BRH Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 Are Hoodie and Kraft clearly to blame? I don't see how anyone could blame them before looking at the guy who touches the football on every play first. The center?
TheBillsWillRiseAgain Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 Essentially statistical proof that the Pats are cheaters: http://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/blog/?p=2932 WOW. Smoking gun much?
HalftimeAdjustment Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 The center? Yes, they definitely should check with the center. Maybe deflated balls are easier to snap. Let's start a thread.
BRH Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 It's shocking that Brady said today he hasn't been contacted by the NFL yet. It's Friday and the game in question was played on Sunday. My jaw literally dropped when he mentioned that in the press conference. The narrative of Goodell providing cover for his buddy Kraft is unavoidable. Does Goodell think that this is going away? Is he that stupid? This week is going to be absolutely crazy and everyone can thank Goodell for it. Brady said he hadn't talked to the NFL yet. When asked later if he had been contacted by the league, he kind of waffled and said he'd have to check with his agent or something, I think. If he truly had nothing to hide, wouldn't he demand to speak to the league at the first opportunity? This whole thing is redolent of attorneys who try their case in front of the media instead of in the courtroom, in order to sway public opinion and influence potential jurors.
Dibs Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 Essentially statistical proof that the Pats are cheaters: http://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/blog/?p=2932 Wow! Good find.....I hope the NFL reads this.
NoSaint Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 (edited) Essentially statistical proof that the Pats are cheaters: http://www.sharpfootballanalysis.com/blog/?p=2932 I wouldn't go that far. If going with proof of a conspiracy lasting nearly a decade- that article was a bit scattered, you could say. It does raise interesting stats, but.... Did manning do the same in Indy?howd Houston get so high? Did the fumble rate have similar changes across the offense individually? Did individuals coming to or leaving have huge changes?(at a quick glance welker has fumbled only 1 time as a bronco - does NE target a skillset like strong grip and train it better than others and maybe that's part of the "patriot way"? Are we arguing that since 2007 they have had most balls most weeks under inflated and that accounts for the large variation? Or just occasional instances had even bigger impact? Edited January 23, 2015 by NoSaint
Pneumonic Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 Except that the pressure is checked 2 hrs, 15 mins before kickoff and turn given to the respective teams. Two points: 1. There are no cameras rolling (or even people in the stadium) then; 2. That's plenty of time to take them wherever and do whatever to them. To say otherwise doesn't stand up to scrutiny. As noted above, you keep embarrassing yourself here. How much are the League/Pats* paying you to troll here? But those are the facts as being attributed to League-related sources. Let's get one thing straight here--your position if/when all of that comes out as true? So far, you just keep saying "it's not true, there's no proof". What if the League turns around and says it's all true as per their investigation? Are you ok with this blatant cheating? If so, why? But they aren't facts; they are rumours. But, I'll play along. "If" the Pats are shown to have doctored the balls to non spec after submission to the officials then I probably would view such cheating the same as I did Carolina when they cheated by heating football's on the field.
BRH Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 But they aren't facts; they are rumours. But, I'll play along. "If" the Pats are shown to have doctored the balls to non spec after submission to the officials then I probably would view such cheating the same as I did Carolina when they cheated by heating football's on the field. And a past history of cheating (and being caught and punished for it) wouldn't come into play at all? The same penalty for both teams?
Ozymandius Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 I wouldn't go that far. Why did the Pats / NFL just take down the site then?
Pneumonic Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 Brady said he hadn't talked to the NFL yet. When asked later if he had been contacted by the league, he kind of waffled and said he'd have to check with his agent or something, I think. If he truly had nothing to hide, wouldn't he demand to speak to the league at the first opportunity? This whole thing is redolent of attorneys who try their case in front of the media instead of in the courtroom, in order to sway public opinion and influence potential jurors. I'm sure if the league accused him of any wrongdoing, and he was steadfast that it wasn't the case, he'd be on the phone with Goodell in a millisecond.
NoSaint Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 And a past history of cheating (and being caught and punished for it) wouldn't come into play at all? The same penalty for both teams? How far does that carry? Same owner? Same coach? Same qb? Is anyone else from that team left? Coaching staff must've seen a lot of turnover too, as well as the front office. For organizational punishment when is it no longer a repeat offender? Do we have a fully clean slate because marrone left? Or with new ownership? Just another one of those curiousities that popped in my head with the transient nature of today's nfl.
BRH Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 I wouldn't go that far. If going with proof of a conspiracy lasting nearly a decade- that article was a bit scattered, you could say. It does raise interesting stats, but.... Did manning do the same in Indy?howd Houston get so high? Did the fumble rate have similar changes across the offense individually? Did individuals coming to or leaving have huge changes?(at a quick glance welker has fumbled only 1 time as a bronco - does NE target a skillset like strong grip and train it better than others and maybe that's part of the "patriot way"? Are we arguing that since 2007 they have had most balls most weeks under inflated and that accounts for the large variation? Or just occasional instances had even bigger impact? You asked how Houston got so high. What coaching tree does Bill O'Brien belong to? I ain't sayin'; I'm just sayin'.
NoSaint Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 (edited) You asked how Houston got so high. What coaching tree does Bill O'Brien belong to? I ain't sayin'; I'm just sayin'. And kubiak? Those were 5 year ranges weren't they?But raises questions like why not a spike where mcdaniels went, or other coaches that would be possibly in? Edited January 23, 2015 by NoSaint
Pneumonic Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 And a past history of cheating (and being caught and punished for it) wouldn't come into play at all? The same penalty for both teams? I was presuming that Brady was the hypothetical culprit and not the team.
NoSaint Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 Why did the Pats / NFL just take down the site then? The pats got them, eh?
Dibs Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 You asked how Houston got so high. What coaching tree does Bill O'Brien belong to? I ain't sayin'; I'm just sayin'. Also Huston is a roofed stadium. From memory(because the link seems to have crashed), the domed teams typically fumbled less than the non-domed teams. The Patriots fumbled 60% less than the rest of the league....so that figure would be a lot higher compared to just the non-domed teams.
MattM Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 But they aren't facts; they are rumours. But, I'll play along. "If" the Pats are shown to have doctored the balls to non spec after submission to the officials then I probably would view such cheating the same as I did Carolina when they cheated by heating football's on the field. Even though one incident (Carolina's) was much more likely innocent in nature (ie, never having faced such a situation (normally being a Southen team)) vs the Pats*' case where they clearly knew there was a rule and broke it (as evidenced by the fact that they did the deed AFTER the ball check) and involved a team already found guilty of cheating, who may well have been doing this for ages (witness the statistical evidence above, plus the fact they were suspected to be doing this during the year as per some sources)? If so, I'm sure you're in a clear minority.
FireChan Posted January 23, 2015 Author Posted January 23, 2015 How far does that carry? Same owner? Same coach? Same qb? Is anyone else from that team left? Coaching staff must've seen a lot of turnover too, as well as the front office. For organizational punishment when is it no longer a repeat offender? Do we have a fully clean slate because marrone left? Or with new ownership? Just another one of those curiousities that popped in my head with the transient nature of today's nfl. Probably the person who was found at fault. Or, if it was found to be the GM and HC, both of them. BB was personally fined $500,000. I'd say he has the rep of cheating, not Kraft.
MattM Posted January 23, 2015 Posted January 23, 2015 How far does that carry? Same owner? Same coach? Same qb? Is anyone else from that team left? Coaching staff must've seen a lot of turnover too, as well as the front office. For organizational punishment when is it no longer a repeat offender? Do we have a fully clean slate because marrone left? Or with new ownership? Just another one of those curiousities that popped in my head with the transient nature of today's nfl. Top man is still the top man, no? Probably the person who was found at fault. Or, if it was found to be the GM and HC, both of them. BB was personally fined $500,000. I'd say he has the rep of cheating, not Kraft. No, Kraft just has the rep of paying Belicheat's fine by reworking/extending BB's deal within weeks of the Spygate fine.
FireChan Posted January 23, 2015 Author Posted January 23, 2015 Top man is still the top man, no? No, Kraft just has the rep of paying Belicheat's fine by reworking/extending BB's deal within weeks of the Spygate fine. That's condoning cheating, not cheating in itself. Or at least, giving one of the best HC's in NFL history a one-time pass.
Recommended Posts