Russ Brandon: "Marrone Has Changed the Bills' Culture"

[GunnerBill]

Your record is what you are.

 

And we are better than at any point in the last 10 years. Turning around that kind of stench of failure doesn't happen overnight.

[Fadingpain]

OK i heard it...as usual, i see we have a bunch people of crying about nothing when it comes to media members.

 

First of all...it is funny to see whining about Howard Simon's "unprofessional" questions and the "the way" asks them....Howard used to be (rightfully) criticized for lobbing the biggest softballs on the planet. It's only in the last year or two that he even tried to ask an assertive question. Which is what he should do, of course. Someone must have gotten to him and explained it's ok to have an opinion (thankfully). We talk about the whether we need a new coach 365 days a year, but the morning sports talk host can't ask the team president about it? Really? Man, some people just want unicorns and rainbows and that is that. Personally, I would rather see/hear media who have an opinion.

 

All the things Howard Simon mentioned about Marrone are legitimate criticisms. And Russ's reply was to scold him for not having a gushing orgasm over an 8-6 record. Some of the things Brandon praised Marrone for are worthy of it...like the way the coaches handled the blizzard. But a lot of it was a joke. He's really giving Doug Marrone credit for being a great leader because of the burden of stadium renovation? Because training camp was a week longer? If anything, camp was a mess this year, and I would not offer up praise to the head coach for it.

 

Poeple on both sides of the "culture-change" debate have made good points...but the person whose opinion I value least in that whole conversation is suck-ass Russ Brandon. His agenda is obvious: as long as there's any conceivable reason to defend Doug Marrone, he HAS to do it.

 

AMEN. I pretty much agree with every word you wrote here.

[RussellDopeland]

This is true. Under Gailey the culture was all offense, no defense. Under Marrone, we now have all defense, and no offense. A culture change indeed!

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

And we are better than at any point in the last 10 years. Turning around that kind of stench of failure doesn't happen overnight.

The "playoffs or else" thing is starting to irritate me a little. If they are 10-6 and miss the playoffs the year is still a success IMO. If you have the same record as a playoff team in your conference you did what you needed to do. If "you are what your record says you are" than you are a 10-6 team just like a Baltimore for example. If the tiebreaker was out of conference opponents instead of common opponents the Bills would be there instead (at least I think). The goal was to put yourself in position to be a playoff team (which they haven't yet done) and then the chips fall where they may. It's like Arizona last year.

 

Now, if they lose 1 or 2 of these games they will not quite be there. They will finish a game or 2 out (not a tiebreaker out). That's not good enough but not a total failure either. They will look to KC and Houston and wonder what might have been.

 

Either was this team is absolutely heading in the right direction.

Edited December 17, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[BillsVet]

And we are better than at any point in the last 10 years. Turning around that kind of stench of failure doesn't happen overnight.

 

When your best record from 2005-2013 was winning 7 games, I'd eventually expect to exceed that level of mediocrity.

 

It's been a 15 year process to get it right at OBD. That kind of stench doesn't occur without serious issues in management.

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

Seattle's offense has really struggled. They don't have a vertical passing game. Harbaugh's as well - major regression this year. I know the Bills have talent on defense, but I don't see the "talented roster" on offense at all. Their most talented player is a rookie. They don't have a QB. The best RB was out 7 weeks. I'm not surprised the offense isn't great. The plays are there, they players don't make them because they aren't good enough. I know most don't agree, but while the OC hasn't been perfect he certainly has designed plays that would work if the execution was there. Since no one knows the whole story with Mike Williams or Urbik, I have a hard time just assuming that is a fireable offense for the HC because they weren't/aren't playing.

Been away for a few hours. This topic has gone haywire since earlier today. Thanks for providing some reason. Edited December 17, 2014 by 75Bills

[Fadingpain]

The "playoffs or else" thing is starting to irritate me a little. If they are 10-6 and miss the playoffs the year is still a success IMO. If you have the same record as a playoff team in your conference you did what you needed to do. If "you are what your record says you are" than you are a 10-6 team just like a Baltimore for example. If the tiebreaker was out of conference opponents instead of common opponents the Bills would be there instead (at least I think). The goal was to put yourself in position to be a playoff team (which they haven't yet done) and then the chips fall where they may. It's like Arizona last year.

 

Now, if they lose 1 or 2 of these games they will not quite be there. They will finish a game or 2 out (not a tiebreaker out). That's not good enough but not a total failure either. Try will look to KC and Houston and wonder what might have been.

 

Either was this team is absolutely heading in the right direction.

 

I agree that relying on objective criteria like record or making the playoffs (or not) is not the right approach.

 

The right approach is to rely on subjective criteria in trying to determine, as best as possible, whether or not Marrone is doing a good job, has the team headed in the right direction, and better things are on the horizon.

 

Does he? I don't know; I am not in the locker room. I don't want to rely too heavily on a really, really talented defensive unit and strong defensive coordinator as evidence that the head coach should be retained; I don't see an obvious connection there.

 

I do know that Marrone has proven to be a HORRIBLE in game manager and we have won games in spite of his spur of the moment judgements made in-game. We have won little because of them.

 

I also think that he could be replaced with a better coach and this team would not miss a beat next season.

 

A coaching change (to the right sort of coach whose competence is not questioned) could be easily sold to the players as "the next step" and the man who is going to take the team to that next level, meaning playoffs and success in the playoffs.

 

But a whole lot of this is moot if we don't improve the QB position. That is the single biggest problem with the team currently, not the head coach.

[PolishDave]

Either way this team is absolutely heading in the right direction.

Right now it feels like it is. We just beat a great football team and that feels good.

 

I think Marrone can win support from a majority of fans if he manages to find a way to beat New England. If he does that and loses to Oakland, I still say keep him.

 

If we beat Oakland and lose to New England as most people probably expect, then I will remain on the fence somewhat. Then my decision comes down to what, if anything, he says he is going to do to improve the offense. I would really like to hear what he thinks is most wrong with the offense as it is right now. And how he intends to fix it.

[May Day 10]

the one thing that I keep thinking back to this season that sours me on Marrone is the series in the KC game, which you can argue is going to cost them the playoffs. This sequence KILLS me.

 

1st and 10 from the 18. Down by 4. Plenty of time left. They chuck the ball into the end zone 4 straight times.

• (2:47) 18-K.Orton pass incomplete short right to 14-S.Watkins (38-R.Parker). Underthrown, receiver at goal line near pylon.
   
  
• 2-10-KC 15(2:42) (Shotgun) 18-K.Orton pass incomplete short left to 15-C.Hogan (38-R.Parker). Overthrown, receiver near sideline 7 yds. into end zone.
   
  
• 3-10-KC 15(2:37) (Shotgun) 18-K.Orton pass incomplete short middle to 15-C.Hogan. Overthrown, receiver 4 yds. into end zone, slanting from left.
   
  
• Timeout #1 by KC at 02:32.
   
  
• 4-10-KC 15(2:31) (Shotgun) 18-K.Orton pass incomplete short right to 14-S.Watkins (38-R.Parker). Receiver at goal line underthrown, nearly intercepted at KC 2.
  

So you would think a head coach who knows what he is doing would have planned ahead. Why end zone 4 straight times. He needed to make up his mind before that sequence of FG vs 4 Down Territory and commit. A 4-6 yard gain on one or more of downs 1-3 would have been great. Could have also run some clock. Or 3 incompletions, run no clock and kick the field goal, down by 1 with a battery of timeouts and a killer defense....

To me it reminded me of a guy sitting at a $10 blackjack table with $100, losing 3 straight hands, then pushing the last $70 to the table, and losing that hand to, thus cleaning him out.

 

It made no sense and demonstrated to me that there was no foresight there. A game that huge. A game that will cost the playoffs.

Edited December 17, 2014 by May Day 10

[Bill from EP]

I agree. I love Coah Marrone. I think he has done a TREMENDOUS JOB with the Bills in his two years with us. There are a few changes that need to be made though :

 

1) We need a QB plain and simple. I still think EJ has what it takes but he needs to be given a FULL chance. To pull him out with a 2-2 start this year is , in my opinion, a little stupid. I don't think that Kyle Orton has been much better than EK. Let's face it, our DEFENSE is winning us these games, NOT THE OFFENSE. Even if Kyle Orton did win and take us to the superbowl, which will never happen, what is his 3 year plan??? to stay playing QB at his age?!?!? the answer is NO! We have a young gun who is ready to take the reigns, I believe that EJ is caoable of leading this team if he is truly given a shot.

 

2) We need to start rebuilding the line. We are fine on defense and loaded with playmakers of offense. Our offensive line has to be one of the worst as we cannot convert on 3 downs. A strong linehelps you convert on those critical plays.

 

3) Our OC has to start being more aggresive. I understand his conservative nature, and maybe he is conservitive because he knows the offense without a line and QB suck. Either way he needs to be willing to do the unexpected from time to time.

 

4) Keep spiller and give him one more year. If he doens't perform this year 2015 fine let him go. He deserves one more year under COach Marrone.

 

5) Obviously Keep COACH MARRONE. He is turing this franchise around one peice at a time. I support him all the way. He is a great coach and would be an even better one with a proper QB under his beslt. Imagine our current buffalo bills with even an above average qb like Rivers, or Tannehil. Not great but better than average. Imagine with a Manning type QB, man our Bills would be the next Dynasty.

 

anyways COACH MARRONE IS TOPS IN MY BOOK BEST COACH WE HAVE HAD IN A LOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG TIME!

 

and as always GO BILLS!

[CardinalScotts]

Howard Simon's opinions and passing them off as the fans. Taking a show topic they want to talk about ie: Jerry Hughes not on the field- ya manny lawson was against the run and it worked. I think Coach Marrone was rude in Howies mind to him and he can't get over it. You dont take a coach who puts up the best season in 10 years and turns the culture in the locker room and get rid of him. He mentions Harbaugh- -- you mean the guy who the raiders beat last week? Of course Schwartz and Harbaugh hate each other on top of it etc. Howie is clueless on a lot of things and I'm fairly certain he's never been a team of any kind including bowling.

[Kelly the Dog]

The "playoffs or else" thing is starting to irritate me a little. If they are 10-6 and miss the playoffs the year is still a success IMO. If you have the same record as a playoff team in your conference you did what you needed to do. If "you are what your record says you are" than you are a 10-6 team just like a Baltimore for example. If the tiebreaker was out of conference opponents instead of common opponents the Bills would be there instead (at least I think). The goal was to put yourself in position to be a playoff team (which they haven't yet done) and then the chips fall where they may. It's like Arizona last year.

 

Now, if they lose 1 or 2 of these games they will not quite be there. They will finish a game or 2 out (not a tiebreaker out). That's not good enough but not a total failure either. They will look to KC and Houston and wonder what might have been.

 

Either was this team is absolutely heading in the right direction.

I agree with most all of that. Especially the last line. If we lose to the Raiders and Pats, then that last line loses most of its luster.

 

I never said "playoffs or else" and I don't think very many have. If we finish 9-7 and miss the playoffs I think most fans think he should stay. I do. But that doesn't mean he has done a terrific job. It could mean he has under-achieved, not over achieved. The season isn't over. This week we need to win or last week means nothing. I expect us to win. 9-7 he gets to keep his job.

[John from Riverside]

When your best record from 2005-2013 was winning 7 games, I'd eventually expect to exceed that level of mediocrity.

 

It's been a 15 year process to get it right at OBD. That kind of stench doesn't occur without serious issues in management.

 

I think you are totally missing the point....or just flat venting

[Kirby Jackson]

 

I agree with most all of that. Especially the last line. If we lose to the Raiders and Pats, then that last line loses most of its luster.

 

I never said "playoffs or else" and I don't think very many have. If we finish 9-7 and miss the playoffs I think most fans think he should stay. I do. But that doesn't mean he has done a terrific job. It could mean he has under-achieved, not over achieved. The season isn't over. This week we need to win or last week means nothing. I expect us to win. 9-7 he gets to keep his job.

I'm with you KTD. If they finish 8-8, 9-7 or 10-6 I still believe NH has to go. The offense is broken.

[34-78-83]

The "playoffs or else" thing is starting to irritate me a little. If they are 10-6 and miss the playoffs the year is still a success IMO. If you have the same record as a playoff team in your conference you did what you needed to do. If "you are what your record says you are" than you are a 10-6 team just like a Baltimore for example. If the tiebreaker was out of conference opponents instead of common opponents the Bills would be there instead (at least I think). The goal was to put yourself in position to be a playoff team (which they haven't yet done) and then the chips fall where they may. It's like Arizona last year.

 

Now, if they lose 1 or 2 of these games they will not quite be there. They will finish a game or 2 out (not a tiebreaker out). That's not good enough but not a total failure either. They will look to KC and Houston and wonder what might have been.

 

Either was this team is absolutely heading in the right direction.

Agreed and well said

[The Big Cat]

Marrone changed the culture at OBD. Period. End of story.

 

I've read enough on this board to know that the posters who want to argue the credit belongs to anyone else (an acknowledgement, btw, that the culture has changed) just don't like Marrone.

 

I'm not saying you have to like the guy. But the buck stops at him. If you're going to fault him for the team's failures, then you credit him with the team's success.

 

This is normally the part of our show where someone tries to argue that Marrone is some kind of offensive guru. So, here comes that.

[Kelly the Dog]

I'm with you KTD. If they finish 8-8, 9-7 or 10-6 I still believe NH has to go. The offense is broken.

That ain't gonna happen. Marrone is not going to get rid of Hackett, even if ordered to. It's Marrone's offense. He decides the game plan and who plays. If Whaley went to Marrone and said you need to get rid of the OC, there will be a huge showdown, like the Cowher and Donohoe fight, and IMO Whaley would win and Marrone would pull a Mularkey or Wade and quit.

 

Marrone changed the culture at OBD. Period. End of story.

 

I've read enough on this board to know that the posters who want to argue the credit belongs to anyone else (an acknowledgement, btw, that the culture has changed) just don't like Marrone.

 

I'm not saying you have to like the guy. But the buck stops at him. If you're going to fault him for the team's failures, then you credit him with the team's success.

 

This is normally the part of our show where someone tries to argue that Marrone is some kind of offensive guru. So, here comes that.

I think Marrone did change the culture here. He really gets the team motivated. But it's not one guy. Last years team gave up a few times. The game at the end of the season in Tampa was atrocious. A HUGE part of the culture change was Brandon Spikes, Corey Graham, and Boobie Dixon who all brought enormous leadership from winning programs here. They helped toughen the team, transform the locker room and made the ST dominant. That was Whaley not Marrone. Orton helped change the culture a lot, to his credit.

[PolishDave]

That ain't gonna happen. Marrone is not going to get rid of Hackett, even if ordered to. It's Marrone's offense. He decides the game plan and who plays. If Whaley went to Marrone and said you need to get rid of the OC, there will be a huge showdown, like the Cowher and Donohoe fight, and IMO Whaley would win and Marrone would pull a Mularkey or Wade and quit.

So be it. If Marrone doesn't have the guts to fix the problem, then he shouldn't be a head coach anyway. This is a business after all.

[QB Bills]

It's not about record. It's about whether the HC did everything to maximize the team's success with a comprehensive examination of every aspect of his defined duties and responsibilities. The organization also has a duty to itself and its fanbase to ask whether there are any better alternatives to who they have now.

It boggles my mind that more people don't see it like this. All you keep reading is "but we're 8-6". Correlation does not imply causation.

 

I've mentioned in the past that I'd like someone to provide one concrete example of smart coaching by him. Have you ever even once thought "wow...clever tactic there, coach"? The guy's idiotic use of timeouts at the end of halves has me screaming at the tv almost weekly.

[Kelly the Dog]

It boggles my mind that more people don't see it like this. All you keep reading is "but we're 8-6". Correlation does not imply causation.

 

I've mentioned in the past that I'd like someone to provide one concrete example of smart coaching by him. Have you ever even once thought "wow...clever tactic there, coach"? The guy's idiotic use of timeouts at the end of halves has me screaming at the tv almost weekly.

I sometimes, if not often question his use of timeouts. But his calling timeouts with about 5 minutes left in the Denver game IIRC was very, very smart. I was thrilled with him for that. Coaches should do that WAY more, especially when down two scores, and most don't. That was terrific coaching by Marrone. Overall, his timeout calling has left a lot to be desired. It's a very hard job though, and you can get better at it with experience.