DrDawkinstein Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 If Marrone had stayed on and Polian had come in, there was no way Whaley would have survived. No way. Whaley and Marrone did not get along, and Polian said in late 2014 that Marrone should be considered for coach of the year. Plus there's the whole Chris Polian issue. I should stress that I'm GLAD Whaley is still here, and I think we dodged a bullet. I think he's done a decent job so far, although until we get to 10 wins and feature a credible offense, I'm in wait-and-see mode. To reiterate, what I'm basically saying is that Whaley wouldn't have survived the arrival of Polian, who clearly sees the success of his son as a legacy objective. In my humble opinion, any other interpretation is just unfounded kumbaya talk. Excellent post. Makes sense to me. For the sake of argument, assuming your opinion on all of this is correct, we definitely dodged a bullet then. I'd take Whaley over Polian's kid everyday.
jr1 Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Rex was worried he would gain weight from Kiko's cooking
Canadian Bills Fan Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Rex was worried he would gain weight from Kiko's cooking LOL CBF
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Big Wins, Rex said it multiple times since being hired. Kiko isnt big. Also you wonder about Hughes. McPhee maybe makes more sense to Rex. Rex has also said multiple times, "just get me players who can play". Kiko can play. @RapSheet: Interested to learn trading #Bills LB Kiko Alonso was one of the first things Rex Ryan wanted to do when hired. Perhaps not a scheme fit Kiko was obvious trade bait - a guy who had a very successful rookie season and attracted national attention but who became expendable when the Bills D had an even better season while he played left bench. And I'm one who really liked Kiko but has to admit this from an objective assessment.
JohnC Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Fantastic post John! I for one am absolutely thrilled by this trade. I view a presumably healthy Kiko as very, very strong in coverage but frankly, a bit light in the ass vs. the run. Knowing it's a passing league these days, I supose this isn't a huge liability any more. That said, McCoy over Spiller? Not even close. McCoy is going to score touchdowns, as well as gain steady yardage providing we can improve the line. If nobody offers Bulaga sick money he would be a nice fit imo, along with another OG from the draft. Btw, guess who Greg Cossell is praising on Sirius? You guessed it, Cassell. It looks as if this will be a fun season. I am an admirer of Greg Cossell and his takes on players and prospects. He bases his opinions on what he sees on tape and is not afraid to go against the grain if that is what he sees. Almost everyone is making the same point in emphasizing the upgrade of the OL. I'm not a fan of Incognito but without a doubt he is an upgrade. (From a football standpoint one of my major problems with him is that he gets too many penalties. He reminds me of a lesser version of Conrad Dobler.) I wouldn't be against using our first pick in the second round on a guard. There are a number of good combo T/Gs in this draft. I would love to see Kouandjio get back on track. He is working hard this offseason to prepare himself for the season. Last year he was simply unprepared for the major leap to the pro ranks. People forget how young he is. And he is a good kid! This is a very good situation for Cassell. All that he is asked to do is play within himself and do it within the confines of a fairly simple offense. This is not going to be a gimmick offense with a lot of surprises. The offense is being built to suit a Greg Roman conceived offense compared to a more complex and creative Chan Gailey type offense. I'm not suggesting that one OC is better than the other. What I am saying is that they have very different approaches to offenses and they need different types of players to match their different visions. There is a different feel and atmosphere under Pegula's ownership. This doesn't have the old staid organizational environment any longer. I'm a strong believer in fundamentals such as smart drafting and doing your best to develop and keep your own talent. But in the NFL of today with the cap and player movement you have to be able to manage your franchise in a more creative and flexible manner. I like very much what I am seeing.
Deranged Rhino Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Why would Kiko walk across a bridge when he can just pull New Jersey close enough to walk to? :lol:
Kelly the Dog Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 This is a very good situation for Cassell. All that he is asked to do is play within himself and do it within the confines of a fairly simple offense. This is not going to be a gimmick offense with a lot of surprises. The offense is being built to suit a Greg Roman conceived offense compared to a more complex and creative Chan Gailey type offense. I'm not suggesting that one OC is better than the other. What I am saying is that they have very different approaches to offenses and they need different types of players to match their different visions. There is a different feel and atmosphere under Pegula's ownership. This doesn't have the old staid organizational environment any longer. I'm a strong believer in fundamentals such as smart drafting and doing your best to develop and keep your own talent. But in the NFL of today with the cap and player movement you have to be able to manage your franchise in a more creative and flexible manner. I like very much what I am seeing. Roman's offense is pretty complex. Yes, it's a power running game but it has a ton of different looks, motion, movement, presnap reads, numerous versions of the same kind of play, disguising, etc. It's not simple to learn or defend.
JohnC Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 (edited) I get that most fans don't care who makes personnel moves or the OBD organizational chart. It's not exciting, but following this is very interesting to some. Personally, I like to know the hierarchy I work under, or when I was in the Army, the chain of command and who was making decisions above me. Development and execution of strategy is part and parcel of what a team needs to do. It's not simply players showing up on game day. It's the acquisition of them as it relates to the scheme employed. With the Bills, none of us are going behind that door to see how decisions are made. But when moves happen, like trading Kiko, it reveals a little of how they do things. My personal feeling is Doug Whaley is no longer GM in the classic sense, particularly with the HC not reporting to him. He's akin to what some GM's have become: the people who process transactions but have a seat at the table. They don't run the table anymore because HC's have as much or perhaps more say. And that's because the first guy who gets fired when things go south is the HC. Your view on the organizational chart and how it functions is very interesting. But I respectfully disagree with your take, although it is very well described. In the NFL of today the organization has to be much more flexible and nimble to deal with the challenges of the cap and inevitable numerous player movements. If the front office and the coaching staff are not in sync there is going to be trouble manifested in incoherent player acquistions working against coaching philosophies. In other posts I have stated that Rex Ryan is not a better coach than Doug Marrone. That is not to say that he is a lesser coach. But from an organizational standpoint he is a better fit for us and has a better and more respectful working relationship with the GM. Doug Marrone took a Bill Parcells approach to his position when he didn't have the Parcell stature and authority. That is how in the end he sabotaged himself in his job. Rex is in a good position to exchange his thoughts with a secure GM and front office staff and have them seriously considered. That is not a diminution of the GM's authority; it is reflection of a GM who is smart enough to run his operation in a very modern manner that is less authoritari. Tom Donahoe would be appalled with such a more collegial approach. Roman's offense is pretty complex. Yes, it's a power running game but it has a ton of different looks, motion, movement, presnap reads, numerous versions of the same kind of play, disguising, etc. It's not simple to learn or defend. The caliber of qbing is going to be a factor in limiting what can and can't be done. Because Cassell is more experienced with reads and reacting than EJ is the implementation is going to be more expansive. The playbook is going to be the same for each qb but Cassell should be able to run a fuller offense than EJ is capable of doing. Edited March 5, 2015 by JohnC
BuffaloBillsForever Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 (edited) Rex has also said multiple times, "just get me players who can play". Kiko can play. Kiko was obvious trade bait - a guy who had a very successful rookie season and attracted national attention but who became expendable when the Bills D had an even better season while he played left bench. And I'm one who really liked Kiko but has to admit this from an objective assessment. Obvious trade bait? One, yes one poster and Mike Schopp prior proprosed trading Kiko and they got laughed at and told they were idiots. Edited March 5, 2015 by BuffaloBillsForever
Kelly the Dog Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Your view on the organizational chart and how it functions is very interesting. But I respectfully disagree with your take, although it is very well described. In the NFL of today the organization has to be much more flexible and nimble to deal with the challenges of the cap and inevitable numerous player movements. If the front office and the coaching staff are not in sync there is going to be trouble manifested in incoherent player acquistions working against coaching philosophies. In other posts I have stated that Rex Ryan is not a better coach than Doug Marrone. That is not to say that he is a lesser coach. But from an organizational standpoint he is a better fit for us and has a better and more respectful working relationship with the GM. Doug Marrone took a Bill Parcells approach to his position when he didn't have the Parcell stature and authority. That is how in the end he sabotaged himself in his job. Rex is in a good position to exchange his thoughts with a secure GM and front office staff and have them seriously considered. That is not a diminution of the GM's authority it is reflection of a GM who is smart enough to run his operation in a very modern manner that is less authoritarian and more nimble. Tom Donahoe would be appalled with such a more collegial approach. Some people are just azzholes, some change with power, some change for the better over time. Donohoe seemed to be a decent team player for a long time in Pittsburgh, had some success which went to his head, got into a power struggle with a guy (Cowher) who had equal success and it went to his head, Donohoe lost, went to Buffalo determined not to let that happen again, was given even more power, and then it blew up in his face to the point where he cannot get another serious job. If he were to get back in the game, I doubt he would be that power hungry. Doug Marrone from all reports was a very good OL coach and team player when Chuck Modkins-style OC to Sean Payton, who is a great coach. Then Marrone went to Syracuse and had more power and became self-proclaimed Saint Doug. He got an NFL job and from all reports got worse to the point that no one wanted him anymore. Rex Ryan had a ton of success early and he didn't seem to change. He sometimes had a lot of power, sometimes didn't, didn't overstep his bounds, and everyone loves him. Tom Coughlin had some success and was an ****. He made a concerted effort to not be one, his players responded and he won two Super Bowls as a different guy. Success made him worse and then he got better. There are all kinds. Power often changes people.
Deranged Rhino Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Obvious trade bait? One, yes one poster and Mike Schopp prior proprosed trading Kiko and they got laughed at and told they were idiots. To be fair, Schopp is an idiot.
BuffaloBillsForever Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 To be fair, Schopp is an idiot. Not in this instance.
Deranged Rhino Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 When it's 99.9% one tends to round up. :lol:
dave mcbride Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 Some people are just azzholes, some change with power, some change for the better over time. Donohoe seemed to be a decent team player for a long time in Pittsburgh, had some success which went to his head, got into a power struggle with a guy (Cowher) who had equal success and it went to his head, Donohoe lost, went to Buffalo determined not to let that happen again, was given even more power, and then it blew up in his face to the point where he cannot get another serious job. If he were to get back in the game, I doubt he would be that power hungry. Doug Marrone from all reports was a very good OL coach and team player when Chuck Modkins-style OC to Sean Payton, who is a great coach. Then Marrone went to Syracuse and had more power and became self-proclaimed Saint Doug. He got an NFL job and from all reports got worse to the point that no one wanted him anymore. Rex Ryan had a ton of success early and he didn't seem to change. He sometimes had a lot of power, sometimes didn't, didn't overstep his bounds, and everyone loves him. Tom Coughlin had some success and was an ****. He made a concerted effort to not be one, his players responded and he won two Super Bowls as a different guy. Success made him worse and then he got better. There are all kinds. Power often changes people. good post.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 5, 2015 Posted March 5, 2015 (edited) Obvious trade bait? One, yes one poster and Mike Schopp prior proprosed trading Kiko and they got laughed at and told they were idiots. Why would Doug Whaley and Rex Ryan care about a media tool and a fan board and whether or not they get laughed at? From an organizational perspective, who are the idea players to deal? -aging stars for whom you believe you have (or can obtain for a lower cost) quality replacements -young players who have shown promise at positions of team strength (where they're surplus) What are the dangers? -you either can't obtain the replacement you wanted or he turns out not to be as good -you thought a guy was surplus, but he wasn't Which player on the Bills showed promise enough to compete for national honors, but was completely unneeded on a top-5 D last year? The answer is the same regardless of what fan boards and media tools say and how it's greeted. Edited March 5, 2015 by Hopeful
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