TSOL Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) Orton is playing atrocious, no question about it. Hopefully it's a slump and he gets back in stride against the Raiders. But if you really think he's not an upgrade, I'd advise you to watch Houston and San Diego again in its entirety. Our RZ offense still sucks, but at least we get down the field and kick field goals. If you want to present that side of the argiement, then you should go back and watch the miami home game and the minnesota game from this year, and tell me how Orton is better One of the two of them clearly needs to step up and be a leader with some teeth. They both have an oppurtunity tomake something of themselves because our roster aint no joke! GO BILLS Edited December 15, 2014 by mastershake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Again what would EJ not have done yesterday that Orton did? They are both bad, but at this point to say one is better than the other, I am not sure how true that is. EJ wouldn't have thrown that 50-50 pass that was picked to Sammy. He wouldn't have thrown those passes on 3rd and 5 to the wide open Woods.or the ones that sailed over Sammy's head. Or the one that Sammy rose up and grabbed down the sidelines. Or the one to Bryce Brown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 EJ wouldn't have thrown that 50-50 pass that was picked to Sammy. He wouldn't have thrown those passes on 3rd and 5 to the wide open Woods.or the ones that sailed over Sammy's head. Or the one that Sammy rose up and grabbed down the sidelines. Or the one to Bryce Brown. So basically you have non-factual statements to prove your argument. Orton had a 17 QBR yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) Orton came here being average. He was consistently average. Rarely great, rarely awful. Immediately he was above average for a couple games. Then he was average. Then he was bad. Now he is awful. Just awful. That is getting less production out of an average QB, No. Go look at his 2011 campaign. Fluctuated wildly between 3 TD games and games he won 7-3 completing barely 50%. So basically you have non-factual statements to prove your argument. Orton had a 17 QBR yesterday. It's an opinion man. You can have a different one. I can't prove EJ is worse right now, because I haven't seen EJ play in 10 weeks. Neither have you. Edited December 15, 2014 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 EJ wouldn't have thrown that 50-50 pass that was picked to Sammy. He wouldn't have thrown those passes on 3rd and 5 to the wide open Woods.or the ones that sailed over Sammy's head. Or the one that Sammy rose up and grabbed down the sidelines. Or the one to Bryce Brown. That is such crap. Watch the games. He throws passes downfield. He scrambles and throws passes downfield and to players that werent the main target. He goes through his progressions at times. He throws back shoulder passes. He does everything people say he never ever does. He's just not very accurate and confidant too much of the time. That may or may not change. He was never playing as bad as Orton has for 3 straight games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 If you want to present that side of the argiement, then you should go back and watch the miami home game and the minnesota game from this year, and tell me how Orton is better One of the two of them clearly needs to step up and be a leader with some teeth. They both have an oppurtunity tomake something of themselves because our roster aint no joke! GO BILLS Orton has had some stinkers, surely. Maybe even comparable to EJ's bad games. But the dude has a couple game-winning drives and is 6-4 as a starter. He's the guy for the rest of 2014. That's not gonna change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBillsWillRiseAgain Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) For the first time in a long time this team doesn't have a lot of needs imo. They should be able to spend all of their time and resources securing an upgrade at QB and hopefully Oline during the offseason. It looks like there will be several veteran options available. I doubt the Niners part with Kap, but I wouldn't mind having Jay Cutler. He's no HOFer, but with the WRs we have I think he could do a decent job. And that's all this team needs to be a playoff team: Decent QB play. We don't need a Tom Brady or Peyton Manning I'm actually hoping they target Cutler specifically. I'd be too nervous with RGIII, plus I still have hope that EJ can turn into a much better QB if he continues to learn behind a veteran like Cutler. Edited December 15, 2014 by TheBillsWillRiseAgain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) That is such crap. Watch the games. He throws passes downfield. He scrambles and throws passes downfield and to players that werent the main target. He goes through his progressions at times. He throws back shoulder passes. He does everything people say he never ever does. He's just not very accurate and confidant too much of the time. That may or may not change. He was never playing as bad as Orton has for 3 straight games That's because we didn't give him 3 games to play bad. He would've stunk up Detroit, Kelly. His confidence was shot. Freddy was our leading receiver in targets and catches through 4 games. He was getting picked off on dump-offs. Edited December 15, 2014 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 That is such crap. Watch the games. He throws passes downfield. He scrambles and throws passes downfield and to players that werent the main target. He goes through his progressions at times. He throws back shoulder passes. He does everything people say he never ever does. He's just not very accurate and confidant too much of the time. That may or may not change. He was never playing as bad as Orton has for 3 straight games That is the truth! This CLE-DEN-GB stretch for Orton has been downright disgusting. Wretched QB play with the team winning two of the three without much contribution from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSOL Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 (edited) Orton has had some stinkers, surely. Maybe even comparable to EJ's bad games. But the dude has a couple game-winning drives and is 6-4 as a starter. He's the guy for the rest of 2014. That's not gonna change. I realize its not gonna change but EJ has had a few 4th quarter game winning drives as well. Come from behind style, late in the game. Edited December 15, 2014 by mastershake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBillsWillRiseAgain Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 He was getting picked off on dump-offs. You can't hold that one dump-off pick against him too much. JJ Watt is a freak of nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I realize its not gonna change but EJ has had a few 4th quarter game winning drives as well. Come from behind style, late in the game. I cant say ive seen Orton do that What are you talking about? EJ has one game-winning drive in his career. Orton has 2 this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 That is such crap. Watch the games. He throws passes downfield. He scrambles and throws passes downfield and to players that werent the main target. He goes through his progressions at times. He throws back shoulder passes. He does everything people say he never ever does. He's just not very accurate and confidant too much of the time. That may or may not change. He was never playing as bad as Orton has for 3 straight games Question for you - how open do you think the receivers were yesterday? They didn't look too open to me, although I don't have the benefit of the All 22. I also felt like in obvious passing situations the Packers put up a pretty ferocious rush. He did not fumble, which was good. In fact, he has not fumbled in the last seven games (since the Minnesota game), which is pretty remarkable for a guy who takes a fair number of sacks. His turtling prior to impending sacks is actually smart football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 No. Go look at his 2011 campaign. Fluctuated wildly between 3 TD games and games he won 7-3 completing barely 50%. Wrong. He was maddening. When he threw 3 TDs he threw 3 INT. When he threw 2 TD he threw 2 INT. He only played four and a half games. He wasn't really very good in any of them, or horrible, until the last one when he played about a half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 You can't hold that one dump-off pick against him too much. JJ Watt is a freak of nature. You can if EJ's top target was FJ. Houston picked up on that and Watt picked up on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 You can't hold that one dump-off pick against him too much. JJ Watt is a freak of nature. I know. But still man, the game in hand and you throw a pick-six? On a dump-off. That just encapsulates EJ's issues as a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSOL Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Could we at least agree that the QB change was made in an attempt for the coach to impress the new owner. And if it wasnt for that we may well have seen EJ all season. That the better long term intrest in the team is in EJ succeding Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Question for you - how open do you think the receivers were yesterday? They didn't look too open to me, although I don't have the benefit of the All 22. I also felt like in obvious passing situations the Packers put up a pretty ferocious rush. He did not fumble, which was good. In fact, he has not fumbled in the last seven games (since the Minnesota game), which is pretty remarkable for a guy who takes a fair number of sacks. His turtling prior to impending sacks is actually smart football. BS. You know full well EJ would get crucified for this. I cannot believe people are actually defeindg the play of a QB who had the worst game of his career. Turtling shows weakness. Stand in there and make a play for your team. If you are going to turtle, you might as well punt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Wrong. He was maddening. When he threw 3 TDs he threw 3 INT. When he threw 2 TD he threw 2 INT. He only played four and a half games. He wasn't really very good in any of them, or horrible, until the last one when he played about a half. I know you're off the Orton bandwagon, but I think that if you were a coach you'd probably say he's less likely to lose you the game than a guy who doesn't get through progressions well, is very inaccurate, and doesn't see the rush particularly well (and is hence prone to fumbles). Orton is not a good player, but I do think he's a significantly better game manager than the alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 What are you talking about? EJ has one game-winning drive in his career. Orton has 2 this season. How many times can you be wrong in a row? That may be an NFL record. He had two his rookie season. And one this year in game one. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/comeback.cgi?player=ManuEJ00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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