Beerball Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 I think he is shorter. But that said, as I stated earlier, some owners will use their weight once in a while on player moves and others don't. It's veto power that all owners have. But Whaley has final say on roster moves. That's his job. Pegula hopes he never once has to exercise that veto power because he wants his GM to have total control over the roster. He, Terry, just wants to be told what they are doing. If you want to be technical, no GM has "final say" because all owners can do whatever the hell they want. But in this discussion, that would be less accurate. The GM has control over the roster like most teams. Or the HC does, which is becoming increasingly more prevalent. The Cowboys I guess, with Jerry Jones, are the only team that doesn't. There are times when stepping in and letting your opinion be known is important. I'm biased, but, to me this is one of those times.
negativo Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 There are times when stepping in and letting your opinion be known is important. I'm biased, but, to me this is one of those times. You're not biased, you're objective, reasoned and completely accurate.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Tim Graham is generally interested in two things: the Bills failing and his rolling in their failures with his tongue happily wagging like a dog in schitt. Check that: three things. He still enjoys spending his weekends trolling fans about the "Redskin" thing. Gaaah! We recently got a puppy so the last part of that is all too evocative
realtruelove Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Why don't we let this whole situation play out? I'm all for what's in the best interest of the whole team, not the feelings of one player and certainly not sentimental fans.
Saint Doug Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 I'm beginning to think that Leroi is one of the Pegula kids, or some other relative/close friend of a family member. Always sticks up for the Pegulas. Said stuff about what was happening in Boca, even at least once saying "Here in Boca." Has great insider information but it is fluid because even Whaley and Rex don't know exactly what is going to happen, etc. Not sure about it of course. If it's true I think it's great even if reports will be biased. Could be. He's definitely not someone on inside making any football decisions. I think that came to light with the EJ's going to be cut comment.
Kirby Jackson Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 (edited) Dang what's with all the Leroi haters? The guy has inside info but he's not Nostradamus. He was right about them wanting to cut Fred a week before. Things change. There was an uproar from fans and Pegula had to step in. If we aren't appreciative then he's just going to keep his info to himself. I for one love all of the Bills info we can get our hands on Well said kdiggz. If things were phrased as the Bills would like..." it would be better. With that being said things change all of the time and if someone that has some knowledge of the plan & shares it with the group we should appreciate them, not attack them. Edited March 10, 2015 by Kirby Jackson
NoSaint Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Well said kdiggz. If things were phrased as the Bills would like..." it would be better. With that being said things change all of the time and if someone that has some knowledge of the plan shares it with the group we should appreciate them, not attack them. Yup - if we assume he's hearing info but clumsy in his presentation, it's easy to still see the value. Just have to soften it to our own ear and then see how it aligns with other reports.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 IMO, this is about Whaley trying to forcibly justify his bad trade for Bryce Brown, who flat out sucks. Seems a pattern for Whaley to keep beating the dead horse of his overreaches until we revolt. So, in keeping with this, OUR Freddy must be sacrificed to validate his quest. Well, let's see how this one plays out with fans and media for ya, Dougy boy. You're entitled to your opinion. Facts are, we needed another RB last year to back up FredEx and CJ in case of injury. If the Bills analysis was that Bryce Brown was as good a player as they were likely to be able to draft in the 4th round, then it was a decent move to trade a 4th round pick for a RB who has shown the ability to stick in the league for 2 years already. And in fact, FredEx and CJ were injured and Brown was needed to fill in. I love FredEx and I don't believe the Bills should cut him, but from a pure objective standpoint, 32 out of 32 NFL GMs would tell you that cutting a RB who will be 2nd or 3rd string, is past the age where most RBs show a decline. and who counts $2.7M against the cap, is sound NFL business and requires no rhetoric about sacrifice, validation, overreaches, justification, and quests. The reason I think it's a mistake is because FredEx is driven to the likes of a Jerry Rice for conditioning and taking care of himself, has less NFL wear n tear because he got his chance late, and because all our RBs had poor productivity last year but FredEx > Brown in rushing YPA and receiving YPG. But that's just my opinion, and I understand that both moves (trading for Brown and cutting Fredex) make logical sense in the framework of the NFL. Whaley has no need to forcibly justify any move he makes. I have absolutely no idea what "beating the dead horse of his overreaches until we revolt" is supposed to mean - if there are other moves Whaley has made that you dislike, it would seem more rational to just name them.
Perk71 Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Well said kdiggz. If things were phrased as the Bills would like..." it would be better. With that being said things change all of the time and if someone that has some knowledge of the plan & shares it with the group we should appreciate them, not attack them. I agree
Fadingpain Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Why don't we let this whole situation play out? I'm all for what's in the best interest of the whole team, not the feelings of one player and certainly not sentimental fans. How dare you! Talking sensibly and logically!? You suggest we should just see "how this situation plays out" rather than engage in page after page of meaningless, emotionally driven, nonsensical in-fighting about misconceptions and distorted assumptions regarding knowledge we aren't privy to? This will not stand! It will not stand! I mean, if this is going to be the new policy, what would anyone here talk about!?
davspo Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Fred's very presence makes this team better. He is the ultimate professional. Doesn't matter what the score was Freddy always played his heart out. Props to you Freddy - you are the most important Bill since the golden era of the 1990s.
Fadingpain Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Dang what's with all the Leroi haters? The guy has inside info but he's not Nostradamus. He was right about them wanting to cut Fred a week before. Things change. There was an uproar from fans and Pegula had to step in. If we aren't appreciative then he's just going to keep his info to himself. I for one love all of the Bills info we can get our hands on This is a myth. An urban legend. Being propagated only at places like this forum. No one here knows what the plan at OBD was, what it is, or how, if at all, it has changed in the last few days/hours with regard to Fred Jackson. Fred's very presence makes this team better. He is the ultimate professional. Doesn't matter what the score was Freddy always played his heart out. Props to you Freddy - you are the most important Bill since the golden era of the 1990s. All valid opinions and I share most of those. Doesn't have anything to do with what is going on OBD right now though.
Deranged Rhino Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 I've stayed out of this because Fred is one of my all time favorite Bills, yet I also understand this is a brutal game on and off the field. It's business and I understand why the move makes sense financially. I have no idea what's going to happen even with Pegula's declaration but I hope he stays. Personally I think he played through a bad groin injury, coming back two weeks early to help with the playoff chase, and that's why his numbers waned down the stretch. I hadn't seen any signs prior to that injury of Fred losing a step, and frankly I don't think he's done. All that said, if they cut him, I get it. It'd be a shame, but I understand. Personally, despite knowing the business realities of the sport, I'd make Fred a life-time Bill without hesitation. He's earned the right to go out on his own terms. But, that's probably why I'm not a GM.
ndirish1978 Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 You're not biased, you're objective, reasoned and completely accurate. I agree. The Bills have been pretty much garbage for most of this millennium. I don't think I'm going out on a limb to say that, as someone who loves the team, rooting for them has often been painful. I understand it's just a sport, but I get frustrated and upset when the media and people IRL rip on MY team or call them irrelevant, because this team is not irrelevant to me. I will talk dispassionately about 99% of the other players on the roster, but Fred Jackson has singlehandedly been responsible for many of the often all too rare occasions over the past few years in which I've been flat-out excited to root for the Bills. When you're mired in mediocrity, you look for a reason to have hope and Fred has always represented that for me. The guy plays every down like it's his last and has carried subpar teams on his shoulders on countless occasions. I don't really care what his cap number is: Fred Jackson is Buffalo to me and I don't think I could support cutting him for any reason. He deserves to retire a Bill. I now await your insults...
HalftimeAdjustment Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 I think Leroi is associated somehow with Whaley or someone who had insight into the pro player analysis. And you know even though I don't agree with everything he says or his view on Fred, I value his input and do not think he is "trolling".
K-9 Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 What's gonna happen if Freddy gets cut in camp because he isn't cutting it any more? More petitions? More Zubaz and Merrels attired, plywood sign bearing protesters at the Ralph? Will El Pegaul throw himself in front of the door? Will he fire Whaley and the coaching staff because they had the temerity to cut a player who simply isn't good enough anymore? I honestly don't know if Freddy will be there or not come August. He has lost a step for sure. Maybe two. That's been apparent since the summer of '13. He hasn't lost an ounce of his veteran savvy though. Indeed, he's probably acquired some more. Sooner or later, though, savvy won't compensate for that lost step. Father time is undefeated as they say. 34 is long in the tooth for an RB, even one as "fresh" as Freddy. GO BILLS!!!
devldog131 Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 As long as you don't listen to the fans, Aaron Maybin will be on your roster. Including the group of fans, myself included, inside Radio City Music Hall chanting "O-RAK-PO!" when the Bills were on the clock before they elected to take Aaron freaking maybin...
Augie Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Well said kdiggz. If things were phrased as the Bills would like..." it would be better. With that being said things change all of the time and if someone that has some knowledge of the plan & shares it with the group we should appreciate them, not attack them. Agree 100%. Sometimes there may be a plan that doesn't quite work out. Anyone ever have that happen in your life? Sometimes it may even be MORE interesting to know what they wanted to do as opposed to what they did do. The draft is always like that for me, I know who we got... who did we just miss on? Just because it doesn't come to fruition doesn't make it worthless or a cause for attacks. It also doesn't make it true, but we can all judge for ourselves there. I'll either follow or ignore, but it requires a lot more than being wrong once in a while for me to get personal about it.
GG Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 What's gonna happen if Freddy gets cut in camp because he isn't cutting it any more? More petitions? More Zubaz and Merrels attired, plywood sign bearing protesters at the Ralph? Will El Pegaul throw himself in front of the door? Will he fire Whaley and the coaching staff because they had the temerity to cut a player who simply isn't good enough anymore? I honestly don't know if Freddy will be there or not come August. He has lost a step for sure. Maybe two. That's been apparent since the summer of '13. He hasn't lost an ounce of his veteran savvy though. Indeed, he's probably acquired some more. Sooner or later, though, savvy won't compensate for that lost step. Father time is undefeated as they say. 34 is long in the tooth for an RB, even one as "fresh" as Freddy. GO BILLS!!! In that scenario, there won't be an outcry because he would have lost it on its merits. The pushback over the last couple of days is that he would be getting replaced by a guy who couldn't beat him out when he was playing on one leg and a JAG from the Jets who has been pedestrian. Note, that no one squeaked a bit when the Bills brought in McCoy, which stands to greatly diminish Fred's role.
Beerball Posted March 10, 2015 Posted March 10, 2015 Well said kdiggz. If things were phrased as the Bills would like..." it would be better. With that being said things change all of the time and if someone that has some knowledge of the plan & shares it with the group we should appreciate them, not attack them. Yes, things do change. That's the exact reason that someone who talked to someone who talked to someone shouldn't, IMO, make pronouncements. As you suggest, a better approach would be to say something along the lines of..."take this for what it's worth, but I heard..." Coming here and stating possibilities as facts does no one any good.
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