Lurker Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Yes this what power struggles are usually all about! Agreed. IMO, he wanted to marginalize Whaley and that wasn't working, apparently.
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Let's see first how this plays out for Marrone before saying he was smart. He got $4mil, but lets see first if he does get a new gig? It's also possible he takes the seaosn off and goes back to college. In hindsight he appears somewhat similar personality wise to Harbaurgh and for the same reasons may be better suited ot tell 19 and 20 YO's what to do. Marone was a douche but made a very smart business decision for himself. Sure, he sold out all his integrity and everything he says about family and teamwork from this day forth will be laughed at, but he has 4 million reasons (plus whatever else he gets) not to care too much. I hope he goes to the Jets and gets destroyed by the NY media.RTB
jimmy10 Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Wow, sage advice. Who did Marrone want? Franchise QB? Well that should be easy. Just call Greenbay and tell them to send us Rogers. Better offensive line? Picked up one guy in free agency and drafted three. This was about evicerating Whaley and protecting Hackett nothing more. I kind of agree with this. The problem with the chef/groceries metaphor is that any decent professional chef can make a good meal out of the most basic of ingredients.
PromoTheRobot Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Whaley has had TWO years to fix the line. And that is not counting a year with nix at the helm and everyone knowing full well Levitre would walk. Whaley has failed big time there, and it affected his prize rookie QB and Orton. And the running game. And the passing game. Chris Williams 5 mil guaranteed. really? The guy was unemployed sitting on a couch when Whaley called him. A bust cut mid seaon once. Did he or his scouts even do any homework? And his predecessor was worse. legursky looked like a stud compared to those guards. Whaley is not without blame for the offensive woes. In fact IMO the biggest reason for them. Again who are his scouts on the offensive side of the ball? They suck. Please don't cite Levitre leaving and then ignore his flaming collapse in Tennessee. He would not have helped us if he had those two seasons.
Nanker Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 The more distance between this and that now the more I wake up to realize it is probably for the best that Polian is not back. Yes. I'm fine with Whaley at the helm. I do want to see Russ go or get locked up in a closet somewhere between the Niagara Frontier and Tom Brady's bedroom. Polian's big vision for coming back to The Bills was to have Maroon as his HC, Orten as his starting QB, and A.J. Smith being General Manager. Color me unimpressed, unenthusiastic, and not buying what he was selling. On top of that Maroon and Polian have laid stink down on our new owner and the organization that the media is just delighted to run with like they did with Buddy's illegally taped phone conversations. It's enough to piss off a grown Bills fan. If I were the Pegulas I'd kick out some of the old guard (Overdorf at least), and find out who was back-biting Polian (probably Overdorf at least), and kick them the hell out of the organization forthwith. Time to let Whaley show what he's been trained to do - but get rid of the Debbie Downers at OBD quickly, or it'll be another short train to **** sville.
Lurker Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Where it got interesting was one of the GR guys brought up that when he changed his mind (after Marrone left) Polian backed off from the job because he didn't want the "heavy lifting" (presumably of a coaching search). They pointed out that it just seems odd that a coaching search would be too much heavy lifting, but running the entire football ops wouldn't be. My God, an intellegent question from a 'GR staffer...I'd better buy a lottery ticket today, the planets are lining up. My take is the Kazoo is way outside the loop on this one and just regurtitating Interweb chatter (Mort'is probably the guy to talk to here...I can't believe I typed that, but a blind squirrel, yada yada...)
boyst Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 I'm fine with Whaley at the helm. that is pretty much all it is for me. yeah it'd be great to 'get the band back together.' you don't get anything by not taking chances and by all accounts whaley has earned that chance.
KOKBILLS Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 (edited) Translated - what Polian says is that Whaley didn't listen to Marrone and he did the best he could with the cast of misfits Whaley gave him and what happened wasn't Marrone's fault. In most places I think it works the other way. The GM calls the shots and the HC works with the players provided. This isn't college where coaches do the recuiting, its the pro's. This is a lame excuse by Marrone delivered by Polian. Funny we didn't see any impact on the performance of the defense or special teams, just the offense. His area of expertise. A good coach works with what he has and adapts to the constaints and conditions including the players around him and its a head scratcher why people think Marrone is some kind of amazing coach when his lifetime record Syracuse/Buffalo is below .500. Agreed... There's not many All Star Offenses in the league and finding a Franchise QB is not exactly an easy thing to do...The Bills as an Organization expected Marrone and Hackett to be able to develop a young QB with a ton of raw talent...And when they couldn't (in assuming) Marrone decides it's Whaley's fault for not bringing in a Franchise guy? Like they grow on trees? Now...I'm not completely taking Whaley off the hook because we all knew going into the 2014 season with 3 kids at QB was going to be a huge risk...But the Bills were not going to be able to get much better than Orton anyway...They got Orton...And he started out decent enough...Then he regressed over the season under the awesome tutelage of St Doug and the boy wonder...I'm fairly certain Marrone asked for help along the O-line...And I'm also fairly certain he had input on the players they brought in...Now...Maybe the guys brought in were not Marrone's first choices...But no one can convince me he had zero input...No way...They signed a mid-level UFA OG, Drafted OT's in the 2nd and 7th rounds along with another prospect OG in the mid rounds...Marrone could do absolutely nothing with three of those four additions...And three of the four were rookies...They have to be developed...That's coaching...And despite what some Bills fans want to think there were plenty of Football minds who felt Kujo and Richardson had more than enough raw talent to be successful in time...Whaley also put his job on the line by going out and getting Marrone the best College WR prospect to come out since Julio Jones...Not to mention the additions of Boobie, Preston Brown, Corey Graham, etc...Whaley's not perfect...No GM is...But he's not bad either... But it's all Whaley's fault because he did not give Marrone what he asked for?...Well...What the hell did he want? We all want Andrew Luck and a couple Pro-Bowl caliber OG's...Who doesn't? But it does not work that way in the NFL...And coaching makes a HUGE difference...St Doug and the boy wonder saw their side of the ball regress...Regress...And under the circumstances Marrone got a hell of a lot more talent than any of his predecessors at OBD... Marrone is a joke...Please let him go to the Jets...Please, please, please... Edited January 3, 2015 by KOKBILLS
White Linen Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Yes. I'm fine with Whaley at the helm. I do want to see Russ go or get locked up in a closet somewhere between the Niagara Frontier and Tom Brady's bedroom. Polian's big vision for coming back to The Bills was to have Maroon as his HC, Orten as his starting QB, and A.J. Smith being General Manager. Color me unimpressed, unenthusiastic, and not buying what he was selling. On top of that Maroon and Polian have laid stink down on our new owner and the organization that the media is just delighted to run with like they did with Buddy's illegally taped phone conversations. It's enough to piss off a grown Bills fan. If I were the Pegulas I'd kick out some of the old guard (Overdorf at least), and find out who was back-biting Polian (probably Overdorf at least), and kick them the hell out of the organization forthwith. Time to let Whaley show what he's been trained to do - but get rid of the Debbie Downers at OBD quickly, or it'll be another short train to **** sville. Well said.
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Yes. I'm fine with Whaley at the helm. I do want to see Russ go or get locked up in a closet somewhere between the Niagara Frontier and Tom Brady's bedroom. Polian's big vision for coming back to The Bills was to have Maroon as his HC, Orten as his starting QB, and A.J. Smith being General Manager. Color me unimpressed, unenthusiastic, and not buying what he was selling. On top of that Maroon and Polian have laid stink down on our new owner and the organization that the media is just delighted to run with like they did with Buddy's illegally taped phone conversations. It's enough to piss off a grown Bills fan. If I were the Pegulas I'd kick out some of the old guard (Overdorf at least), and find out who was back-biting Polian (probably Overdorf at least), and kick them the hell out of the organization forthwith. Time to let Whaley show what he's been trained to do - but get rid of the Debbie Downers at OBD quickly, or it'll be another short train to **** sville. I agree with most of this. May have brought Smith back to be director of pro personnel instead of GM.
Kelly the Dog Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 This is all conjecture of course but it sounds to me like there could be a series of factors that led to Polian saying what he did. 1) Marrone covering his ass and badmouthing the Bills, Whaley, Overdorf, etc. so it looked like it was their fault not his. 2) Graham's article about the Power Jockeys had some validity and it pissed Polian off, so he took shots at the Bills front office too. 3) There really always was a problem with the Bills with Overdorf handling all negotiations, so Marrone could have been saying I wanted so and so and they wouldn't get me him because the guys deciding how much to pay these players. 4) Marrone and Whaley had different ideas of how to build a team and Marrone wanting to buy the groceries too. Whaley says I'm the GM and I am building this team for the long run, and you as the coach play the players you have. Marrone says screw that I'm doing things my way, then again puts it on the front office when he failed. The WR are a perfect example. He doesn't like Williams. He has no use for speed guys in his play not to lose offense so he rarely plays Goodwin. But he does play Hogan and Lee Smith.
Lurker Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Pegulas first mistake was not to have a football guy ready to go on day 1 of the offseason to restructure the organization top to bottom. RTB Which was the plan with Polian, IMO. Marrone threw a turd in the punch bowl, unfortunately, and Bill (who's likely dying for that HOF enshrinement) turned around and ran away as fast as possible from the negative fallout, let he get splattered with the same blowback...
K-9 Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Yes. I'm fine with Whaley at the helm. I do want to see Russ go or get locked up in a closet somewhere between the Niagara Frontier and Tom Brady's bedroom. Polian's big vision for coming back to The Bills was to have Maroon as his HC, Orten as his starting QB, and A.J. Smith being General Manager. Color me unimpressed, unenthusiastic, and not buying what he was selling. On top of that Maroon and Polian have laid stink down on our new owner and the organization that the media is just delighted to run with like they did with Buddy's illegally taped phone conversations. It's enough to piss off a grown Bills fan. If I were the Pegulas I'd kick out some of the old guard (Overdorf at least), and find out who was back-biting Polian (probably Overdorf at least), and kick them the hell out of the organization forthwith. Time to let Whaley show what he's been trained to do - but get rid of the Debbie Downers at OBD quickly, or it'll be another short train to **** sville. Overdorf not participating in the coaching search is interesting. I think his days are numbered. GO BILLS!!!
Heitz Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 My God, an intellegent question from a 'GR staffer...I'd better buy a lottery ticket today, the planets are lining up. My take is the Kazoo is way outside the loop on this one and just regurtitating Interweb chatter (Mort'is probably the guy to talk to here...I can't believe I typed that, but a blind squirrel, yada yada...) I felt the same way - of course the other three hours was a circular conversion on how we're already botching the process because we're moving too fast, too slow, interviewing "the same guys that the other teams with opening are", that we're not flying the Pegulacopter to see the hot college coaches. Oy. I forgot to mention, TWICE in the interview Clayton said that Whaley came from Seattle's organization so he's familiar with both of those asst. coaches. Um, ok?
Manther Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Translated - what Polian says is that Whaley didn't listen to Marrone and he did the best he could with the cast of misfits Whaley gave him and what happened wasn't Marrone's fault. In most places I think it works the other way. The GM calls the shots and the HC works with the players provided. This isn't college where coaches do the recuiting, its the pro's. This is a lame excuse by Marrone delivered by Polian. Funny we didn't see any impact on the performance of the defense or special teams, just the offense. His area of expertise. A good coach works with what he has and adapts to the constaints and conditions including the players around him and its a head scratcher why people think Marrone is some kind of amazing coach when his lifetime record Syracuse/Buffalo is below .500. Totally agree!
RunTheBall Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Which was the plan with Polian, IMO. Marrone threw a turd in the punch bowl, unfortunately, and Bill (who's likely dying for that HOF enshrinement) turned around and ran away as fast as possible from the negative fallout, let he get splattered with the same blowback... I think Pegula was leaning that way but it wasn't locked up before the end of the season. If it was more than early talks, Pegula would have told Marone that Polian was going to be the guy and Marone might have stayed (not saying either of those moves would have been good ones). Presumably with the good relations between St. Doug and Polian, the outcome would have been different. I really didn't want Polians son anywhere near th organization so I'm not sorry Polian bailed out. I'm not sorry Marone bailed either but I definitely didn't see that coming. RTB
A Dog Named Kelso Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 This is all conjecture of course but it sounds to me like there could be a series of factors that led to Polian saying what he did. 1) Marrone covering his ass and badmouthing the Bills, Whaley, Overdorf, etc. so it looked like it was their fault not his. 2) Graham's article about the Power Jockeys had some validity and it pissed Polian off, so he took shots at the Bills front office too. 3) There really always was a problem with the Bills with Overdorf handling all negotiations, so Marrone could have been saying I wanted so and so and they wouldn't get me him because the guys deciding how much to pay these players. 4) Marrone and Whaley had different ideas of how to build a team and Marrone wanting to buy the groceries too. Whaley says I'm the GM and I am building this team for the long run, and you as the coach play the players you have. Marrone says screw that I'm doing things my way, then again puts it on the front office when he failed. The WR are a perfect example. He doesn't like Williams. He has no use for speed guys in his play not to lose offense so he rarely plays Goodwin. But he does play Hogan and Lee Smith. I just don't see this. Do you really think Stevie is cut, Mike Williams gets no playing time, and we draft 3 OL men and bring one in on FA if Marrone has no say in what is going on? The whole thing reeks of revisionist history by both Marrone and Polian.
BackInDaDay Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 Polian doing the "CYA" tour on TV now? Great. I hope our owner stays as far away Polian as he can in the future. yep.. stay away from guys who won't take on risk because failure tarnishes the perception of their past accomplishments.. screw these rocking chair generals.. If Pegula hasn't already, he and Whaley should have a cordial meal at a local bistro, where they can share their short and long term goals for the team - and try to forge a shared vision on how to attain them. if Pegula and Whaley can get it all straight, then there's no need for additional opinions - especially from guys like Polian, who are comfortably numb.
KOKBILLS Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 I just don't see this. Do you really think Stevie is cut, Mike Williams gets no playing time, and we draft 3 OL men and bring one in on FA if Marrone has no say in what is going on? The whole thing reeks of revisionist history by both Marrone and Polian. Totally agree...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 3, 2015 Posted January 3, 2015 I forgot to mention, TWICE in the interview Clayton said that Whaley came from Seattle's organization so he's familiar with both of those asst. coaches. Um, ok? Whaley did work for the Seahawks for three years. As a scout on the east coast from 1996-1998. What an idiot Clayton is sometimes.
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