slyng1 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 (edited) Don't get me wrong. I stand in awe of Jerry Hughes on many plays. He gets to the QB quick, causes general havoc, forces turnovers, he's a monster. I want him on my team. Ok, now that we've gotten that out of the way. He costs this team too many plays as well. How many Personal Foul Calls has he had this year? This is a serious question...for someone with more time than me, can you look up how many it is? And how many of them occurred while the bills D had their oppoentn on 3rd down. Multiple times this year, i've seen 3rd and whatever, stopped short or incomplete, Personal Foul on Hughes...then a few plays later (after a 15yrd mark off and automatic 1st down)... TD opposing team. I swear to god, after each of his boneheaded PF calls the opposing team scores, and let me tell you these were not in unimportant games. In the Miami game, in the KC game, in the Den game -- he had PF calls in at least 2 of 3 of those. All 3 critical to our success in the AFC and all 3 lost, and unless I'm going batty, 2 of 3 with major Hughes PF calls. Did he have positive plays in those games? Absolutely he did, but his idiocy has cost us critical points at critical times. So i grant you, there are times this season he's been stellar, directly leading to points by our offense (or scoring himself), but at times his faults completely outweigh the positive things he does. So sure, give him a reasonable contract, hell give him a big contract. I want him on my team but lets not let his amazing plays blind us to the fact that this guy costs us plenty as well. The dude needs to figure out how to behave on the field. Maybe the overzealousness, the aggression is the price you have to pay for monster defenders. JJ Watt has had his share of roughing & PF penalties this season but the ones that I've seen this season on Hughes to me always seem avoidable to me. Maybe our defense is that good that they can spot teams 15yards and a 1st regularly. Maybe that's the case, but this is the NFL. You do that enough, you pay. Anyway, just my 2c. Tell me why I'm a moron. Tell me you haven't watched games this season and screamed at the TV -- "We had them, why do they get to keep playing" and then look at your TV and see that, oh yeah, Hughes just committed a PF and they get the ball again, and only this time 15yards closer to the end zone. Absolutely maddenning. Anyway - since I don't post very often i'll only add this: Viva la 14% -- lets beat oakland and become big pittsburgh, Denver, Texans, and 49ers fans. http://www.syracuse....ff_picture.html Edited December 20, 2014 by slyng1
Dragonborn10 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Valid points. But he can clean up the PF calls. He plays the run much better than anyone thought he could. He makes everyone on the line better. If they let him leave there is a gaping hole in the defense that will need to be addressed. They need the draft to address the TE, O-line positions, DB, and RN postions. Let CJ walk. Extend Dareus and Glenn now. Franchise Hughes if you have to but get him signed. Give him the same deal Avril got in Seattle and everyone is happy.
Manther Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Don't get me wrong. I stand in awe of Jerry Hughes on many plays. He gets to the QB quick, causes general havoc, forces turnovers, he's a monster. I want him on my team. Ok, now that we've gotten that out of the way. He costs this team too many plays as well. How many Personal Foul Calls has he had this year? This is a serious question...for someone with more time than me, can you look up how many it is? And how many of them occurred while the bills D had their oppoentn on 3rd down. Multiple times this year, i've seen 3rd and whatever, stopped short or incomplete, Personal Foul on Hughes...then a few plays later (after a 15yrd mark off and automatic 1st down)... TD opposing team. I swear to god, after each of his boneheaded PF calls the opposing team scores, and let me tell you these were not in unimportant games. In the Miami game, in the KC game, in the Den game -- he had PF calls in at least 2 of 3 of those. All 3 critical to our success in the AFC and all 3 lost, and unless I'm going batty, 2 of 3 with major Hughes PF calls. Did he have positive plays in those games? Absolutely he did, but his idiocy has cost us critical points at critical times. So i grant you, there are times this season he's been stellar, directly leading to points by our offense (or scoring himself), but at times his faults completely outweigh the positive things he does. So sure, give him a reasonable contract, hell give him a big contract. I want him on my team but lets not let his amazing plays blind us to the fact that this guy costs us plenty as well. The dude needs to figure out how to behave on the field. Maybe the overzealousness, the aggression is the price you have to pay for monster defenders. JJ Watt has had his share of roughing & PF penalties this season but the ones that I've seen this season on Hughes to me always seem avoidable to me. Maybe our defense is that good that they can spot teams 15yards and a 1st regularly. Maybe that's the case, but this is the NFL. You do that enough, you pay. Anyway, just my 2c. Tell me why I'm a moron. Tell me you haven't watched games this season and screamed at the TV -- "We had them, why do they get to keep playing" and then look at your TV and see that, oh yeah, Hughes just committed a PF and they get the ball again, and only this time 15yards closer to the end zone. Absolutely maddenning. Anyway - since I don't post very often i'll only add this: Viva la 14% -- lets beat oakland and become big pittsburgh, Denver, Texans, and 49ers fans. http://www.syracuse....ff_picture.html I hear you. But, he has had 3 PFs this year vs 10+ sacks. He gets to the QB AND seals the edge running. His pros way out weigh the con's and he can improve on the penalties. You can't prod cattle, but, you can tame a tiger!! If the price tag is good resign him. Even if it is above what he is worth. $10 or $11 million a year MAY be worth it?
OCinBuffalo Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Some of those PFs were ridiculous....like the "patting your own player on the helmet for making a good play" PF Hughes got. I will grant you, not all. However, I think you are right to consider that you've watched all the Bills games, and perhaps not all the Texans games, or all of anybody's games. There's a good chance you have some confidence bias happening here. Lawrence Taylor got at lot of deserved PFs. Didn't hurt them at all. Christ, the entire Raiders team used to be based in part on getting at least 3 PFs a game, but that's when they were winning a lot. They intimidated everybody(ahem, except the Bills of course), most penalized team in the league...but also, division champions. The difference was, as you stated, those players/teams made HUGE plays on defense. Just huge, game turning plays, like Hughe's stripping the RB for a TD, after drawing a holding penalty, I might add. Hughes has drawn a lot of penalties this year. In fact, if we counted up the drawn/taken, he'd probably break even. The simplel fact is that a guy, who might make a huge play, but also might get a penalty, beats the hell out of Chris Kelsay every time. I don't think Hughes is worth Mario $, and, I think Hughes better think before he jumps to another team that doesn't have the same kind of D line we have. Purely in terms of the game/fame...Hughes would be a fool to leave Buffalo and this line. He has a chance to be a legend/go on our wall. The "good, with a chance at being great" smart players, like Steve Tasker, think long term. The dumb players always think about short-term $, and never about life after football. And, if some other team wants to do a re-enactment of over-paying for Andy Levitre, and not getting their money's worth....what the F are the Bills supposed to do about it? That's the league today. We need to make a good, long term offer to Hughes, and then think no more of it. We can't control him or the other teams.
DLH 9 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Love Hughes, but this is a business.m we have a lot of home grown talent coming to contract in the next couple of years. Can we afford to lock up Hughes with our horizon full of fat contracts? With so much money tied up in the defensive line already I am doubtful Hughes will stay here, especially with Wynn, Charles and Bryant as back ups. Next year looks to be an incredible linebacking corps with Kiko back. You have to ask just how much production will we lose if Hughes walks. Jerry earned a big contract, I am just not sure we have the room for him.
truth on hold Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 (edited) love to see us pickup Greg hardy if he's reinstated and we don't re-sign Hughes. Hardy is a beast and at 6'4" 272 is the perfect size for a DE. It's possible that hardy outplays Hughes anyway Edited December 20, 2014 by JTSP
papazoid Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 love to see us pickup Greg hardy if he's reinstated and we don't re-sign Hughes. Hardy is a beast and at 6'4" 272 is the perfect size for a DE. It's possible that hardy outplays Hughes anyway hardy is way better than hughes
Buffalo_Stampede Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 I'll take JPP. I bet he gets 15 sacks in this D. Still very young also.
truth on hold Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 (edited) I'll take JPP. I bet he gets 15 sacks in this D. Still very young also. Idk he really seems like a shell of his former self since the back issues. But as a FA I bet he still commands top dollar. I'd probably pass on him. With what we're paying Mario, we need a way to find some value at the other DE position. Edited December 20, 2014 by JTSP
Jmsbills Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 If it's only about the money he walks - he will get more elsewhere. But if he wants a long term deal that pays him very well and wants to play on a great defense with great players - then we have a chance to resign him. Any idea who his agent is?
rfk Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Arron Maybin bulked up...looks like Mr Peanut... waiting for his shot..get em cheap
Joaquin1119 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 I wouldn't blame this on hughes.Our offense can't score points. Hughes should get pay, but not like how Mario is getting pay. But if hughes does ask for $$$ then let him walk. And hopefully he turns out to be a free agent bust
8-8 Forever? Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 love to see us pickup Greg hardy if he's reinstated and we don't re-sign Hughes. Hardy is a beast and at 6'4" 272 is the perfect size for a DE. It's possible that hardy outplays Hughes anyway I would imagine we are swapping FAs , lose Hughes , grab someone else, keep W, W and D together.
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 I was originally of the view that we should probably let Hughes walk. Now I think we need to do everything we can to keep this defense intact through next year. I would pay him.
DLH 9 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Can't agree with any of this. The problem is our offense, not defense. We may never have a year like we just had, regardless of whether we have the same personnel or not. There will be natural turnover here, the question is how much can we afford to pay and still have resources for the other side of the ball. Signing a high profile QB is not going to be cheap, neither will be resigning Dareus and Gilmore... If we are smart I say we lock them up with long term before going after a DE that just made a stellar, and thereby expensive, name for himself.
LB3 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 I wonder if he'd take a deal like the extension Cliff Avril just got. 4 years, $28 mil. Would that be too much against the cap?
fansince88 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Got it for you...http://www.nflpenalties.com/player/j-hughes-buffalo-bills?year=2014 All in all he has cost the team 84 yards with penalties. But.... 9.5 sacks, 3 forced fumbles, I fumble recovery for a TD, 34 tackles, 15 assists http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HughJe99.htm I forgive him. Pay him!
truth on hold Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 Got it for you...http://www.nflpenalties.com/player/j-hughes-buffalo-bills?year=2014 All in all he has cost the team 84 yards with penalties. But.... 9.5 sacks, 3 forced fumbles, I fumble recovery for a TD, 34 tackles, 15 assists http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HughJe99.htm I forgive him. Pay him! And one of those PFs was a complete joke of a call by Walt Coleman and crew
bigK14094 Posted December 20, 2014 Posted December 20, 2014 I would love to see Hughes in a Bills uniform for the next many seasons. But, the cap management thing has to be recognized as a legit factor in overall team success. If I have to pick one, I pick Dareus over Hughes. The Bills front office has a decent record at setting their number and letting folks walk if they demand more. Certainly the Byrd thing was the correct call in retrospect. And, the Levertre situation was also correct, as he is a drag on Tenn these days. And, over the years other passes were correct. Jonas Jennings never played much in SF, but got $75 mil. Same story Nate Clements. Same George Wilson. I have to grudgingly admit, Whittner has been more of a success in the other teams than I thought her would, but he is making much less than he demanded from the Bills. In those circumstances, I think some of these guys just want to get away from the Bills losing culture....I am sympathetic to that feeling...as I have some version of that also. I am willing to let Whaley and whoever replaced Littman make those calls, and hope, perhaps, that Marrone is also in the room as he appears to be able to see the real player, not the marketing hype version of the player (see EJ, Gilmore)
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