Real Penalty Yards

[The Big Cat]

I'm not saying the referees had too much influence on this game. I'm also not saying the coaches should get a pass for not having their players conduct themselves with a bit more discipline. But I'm certain the truth exists somewhere in between (head butts, theatrical bows and fist bumps aside).

 

Here's what the stat sheet would have you believe the penalty breakdown looked like:

 

Buffalo-11 for 98 yards

Denver-5 for 45 yards

 

Already those numbers are a bit lopsided, unless we buy into the notion that one team had half the discipline as the other. Again, head butts, theatrical bows and fist bumps aside.

 

But here's how those penalties actually played out:

 

Buffalo-11 for 207

Denver-5 for 45

 

Now THAT'S a pretty lopsided impact for penalties to have, if you ask me.

 

Additional yards not counted in the penalty yards actually recorded:

BUF: 14 additional yards on the Robey illegal contact since the drive was then sustained, giving the Broncos an opportunity to score

 

BUF: 40 additional yards for the Kyle Williams hold following the interception since the return went to the Denver 20, but the drive instead took over from our own 40, a difference of 50 yards.

 

BUF: 34 additional yards for the pass interference on Stephon Gilmore that gave them an opportunity to continue the drive after what should have been a third down stop. 15 yard penalty would never have happened if they got the initial call right

 

BUF: 21 additional yards on the phantom unnecessary roughness penalty that brought Gilmore's INT return from the DEN 38 all the way back to the BUF 26

 

I count zero instances wherein calls against Denver had the same positive outcomes for Buffalo. If I'm missing any, please post them here,

[rumblefish]

undisciplined teams get more penalties, and that's the bottom line

[The Big Cat]

undisciplined teams get more penalties, and that's the bottom line

 

Okay. So the Broncos were twice as disciplined as Buffalo yesterday. Okay.

[MarkAF43]

undisciplined teams get more penalties, and that's the bottom line

 

the *pats and the Seahawks rank ahead of the Bills, would you call them undisciplined?

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

undisciplined teams get more penalties, and that's the bottom line

Here we go with the crowd that thinks everything the refs call can be overcome with just a bit better play. The bottom line is a couple of those phantom calls TOTALLY changed the complexion of the game yesterday. Anybody who doesn't see that the NFL officiating is incredibly inconsistent and getting worse and impacting the games- I think you need to pay a little closer attention. I'm not a conspiracy theorists, but the rule book needs to be simplified or something. These calls just add more randomness to the game, and as a result the outcome is less reliant on talent.

Edited December 8, 2014 by 75Bills

[The Big Cat]

Here we go with the crowd that thinks everything the refs call can be overcome with just a bit better play. The bottom line is a couple of those phantom calls TOTALLY changed the complexion of the game yesterday. Anybody who doesn't see that the NFL officiating is incredibly inconsistent and getting worse and impacting the games- I think you need to pay a little closer attention.

 

Point in case: the no-call on the fourth down Chandler play killed the drive. There was mid-air contact and the defender never turned around. 9/10 times, that call is made. Next drive? The completely phantom call on Robey that gave them an opportunity continue their drive.

 

Good calls, bad calls, doesn't matter. It was TERRIBLY inconsistent.

[NoSaint]

 

 

Point in case: the no-call on the fourth down Chandler play killed the drive. There was mid-air contact and the defender never turned around. 9/10 times, that call is made. Next drive? The completely phantom call on Robey that gave them an opportunity continue their drive.

 

Good calls, bad calls, doesn't matter. It was TERRIBLY inconsistent.

 

again, theres been some rumbling that the robey call was supposed to be on williams holding thomas. lets wait and see these penalties before we get tooooo carried away.

[plenzmd1]

Here we go with the crowd that thinks everything the refs call can be overcome with just a bit better play. The bottom line is a couple of those phantom calls TOTALLY changed the complexion of the game yesterday. Anybody who doesn't see that the NFL officiating is incredibly inconsistent and getting worse and impacting the games- I think you need to pay a little closer attention.

 

allright, i am getting really cranky today ...

 

but what phantom calls are you talking about?

 

Lets just say the Robey call was a wrong number, as is being widely reported.

 

We have no idea, good or bad, on the INT returns.

 

What other calls are you referring to?

 

And, as i have said elsewhere, Gilmore was early in my eyes, and it was a no brainer PI.

[Kirby Jackson]

The officiating was a HUGE factor in the game yesterday. Too often people try to pin a loss on 1 thing. Some will say it was the officials, others will say it's the QB or coaching or turnovers. The reality is that it is a combination of all of those things. The refs accounted for at least 8 points in that game yesterday (assuming that they made the FGs). They played a role for sure.

[The Big Cat]

again, theres been some rumbling that the robey call was supposed to be on williams holding thomas. lets wait and see these penalties before we get tooooo carried away.

 

You're way to quick to be skeptical of the stuff we see based on the stuff we don't see. This applies to just about everything and you're not the only one.

[Jauronimo]

The officiating was a HUGE factor in the game yesterday. Too often people try to pin a loss on 1 thing. Some will say it was the officials, others will say it's the QB or coaching or turnovers. The reality is that it is a combination of all of those things. The refs accounted for at least 8 points in that game yesterday (assuming that they made the FGs). They played a role for sure.

Agreed. My frustration with the officiating yesterday was primarily due to the fact that I know that we just aren't good enough to overcome tough calls and beat quality teams like Denver. We can eat those calls and pull one out against Cleveland or Minnesota, but we need a few breaks to beat New England, Denver or Green Bay.

[BringBackFergy]

I'm not saying the referees had too much influence on this game. I'm also not saying the coaches should get a pass for not having their players conduct themselves with a bit more discipline. But I'm certain the truth exists somewhere in between (head butts, theatrical bows and fist bumps aside).

 

Here's what the stat sheet would have you believe the penalty breakdown looked like:

 

Buffalo-11 for 98 yards

Denver-5 for 45 yards

 

Already those numbers are a bit lopsided, unless we buy into the notion that one team had half the discipline as the other. Again, head butts, theatrical bows and fist bumps aside.

 

But here's how those penalties actually played out:

 

Buffalo-11 for 207

Denver-5 for 45

 

Now THAT'S a pretty lopsided impact for penalties to have, if you ask me.

 

Additional yards not counted in the penalty yards actually recorded:

BUF: 14 additional yards on the Robey illegal contact since the drive was then sustained, giving the Broncos an opportunity to score

 

BUF: 40 additional yards for the Kyle Williams hold following the interception since the return went to the Denver 20, but the drive instead took over from our own 40, a difference of 50 yards.

 

BUF: 34 additional yards for the pass interference on Stephon Gilmore that gave them an opportunity to continue the drive after what should have been a third down stop. 15 yard penalty would never have happened if they got the initial call right

 

BUF: 21 additional yards on the phantom unnecessary roughness penalty that brought Gilmore's INT return from the DEN 38 all the way back to the BUF 26

 

I count zero instances wherein calls against Denver had the same positive outcomes for Buffalo. If I'm missing any, please post them here,

Well done. And to think I couldn't have felt worse about the officiating in this game. The run by Freddie for a first down that was called back by a hold on Urbik...I saw a great push but no more holding than any other player out there. I really think sometimes they see Bronco's/Pat's opponents get some yardage and decide to knock us down a peg. I know it's a "foil hat" theory but it at least helps me rationalize the coincidental nature of these calls.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

Agreed. My frustration with the officiating yesterday was primarily due to the fact that I know that we just aren't good enough to overcome tough calls and beat quality teams like Denver. We can eat those calls and pull one out against Cleveland or Minnesota, but we need a few breaks to beat New England, Denver or Green Bay.

Yep, and they were always on big plays or 3rd down it seems. It's one thing to get called for illegal contact on 1st down and another when they would be forced to kick.

[The Big Cat]

Well done. And to think I couldn't have felt worse about the officiating in this game. The run by Freddie for a first down that was called back by a hold on Urbik...I saw a great push but no more holding than any other player out there. I really think sometimes they see Bronco's/Pat's opponents get some yardage and decide to knock us down a peg. I know it's a "foil hat" theory but it at least helps me rationalize the coincidental nature of these calls.

 

I pretty much flipped a coin as to whether or not to count that one. It really wasn't the play that sprung him, IIRC. And compared to all the other chaos on the line during a run, it wasn't that egregious. But it was certainly an infraction. Whether or not it needed to be called seems like splitting hairs.

[NoSaint]

 

 

You're way to quick to be skeptical of the stuff we see based on the stuff we don't see. This applies to just about everything and you're not the only one.

 

that reporters have indicated that williams was holding and players on the field were pointing to him, so saying maybe we should wait to see if the call on the guy that didnt do anything was just the wrong number is me being too skeptical?

[CodeMonkey]

So, it would seem that a lot of people here comment that the officiating is biased against the Bills almost every game. Even the wins.

Do you chronic anti-officials posters think there is a conspiracy against the Bills, a subconscious (or not) bias by the officials against a team that has been mediocre to bad for 15 years, or what is your explanation for the constant anti-Bills officiating?

 

Or maybe is it just therapeutic post-game venting?

Edited December 8, 2014 by CodeMonkey

[The Big Cat]

So, it would seem that a lot of people here comment that the officiating is biased against the Bills almost every game. Even the wins.

Do you chronic anti-officials posters think there is a conspiracy against the Bills, a subconscious (or not) bias by the officials against a team that has been mediocre to bad for 15 years, or what is your explanation for the constant anti-Bills officiating?

 

Specifically which poster(s) are you targeting with these questions?

 

Are you denying the impact that some of the calls had on the game's outcome?

[BringBackFergy]

So, it would seem that a lot of people here comment that the officiating is biased against the Bills almost every game. Even the wins.

Do you chronic anti-officials posters think there is a conspiracy against the Bills, a subconscious (or not) bias by the officials against a team that has been mediocre to bad for 15 years, or what is your explanation for the constant anti-Bills officiating?

 

Or maybe is it just therapeutic post-game venting?

Even the Browns' game had a few bad calls (Johnny Football tucked the ball in before it was fumbled and recovered in the endzone.) The on-air official even said the call on the field should be confirmed. What was the result? Call reversed. I don't want to bring up old news, but there's a game we won....where the call was very bad.

[CodeMonkey]

Specifically which poster(s) are you targeting with these questions?

 

Are you denying the impact that some of the calls had on the game's outcome?

Calls, correct as well as incorrect, always have an impact. But to think that for 15 years or more that [nearly] every game the calls go against one particular team goes against the laws of probability and would require some outside influence.

 

I do not want to call out anyone in particular, but you can find threads like this as well as others after nearly every game. More after the losses. I am mainly just wondering what people who think this way think is the explanation for the outside influence, because I do not think that way personally.

[26CornerBlitz]

Here's the Graham INT: http://www.nfl.com/v...orey-Graham Did Kyle Williams really hold on this play? I'm just not seeing it as a legit holding call.

Edited December 8, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz