Southern Bills Fan Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 Looking at his career stats....Wow. McCown has been in the league since 2002. His very good 2013 season seems to be an outlier. After that his BEST season was in 2005 with Arizona. 163-270, 60.4 pct., 1838 yards, 9 td's 11 int. 74.9 rating. That's his BEST season other than 2013.
Maddog69 Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 EJ Manuel has to be very happy with the idea of signing McCown to compete with him for the starting job. Definitely puts EJ in the drivers seat to be the starter.
Kirby Jackson Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 The Bills are not in a position to be a SB team this year under any circumstances. They don't have the caliber of qb that would allow them to compete at that high level. At this point they don't have the caliber of o-line either that would allow this team to be taken seriously as a SB contender. If you are not in a good situation to get your franchis qb that doesn't mean that you not should try to make the best out of the challenging situation. I maintain my contention that he was the worst starting qb in the league. Don't bother using statistics on me to prove otherwise. I trust my eyes more than his stats that were boosted by the end of the game prevent defenses. Foles or Bradford playing at their highest level (Flaccoish) could have the Bills at a Super Bowl level (especially in the AFC). I'll chalk the 2nd paragraph up to hyperbole. Not saying that he was good late in the year but we all watch the Bills with a much closer and much more critical eye. Compare the late season performance of Orton and Hoyer (as an example) and it isn't even close.
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 TBD truism: "A team wins because of it's QB, unless it's someone we don't like." Yeah, we won the GB game because of Orton.
BaaadThingsMan Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 The Bills are not in a position to be a SB team this year under any circumstances.Why, because you said so? There's still a whole off season, the draft and a new coaching staff/philosophy that needs to play out before the season even starts. There's lots of instances of worst to first and the Bills are not the worst team in the league, not even close. Maybe we should let it play out a while before making such assumptions?
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 Yeah and Orton was viewed as a better option than EJ. EJ is going to have to improve in order to unseat Orton/McCown/jabroni veteran backup. You mean the coach that "lead" us to a 9-7 record and is now coaching the offensive line in Jacksonville?
JohnC Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 Foles or Bradford playing at their highest level (Flaccoish) could have the Bills at a Super Bowl level (especially in the AFC). I'll chalk the 2nd paragraph up to hyperbole. Not saying that he was good late in the year but we all watch the Bills with a much closer and much more critical eye. Compare the late season performance of Orton and Hoyer (as an example) and it isn't even close. When you compare wretched with wretched you still get wretched. When it comes to assessing Orton my eyes are much more jaundiced than yours.
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 Foles or Bradford playing at their highest level (Flaccoish) could have the Bills at a Super Bowl level (especially in the AFC). I'll chalk the 2nd paragraph up to hyperbole. Not saying that he was good late in the year but we all watch the Bills with a much closer and much more critical eye. Compare the late season performance of Orton and Hoyer (as an example) and it isn't even close. I like you Kirby but man do you overrate Bradford. He hasn't even been part of a team with a winning record in the pros much less the playoffs. The Bills are not in a position to be a SB team this year under any circumstances. They don't have the caliber of qb that would allow them to compete at that high level. At this point they don't have the caliber of o-line either that would allow this team to be taken seriously as a SB contender. If you are not in a good situation to get your franchis qb that doesn't mean that you not should try to make the best out of the challenging situation. There are no upper tier qbs available on the market and there are no qb draft prospects available to us that would alter the qb deficit. So you make do with a temporary solution and wait for a better environment to acquire your long-term qb. Maybe if Foles was availble a deal could be made. But as of yet the market is bare. McCown is a very average qb at best. Orton was a mediocre qb who was fading fast. I maintain my contention that he was the worst starting qb in the league. Don't bother using statistics on me to prove otherwise. I trust my eyes more than his stats that were boosted by the end of the game prevent defenses. His performances after his first fews games were dreadful. The smartest thing he did and the right thing he did was retire immediately after the season. If our front office was sincere in wanting him back they should be fired! I pretty much agree with all of this. Our best bet is if EJ or another young guy transforms this year. Guys like Hoyer, McCown, & Orton are just so whatever.
metzelaars_lives Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 You mean the coach that "lead" us to a 9-7 record and is now coaching the offensive line in Jacksonville? Yes, that guy along with virtually every Bills fan in existence, viewed Orton as a better option after the Houston game. Did you not? And I will admit that Orton sucked and by the end of the season he wasn't any better than Manuel himself. But in fairness, Orton regressed quite a bit and ran out of gas/his heart wasn't really in it. If the Orton from the Cowboys/Eagles game or even the second half of the home New England game played all year, he would have been an incredible upgrade over EJ.
What a Tuel Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 (edited) Why, because you said so? There's still a whole off season, the draft and a new coaching staff/philosophy that needs to play out before the season even starts. There's lots of instances of worst to first and the Bills are not the worst team in the league, not even close. Maybe we should let it play out a while before making such assumptions? People aren't really going out on a limb when they claim a team won't go to the super bowl, so I take it with a grain of salt. They are playing with straight up 32/1 odds after all. Odds are they will be right, and can say they told us so. We all know that isn't how it works though. I'd rather go through, you know, actually rooting for my team before making such proclamations. To each their own. Edit: Why isn't this a done deal? I surely hope he isn't holding out for more money or something. Edited February 26, 2015 by What a Tuel
Kirby Jackson Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 When you compare wretched with wretched you still get wretched. When it comes to assessing Orton my eyes are much more jaundiced than yours. He wasn't good but 1 TD and 8 picks with 3 losses (think it was 3) Hoyer was worse.
metzelaars_lives Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 I like you Kirby but man do you overrate Bradford. He hasn't even been part of a team with a winning record in the pros much less the playoffs. I pretty much agree with all of this. Our best bet is if EJ or another young guy transforms this year. Guys like Hoyer, McCown, & Orton are just so whatever. But what if he doesn't? Then was it our best bet? There is no simple answer to any of this, guys. Our best bet is a) they draft Bryce Petty and he looks incredible from the get-go or b) they make a play for a legitimate starter, namely Bradford or Foles.
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 (edited) Yes, that guy along with virtually every Bills fan in existence, viewed Orton as a better option after the Houston game. Did you not? And I will admit that Orton sucked and by the end of the season he wasn't any better than Manuel himself. But in fairness, Orton regressed quite a bit and ran out of gas/his heart wasn't really in it. If the Orton from the Cowboys/Eagles game or even the second half of the home New England game played all year, he would have been an incredible upgrade over EJ. Uh, that's why he's Kyle Orton. He can't string together great starts. Marrone sucked. Congrats though. Orton in year 10 had the same qbr as Manuel did as a rookie! Upgrade! But what if he doesn't? Then was it our best bet? There is no simple answer to any of this, guys. Our best bet is a) they draft Bryce Petty and he looks incredible from the get-go or b) they make a play for a legitimate starter, namely Bradford or Foles. It's always a risk but you didn't get better by playing scrub veteran Qbs. What if miami listen to irrational media and fans and benched Tannehill after the Bills game (funny we won the EJ start against them)? I'd rather fail with a young guy than fail with a proven veteran failure. Edited February 26, 2015 by C.Biscuit97
Kirby Jackson Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 I like you Kirby but man do you overrate Bradford. He hasn't even been part of a team with a winning record in the pros much less the playoffs.His teams were terrible. I don't think that Bradford is great. If healthy I think that he could (and would) play at the level of a Tannehill, Foles or Flacco type. I could easily see something like 4,000 yards, 65% completion, 28 TDs and 12 INTs. I don't believe that he will ever stay healthy but I think that Bradford healthy is more likely than McCown or EJ as a franchise guy. I'm not really a fan of the QBs in this draft either. They all have holes IMO. If the QB situation is EJ, McCown and Hundley (as an example) I think that we are in trouble.
metzelaars_lives Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 You mean the coach that "lead" us to a 9-7 record and is now coaching the offensive line in Jacksonville? And furthermore, this is such a flawed way of thinking: so because Marrone is now the offensive line/assistant head coach in Jacksonville, then every decision he ever made in his life was stupid? a) Doug Marrone being a poor head coach (which I agree he was) and b) him rightly benching Manuel after the San Diego/Houston debacles are not mutually exclusive. Hitler may have had great taste in wine. So if Hitler picked out a fantastic Sangiovese would you be like, "oh right, you mean the dictator who thought world domination was a realistic goal?" Well, yeah Hitler was ultimately not an effective dictator but that doesn't mean he can't pick a good bottle of wine.
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 And furthermore, this is such a flawed way of thinking: so because Marrone is now the offensive line/assistant head coach in Jacksonville, then every decision he ever made in his life was stupid? a) Doug Marrone being a poor head coach (which I agree he was) and b) him rightly benching Manuel after the San Diego/Houston debacles are not mutually exclusive. Hitler may have had great taste in wine. So if Hitler picked out a fantastic Sangiovese would you be like, "oh right, you mean the dictator who thought world domination was a realistic goal?" Well, yeah Hitler was ultimately not an effective dictator but that doesn't mean he can't pick a good bottle of wine. Marrone got to 9-7 because of his defense. He had great defensive talent and got good DCs. Too bad his specialty was offense.
metzelaars_lives Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 Uh, that's why he's Kyle Orton. He can't string together great starts. Marrone sucked. Congrats though. Orton in year 10 had the same qbr as Manuel did as a rookie! Upgrade! It's always a risk but you didn't get better by playing scrub veteran Qbs. What if miami listen to irrational media and fans and benched Tannehill after the Bills game (funny we won the EJ start against them)? I'd rather fail with a young guy than fail with a proven veteran failure. I understand you and bills fan 4 life's point of view, I'm not an idiot. The unknown of EJ is more enticing than the mediocrity you're inevitably going to get from McCown. But what if Manuel looks like he did last year again this year and meanwhile, every receiver on the team has been seeing better balls in practice from McCown. The team is going to want McCown in there- especially the receivers- because they want to WIN. Winning is their goal, not satisfying your guys' curiosity about EJ. It's EXACTLY what happened last year and exactly what happened in 2009/2010 with Edwards/Fitzpatrick. Remember TO telling everyone that Fitzpatrick was a better option than Edwards? Well, he was. And no of course Fitzpatrick isn't/wasn't the answer either but he gave them a better chance to win on Sunday and so too might McCown. We'll have to wait and see how it all plays out. Marrone got to 9-7 because of his defense. He had great defensive talent and got good DCs. Too bad his specialty was offense. What in the world does that have anything to do with what I said. Who would argue with what you just wrote? Of course that's true.
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 I understand you and bills fan 4 life's point of view, I'm not an idiot. The unknown of EJ is more enticing than the mediocrity you're inevitably going to get from McCown. But what if Manuel looks like he did last year again this year and meanwhile, every receiver on the team has been seeing better balls in practice from McCown. The team is going to want McCown in there- especially the receivers- because they want to WIN. Winning is their goal, not satisfying your guys' curiosity about EJ. It's EXACTLY what happened last year and exactly what happened in 2009/2010 with Edwards/Fitzpatrick. Remember TO telling everyone that Fitzpatrick was a better option than Edwards? Well, he was. And no of course Fitzpatrick isn't/wasn't the answer either but he gave them a better chance to win on Sunday and so too might McCown. We'll have to wait and see how it all plays out. What in the world does that have anything to do with what I said. Who would argue with what you just wrote? Of course that's true. EJ was 2-2. Orton was basically 6-6. What did we accomplish by playing him? Again, his qbr was the same as Manuel's rookie year. I question all of Marrone's decisions. Naming Hackett as a OC and qb coach. Mike Williams. Urbik. Moving Pears to G. Maybe manuel struggled because Marrone is a giant idiot. Again, if Manuel played more games and was just as bad, I'd be ready to move on. But Qbs, especially young ones, have bad games. They need to play through it. Again if Roman works with EJ and decides he's not the answer, I'm ready to move on. But sorry I don't put much faith in current Jags assistant coaches.
Mike in Horseheads Posted February 26, 2015 Author Posted February 26, 2015 When I started this topic I said I didn't want McCown but at this point I'd say sign him, go after Ponder, Locker or Mallette in free agency. Then send Tuel away, get rid of the "kick off specialist" who wasn't so special and carry three QB's on the active roster. Any way you look at it everyone agrees we need to get someone besides Tuel on the roster. See we can all agree on something!
Leroi Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 (edited) We are desperate to find an alternative to EJ. We feel McCown is an upgrade to Orton. Roman and him are good friends. Look for this to be completed tomorrow AM, also look for EJ to be cut two days after FA opens. Imo Edited February 26, 2015 by Leroi
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