it's just the one girl standing there, right?
Canadian Bills Fan Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 so like a sibling in Canada? Hey now..... CBF
JoeF Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 and it's just the one girl standing there, right? Family tree has no branches....virgin is a girl who can outrun her .....
The Wiz Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 and it's just the one girl standing there, right?Bingo.
Big Turk Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 Actually I think at this point the challenge will be do we have an O Line that can enable those skill players to do what they do best? Not worried, Kromer will have those guys playing well
BillnutinHouston Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 I wouldn't be surprised if it were Roman angling to get Clay, vs Rex. All we can do is look at Roman's history of TE use to get an idea of what to expect from Clay. I'm almost certain you're correct. Roman is a highly accomplished OC and this is Rex's and Roman's first year together. I see nothing in the tea leaves to suggest Rex feels the need to micromanage Roman's offensive personnel.
starrymessenger Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 I'm not so sure Clay wouldn't have comparable numbers if he had Peyton Manning throwing him the ball for the past three years. Except for TD receptions their numbers actually are pretty similar the last two years, even tho Clay has fewer games played due to injury in 2014. Now that Mr Bortles will be serving it up to Julius instead of Peyton you can expect those TD numbers to go down, and probably be more in line with what Clay will do in Blo (6-8 per is my guess). And Julius can't make that block that will spring McCoy on a game winning touchdown run. Charles Clay can. And Julius can't set up in the backfield. Charles Clay can. Assuming he avoids the injury bug, we did not overpay. Charles Clay is a stud and will functionally be a centerpiece of the Bills O. This is a hugely important move and that's why they are bending over backwards to get it done.
Beerball Posted March 18, 2015 Posted March 18, 2015 Players are worth more to different teams because of the style of offense, other players on that team, how coaches use players, how much cap they have, etc. Clay is worth more to the Bills than almost any other team. Julius Thomas is a far better player as a standard pass catcher TE with a decent QB. But Clay is a much better fit for the Bills who want to confuse defenses with different combinations and formations and motion and a running game/short passing game. That all has to be factored into whether a player is worth it or not. That and the fact that he was an RFA. God I love the internet. Hand wringing and crying over the Bills not getting a talented TE. Bills sign a TE. Hand wringing and crying over the Bills signing a talented TE. You & I must be reading different threads.
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