Kelly the Dog Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 Right. So, following your logic, he was clamoring at the bit to take massive hits behind a deficient offensive line. The coaches have since robbed him of that opportunity by telling him to duck and cover. Never said anything of the sort. All I said was he was never going to retire and if you knew anything about it, you wouldn't say that.
The Big Cat Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 Never said anything of the sort. All I said was he was never going to retire and if you knew anything about it, you wouldn't say that. I do know something about it. He was getting criticized by the national guys all summer for the way he was conducting himself.
NoSaint Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 Might help if Orton learned how to sidestep in the pocket. Can't keep a play alive to save his life. GO BILLS!!! yup - doesnt even have to scramble, just some real basic footwork. 2-3 steps one way or the other with composure.
Direhard Fan Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 I only remember third and one. GB has 7 men in the box and we still run up the middle for a one yard loss. Change the play at the line for petes sake. I yelled over the TV but I guess Ortan didn't hear me. He leaves much to be desired.
34-78-83 Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 I only remember third and one. GB has 7 men in the box and we still run up the middle for a one yard loss. Change the play at the line for petes sake. I yelled over the TV but I guess Ortan didn't hear me. He leaves much to be desired. 7 in the box is the norm
QCity Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 Kyle Orton was never going to retire, even his old boss knew that was complete nonsense. Jerry Jones: Kyle Orton doesn't plan to retire from NFL
Concrete Buffalo Feet Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 Don't know if it was mentioned, but did anyone notice when the cameras showed our offensive huddle and Sammy was letting Orton have it as if he was pleading his case to throw him the ball? It was right after a pass play to someone else...?
Kelly the Dog Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 I do know something about it. He was getting criticized by the national guys all summer for the way he was conducting himself. BECAUSE EVERYONE KNEW HE WAS NOT CONSIDERING RETIREMENT.
The Big Cat Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 BECAUSE EVERYONE KNEW HE WAS NOT CONSIDERING RETIREMENT. So what's your point? Now that we've !@#$ing quibbled over this, do you mean to suggest that Orton was indeed all-in (in spite of weasling out of TC here AND there) wants to stay in the pocket and take shots, but the coaches are telling him not to? Because that's what we're talking about here. Per always, you've managed to skew the actual discussion so far off the original point, it's not even worth moving on.
BobDVA Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 It is simple defensive scheme, stop the run, crowd the middle eliminating the slants and short routes, dare Orton to beat them deep over the middle, sideline to a double covered Sammy, or sideline to Woods. Orton can't do it, leaving nothing he can do but dump off to the checkdown
4merper4mer Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 I only remember third and one. GB has 7 men in the box and we still run up the middle for a one yard loss. Change the play at the line for petes sake. I yelled over the TV but I guess Ortan didn't hear me. He leaves much to be desired. Who called that play? Does Orton have the authority to change the plays of the boy genius? Ask Mike Williams what happens when you question Hackett.
BADOLBILZ Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 Russell Wilson started out good and got better. Rodgers started out good and got better. Rivers started out good and got better. Foles started out good and got way better and then got worse. Kaep started out good and got much better and then got worse a year later. Brady started out good and got better. Tannehill started out pretty good and then got better. Luck started out good and got better. Dalton started out good and got better and then got worse a couple years later. besides, Orton wasn't a new guy, and he wasn't in a wildly different offense than the other teams had tape on. Guys like Brady, Wilson, Rodgers and Rivers actually had few limitations and a strong supporting cast. They were capable of adjusting to the adjustments made against them. The Bills on the other hand have had a long list of QB's in the past 15 years who simply can't adjust. Orton can't move and his accuracy is inconsistent. As for the issue of what tape is being watched leading up to the game......history suggests that teams do not look extensively at old tape during the season. That is why guys like Fitz or even Flutie could jump teams and experience temporary initial boosts in performance after being routinely neutralized at their previous spot.
Solomon Grundy Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 I think part of the problem is that Marrone and Hackett have neutered him. He is more of the gunslinger type. he will make mistakes but will throw a bunch of good passes too. That's what he did when he first came here. Since that time, and partly because the defense is so good, I think Marrone and Hackett are not letting him be himself. They say don't make mistakes so many times that he has no confidence throwing and he falls to the ground instead of making plays. They took the gunslinger mentality away from him and tries to make him a game manager and now he is scared to throw anything. He looks completely lost. He is missing 5 yard passes. Thats as much on them as it is him, IMO, What do you think happened to EJ? He even said that when he plays again he's gonna "let it rip". EJs rookie season looked helluva promising. He was making throws. His last two games were horrible, maybe due to the same neutering from coaches
34-78-83 Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 The "neutering from coaches" that you guys keep referring to is the opponent taking away their comfort zones for the most part.
IDBillzFan Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 So what's your point? He doesn't need me speaking for him, but it wasn't his point he was trying to make. It was yours. Your critique of Orton was based on the fact he was moments away from retiring. That simply wasn't the case at all, and that was all he was trying to explain. Other than that, I'm not sure how you see him as someone who skews topics away from the point. He's probably one of the most knowledgeable football noggins still posting here.
The Big Cat Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 He doesn't need me speaking for him, but it wasn't his point he was trying to make. It was yours. Your critique of Orton was based on the fact he was moments away from retiring. That simply wasn't the case at all, and that was all he was trying to explain. Other than that, I'm not sure how you see him as someone who skews topics away from the point. He's probably one of the most knowledgeable football noggins still posting here. Yeah, he was totally on point with how badly Lee Evans would be missed. Also, retire or not retire, there was serious questions about Orton's desire to play football. Period. And that was directly correlated to the original question about him standing in and taking a shot.
bigK14094 Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 couldnt agree with you more Kelly When Orton first came in, he was much better and progressively gotten worse and more scared back there. A much a I like to say the lack of offense is more on Orton not executing (it is), I still come away with that's how Hackett is limiting his mistakes. Gotta take shots downfield. Yesterday the Paclers defenses were daring is to do it and we never did. At the same time, a few times where we did throw it medium to long range, the passes were so far off it was ridiculous. The long one down the left side near the end of the game...Sammy quit on the route....thats not on Orton.....
Kelly the Dog Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 The "neutering from coaches" that you guys keep referring to is the opponent taking away their comfort zones for the most part. Orton has all day in the pocket and still misses easy throws now. He had no one on him and misfired a five yard pass to Woods. He's just awful right now. He wasn't like that at all before Buffalo or when he first got here. I'm not talking about plays when he can't find anyone open. He's gunshy and scared and flat awful. Before he was simply inconsistent. Missed a throw bad here, made a good throw bad there. But we could live with it. For three weeks he's not back to the real Orton, he's substantially worse than the real Orton. The real Orton was erratic. This Orton is Jeff Tuel bad.
bigK14094 Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 What do you think happened to EJ? He even said that when he plays again he's gonna "let it rip". EJs rookie season looked helluva promising. He was making throws. His last two games were horrible, maybe due to the same neutering from coaches No, EJ started sliding and not running.....he needed to getsome first downs with his legs....and he wasn't, either from coaching or fear of getting hurt again. EJ is a step down from Orton right now, and until he proves otherwise in a preseason game, he is bench material. The fact is Orton has a better arm and accuracy....EJ has a strong arm, but his inaccuracy is disqualifying in my view. EJ will never support a verticle game......I am, actually, done with EJ........would prefer they dump him asap, and draft another qb.
Jauronimo Posted December 15, 2014 Posted December 15, 2014 Yeah, he was totally on point with how badly Lee Evans would be missed. Also, retire or not retire, there was serious questions about Orton's desire to play football. Period. And that was directly correlated to the original question about him standing in and taking a shot. I disagree. He publicly stated he would retire but that was purely a negotiation tactic. He wanted out of Dallas and a chance to compete for a starting job. He also wanted to keep the money he had pocketed and forced Dallas to let him go. If he quit, he would have owed them a lot of money. Questions about whether he wanted to play were a byproduct of his agent floating that he was questioning retirement, which we've already discussed. You claimed Orton's heart isn't in it anymore and he doesn't want to take hits. You supported this position with his supposed plans to retire, which is why its being discussed. No one is skewing the conversation.
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