Rapaport: Trading Kiko was Rex's idea

[eball]

I read that afterward too. Do I believe that story, which seems to have come straight from the Bills' Ministry of Propaganda? No, not really. One really shouldn't be too credulous of those puff pieces; it's a dog eat dog league. The pegulas were apparently set on hiring polian two weeks before, and he would have fired whaley in a new york minute. that is a fact. Anyway, i do hope that ryan and whaley can get along, and at present I'm optimistic. We shall see. As you said, it's the honeymoon period.

 

I don't think the word "fact" means what you think it means.

[BreezeMafia]

I somewhat believe it after he saw what Bradham and Brown did on film, and thought that perhaps Brown would be the inside guy and Bradham could play the outside guy. But only in the sense that "if we can get a star player in return for Kiko, let's do it" rather than "I don't like Kiko" or "he's not really all that good."

 

But, remember that the Eagles called the Bills on this one, from reports, the Bills didn't offer Kiko to the Eagles.

 

Really not surprised that Rex preferred to move Kiko. The biggest issue with Kiko at this stage and his age, and this can change of course, is his size. Think back to Rex's time in Baltimore and NY, his LB's were physically bigger, in the mold of Preston Brown and Nigel Bradham. David Harris would be perfect here.

 

I live in Philly and the Eagles fans are starting to really love this trade. I am an Eagles fan after my loyalty to the Bills and what I love the most is how much cap room the Eagles have available to start spending. I do think play to player, the Bills scored a big victory here.

[Nanker]

Kiko WANTED to go. Don't know why. I wish him well and hope he doesn't regret it.

It's really obvious, isn't it if you think about it for more than a New York Minute.

Philly is right across the Delaware from Camden, NJ - murder and car theft capitol of New Jersey - sure, but it's also the home of...

Campbell's Soup!

 

Think how much easier it will be for him to make commercials for them now that he can simply walk across the Walt Whitman bridge to their studio. It's a no-brainer.

 

What the Phillites don't realize yet though is that they'll soon be calling their beloved cheese steaks "Kikos". Yaeah. I'll hab too Kikos whiz wid, and one Kiko whiz widdout. An' gibbme sum fryes widat.

 

 

I don't think the word "fact" means what you think it means.

Not really sure how that went down, but I rather suspect that our dewy-eyed new owners were gingerly walking through the first steps of learning how to control this treasured prize they just bought and were seeking counsel from a respected source. The League has several people working in the office that advise owners on a variety of issues. They thought Polian would be that guy to walk them through the process of getting acclimated into ownership.

 

Thank God Polian got cold feet. It's my considered opinion that we would be in far worse share today if he had come on board than where we are right now. His teeth are dandelion yellow fer criminey. Yuck!

 

So far it looks like the Pegulas are big on giving people second chances. I think that's a good thing.

[ALLEN1QB]

Who cares who's idea it was. Does it really matter? We got over on Philly big time.

Edited March 5, 2015 by ORTON1QB

[MattM]

How is Harris in coverage?

I read on another thread that he played 99% of the D snaps in NY, so he can't be that bad

[Wayne Cubed]

As far as I'm aware Rex is in charge of the game day roster, of which, Kiko would ultimately fall into. He probably looked through last years film and determined that Kiko wasn't really needed, which he isn't. He then probably had a meeting with Whaley and said these are the guys I don't need and these are the guys I'd like to keep. Knowing all of this Whaley got the phone call from Kelly who probably said they would like to trade McCoy, what can the Bills offer? A draft pick? Whaley could have then said they weren't willing to trade a draft pick but how about Kiko Alonso? Kelly, foaming at the mouth to get another former Duck, says "Hell Yes!".

 

Deal is done.

 

None of that means Rex has more power than Whaley.

[atlbillsfan1975]

Rex has talked to Whaley about Kiko not being the best fit. The Eagles approach the Bills about the trade. Rex and Whaley talk it over and make the trade.

 

Seems like what a head coach and GM should be doing.

Bingo!

As opposed to yelling at each other in public

[Big Turk]

I really hope they get David Harris. I think Rex maybe wasn't a fan of Kiko's over pursuit on run plays and often reckless play.

Kiko was a big liability in the run game after the first half of the year when teams learned to use his overaggressiveness against him.

 

Specifically remember the first play against Tampa Bay where their RB faked like he was going one way behind the line, then cut back and went to the next hole over. Kiko bought the first move and the dude ran for an 80 yard TD because Kiko tried to make a tackle for a 3 yard loss instead of playing it right and making sure that cutback wasn't available. The RB should have maybe gained 3 or 4 yards on that play...

 

Maybe that's what Rex saw...too high risk perhaps?

[eball]

Not really sure how that went down, but I rather suspect that our dewy-eyed new owners were gingerly walking through the first steps of learning how to control this treasured prize they just bought and were seeking counsel from a respected source. The League has several people working in the office that advise owners on a variety of issues. They thought Polian would be that guy to walk them through the process of getting acclimated into ownership.

 

Thank God Polian got cold feet. It's my considered opinion that we would be in far worse share today if he had come on board than where we are right now. His teeth are dandelion yellow fer criminey. Yuck!

 

So far it looks like the Pegulas are big on giving people second chances. I think that's a good thing.

 

I was referring to the presumption "as fact" that Polian would have fired Whaley "in a New York minute."

 

That's about as far from fact as you can get. But when someone is on a crusade they tend to blur the line between fact and opinion.

[dave mcbride]

Is it yours to sell?

If Bugs Bunny can sell it, so can I. http://pollystreaming.com/Looney-Tunes-Bowery-Bugs_v12325 Edited March 5, 2015 by dave mcbride

[Doc]

Agree including taking so many coaches from the Jets.

Same issue Marrone has w/Syracuse coaches.

 

The difference, and it's a huge one, is that Ryan's coaches have had success in the NFL.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Rexy likes his LBs to be downhill Thumpers.

 

Kiko, even if he put on 8-10 more pounds somehow, is not a Thumper. He's a "move" LB.

 

Yep. He wants collision low crossers.

 

It was only better because another pick was invested and panned out (Brown), and Bradham had a huge year of development. And another LB (Spikes) was brought in - he's gone. Let's not act like Kiko was holding the D back. If anything, it could have been even better with him.

Possibly. But based off of last year's results, he wasn't an essential piece.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

another factor to think about is the D did excellent last year on the whole w/o Kiko.

so the thinking was why not see if we can get one of the best RB's playing for a guy not used last season..

[JohnC]

Too many people are evaluating the trade from the perspective of which team got the better of the deal. That shouldn't be the standard to make a judgment. For the Bills' perspective the issue is did it make the team better? In my opinion it does. It balances out our roster more between the defense and offense. If the Bills bolster the OL, which I believe they will do more of, then for us it was a good deal.

 

Regardless who our starting qb is going to be the strength of the team is still going to be the defense. But that doesn't mean that adding a good running game won't enhance the play of our still limited qb and offense.

 

Chip Kelly has a different vision on how to build a roster. One of the advantages of moving McCoy is giving him more cap space to add to his roster. In his mind he can bring in another back who is cheaper, such as Ingram from the Saints, and have more money to address other needs.

 

From what I heard on the radio Rex believed that he could do without Kiko who is more of a light and quick LBer. He prefers his inside LBer to be more of a thumper. If Kiko was going to move to the oustside Rex felt that last year's LBers can be just as effective, if not more, on the outsdie.

 

When all the deals are done and the draft is concluded the key for us entering the season is bolstering the OL and getting solid qb play, whether it is from EJ or from Cassell. As it stands the Bills are a fringe wildcard playoff team. That's where we are at. Understanding the status of your team and adjusting to it is what the organization is doing, and it is the right approach to take.

[Kelly the Dog]

Too many people are evaluating the trade from the perspective of which team got the better of the deal. That shouldn't be the standard to make a judgment. For the Bills' perspective the issue is did it make the team better? In my opinion it does. It balances out our roster more between the defense and offense. If the Bills bolster the OL, which I believe they will do more of, then for us it was a good deal.

 

Regardless who our starting qb is going to be the strength of the team is still going to be the defense. But that doesn't mean that adding a good running game won't enhance the play of our still limited qb and offense.

 

Chip Kelly has a different vision on how to build a roster. One of the advantages of moving McCoy is giving him more cap space to add to his roster. In his mind he can bring in another back who is cheaper, such as Ingram from the Saints, and have more money to address other needs.

 

From what I heard on the radio Rex believed that he could do without Kiko who is more of a light and quick LBer. He prefers his inside LBer to be more of a thumper. If Kiko was going to move to the oustside Rex felt that last year's LBers can be just as effective, if not more, on the outsdie.

 

When all the deals are done and the draft is concluded the key for us entering the season is bolstering the OL and getting solid qb play, whether it is from EJ or from Cassell. As it stands the Bills are a fringe wildcard playoff team. That's where we are at. Understanding the status of your team and adjusting to it is what the organization is doing, and it is the right approach to take.

 

Good post. This trade seems to be good for both teams. I hope Kiko kills it in Philly.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

From what I heard on the radio Rex believed that he could do without Kiko who is more of a light and quick LBer. He prefers his inside LBer to be more of a thumper. If Kiko was going to move to the oustside Rex felt that last year's LBers can be just as effective, if not more, on the outsdie.

 

I said as much in one of these threads.

 

The Bills D did very well w/o Kiko in 2014. The trade for a stud RB made sense.

 

I will miss Kiko regardless

[DrDawkinstein]

 

I was referring to the presumption "as fact" that Polian would have fired Whaley "in a New York minute."

 

That's about as far from fact as you can get. But when someone is on a crusade they tend to blur the line between fact and opinion.

 

Agreed. No way was Polian going to fire Whaley. That's not what he was coming here to do, and he proved as much by backing out when the light consulting work became a "heavy lift". Anyone saying as much is really reaching and ignoring Polian's actual statements and actions.

 

 

As far as I'm aware Rex is in charge of the game day roster, of which, Kiko would ultimately fall into. He probably looked through last years film and determined that Kiko wasn't really needed, which he isn't. He then probably had a meeting with Whaley and said these are the guys I don't need and these are the guys I'd like to keep. Knowing all of this Whaley got the phone call from Kelly who probably said they would like to trade McCoy, what can the Bills offer? A draft pick? Whaley could have then said they weren't willing to trade a draft pick but how about Kiko Alonso? Kelly, foaming at the mouth to get another former Duck, says "Hell Yes!".

 

Deal is done.

 

None of that means Rex has more power than Whaley.

 

This is the most reasonable explanation Ive seen. Good working relationship, much like he had with Tannenbaum his first couple of years in NY. I like it!

[PromoTheRobot]

It's really obvious, isn't it if you think about it for more than a New York Minute.

Philly is right across the Delaware from Camden, NJ - murder and car theft capitol of New Jersey - sure, but it's also the home of...

Campbell's Soup!

 

Think how much easier it will be for him to make commercials for them now that he can simply walk across the Walt Whitman bridge to their studio. It's a no-brainer.

 

Why would Kiko walk across a bridge when he can just pull New Jersey close enough to walk to?

[Bill from NYC]

Too many people are evaluating the trade from the perspective of which team got the better of the deal. That shouldn't be the standard to make a judgment. For the Bills' perspective the issue is did it make the team better? In my opinion it does. It balances out our roster more between the defense and offense. If the Bills bolster the OL, which I believe they will do more of, then for us it was a good deal.

 

Regardless who our starting qb is going to be the strength of the team is still going to be the defense. But that doesn't mean that adding a good running game won't enhance the play of our still limited qb and offense.

 

Chip Kelly has a different vision on how to build a roster. One of the advantages of moving McCoy is giving him more cap space to add to his roster. In his mind he can bring in another back who is cheaper, such as Ingram from the Saints, and have more money to address other needs.

 

From what I heard on the radio Rex believed that he could do without Kiko who is more of a light and quick LBer. He prefers his inside LBer to be more of a thumper. If Kiko was going to move to the oustside Rex felt that last year's LBers can be just as effective, if not more, on the outsdie.

 

When all the deals are done and the draft is concluded the key for us entering the season is bolstering the OL and getting solid qb play, whether it is from EJ or from Cassell. As it stands the Bills are a fringe wildcard playoff team. That's where we are at. Understanding the status of your team and adjusting to it is what the organization is doing, and it is the right approach to take.

Fantastic post John!

 

I for one am absolutely thrilled by this trade. I view a presumably healthy Kiko as very, very strong in coverage but frankly, a bit light in the ass vs. the run. Knowing it's a passing league these days, I supose this isn't a huge liability any more.

That said, McCoy over Spiller? Not even close. McCoy is going to score touchdowns, as well as gain steady yardage providing we can improve the line. If nobody offers Bulaga sick money he would be a nice fit imo, along with another OG from the draft.

 

Btw, guess who Greg Cossell is praising on Sirius? You guessed it, Cassell.

 

It looks as if this will be a fun season.

[BillsVet]

Who cares who's idea it was. Does it really matter? We got over on Philly big time.

 

I get that most fans don't care who makes personnel moves or the OBD organizational chart. It's not exciting, but following this is very interesting to some. Personally, I like to know the hierarchy I work under, or when I was in the Army, the chain of command and who was making decisions above me. Development and execution of strategy is part and parcel of what a team needs to do. It's not simply players showing up on game day. It's the acquisition of them as it relates to the scheme employed.

 

With the Bills, none of us are going behind that door to see how decisions are made. But when moves happen, like trading Kiko, it reveals a little of how they do things. My personal feeling is Doug Whaley is no longer GM in the classic sense, particularly with the HC not reporting to him. He's akin to what some GM's have become: the people who process transactions but have a seat at the table. They don't run the table anymore because HC's have as much or perhaps more say. And that's because the first guy who gets fired when things go south is the HC.

[dave mcbride]

 

Agreed. No way was Polian going to fire Whaley. That's not what he was coming here to do, and he proved as much by backing out when the light consulting work became a "heavy lift". Anyone saying as much is really reaching and ignoring Polian's actual statements and actions.

 

 

 

 

If Marrone had stayed on and Polian had come in, there was no way Whaley would have survived. No way. Whaley and Marrone did not get along, and Polian said in late 2014 that Marrone should be considered for coach of the year. Plus there's the whole Chris Polian issue.

 

I should stress that I'm GLAD Whaley is still here, and I think we dodged a bullet. I think he's done a decent job so far, although until we get to 10 wins and feature a credible offense, I'm in wait-and-see mode.

 

To reiterate, what I'm basically saying is that Whaley wouldn't have survived the arrival of Polian, who clearly sees the success of his son as a legacy objective. In my humble opinion, any other interpretation is just unfounded kumbaya talk.

 

I get that most fans don't care who makes personnel moves or the OBD organizational chart. It's not exciting, but following this is very interesting to some. Personally, I like to know the hierarchy I work under, or when I was in the Army, the chain of command and who was making decisions above me. Development and execution of strategy is part and parcel of what a team needs to do. It's not simply players showing up on game day. It's the acquisition of them as it relates to the scheme employed.

 

With the Bills, none of us are going behind that door to see how decisions are made. But when moves happen, like trading Kiko, it reveals a little of how they do things. My personal feeling is Doug Whaley is no longer GM in the classic sense, particularly with the HC not reporting to him. He's akin to what some GM's have become: the people who process transactions but have a seat at the table. They don't run the table anymore because HC's have as much or perhaps more say. And that's because the first guy who gets fired when things go south is the HC.

Excellent post. Makes sense to me.