YoloinOhio Posted December 3, 2014 Author Posted December 3, 2014 (edited) Um ... Russell Wilson. And of course Brady and Brees (although they're long in the tooth). Other guys include Hoyer (OK; not great), Orton (OK; not great). You can say the same about every conference. The ACC and PAC 10 grade out best, but there are only 2 elite QBs from those conferences (Ryan/Rivers; Rodgers/Luck). Good QBs come from anywhere. Moreover, other excellent QBs like Roethlisberger and Romo essentially played in Big 10 territory (Illinois/Ohio). There are a lot of SEC guys (Manning/Manning/Newton/Cutler/Stafford), but Payton is the only great one. Eli is of course pretty good and has produced, and Stafford shows a lot of potential but hasn't put it all together yet. I think Newton is in a downward spiral and Cutler just too uneven. I watch almost every MSU game (wife went there). I think Cook makes a lot of poor decisions (throwing into double-triple coverage and getting picked as a result), so I'm leery of him. He's also blessed with a great D, a fantastic running game, and good receivers. It's a very, very talented team -- as talented as SEC teams over the past couple of years judging from where guys have been drafted and where they're projected to draft after this season. That said, he has tools and can improve. I think he should stay in college another year. I love both Langford and Lippett - you? Really underrated guys nationally. I agree that you get good NFL QBs and bad NFL QBs out of every conference, regardless of their stats or how many bowl games or NCs they win in college. Edited December 3, 2014 by YoloinOhio
dave mcbride Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 I love both Langford and Lippett - you? Really underrated guys nationally. I agree that you get good NFL QBs and bad NFL QBs out of every conference, regardless of their stats or how many bowl games or NCs they win in college. I love Langford and Lippett too. Both will play in the NFL. Langford is as good as his predecessor (Laveon Bell), who is rolling in the NFL.
YoloinOhio Posted December 3, 2014 Author Posted December 3, 2014 I love Langford and Lippett too. Both will play in the NFL. Langford is as good as his predecessor (Laveon Bell), who is rolling in the NFL. Also their LT who shut down Bosa and has never allowed a sack... can't remember his name but think he is only a soph. Really good prospect.
Luxy312 Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 Off the top of my head: Tom Brady, Drew Brees & Russell Wilson. It's nice to pick the couple of guys that had success. Off the top of my head, how about Tony Banks, Chad Henne, Drew Stanton, Todd Collins, Chuck Long, Jeff George, and Jim Harbaugh? I'm sure I'm missing a few and those are just early 1st/2nd round picks, but none of them are worth a damn. I would gladly take your M.State guy in the 3rd round ala Russell Wilson or even in the 6th ala Tom Brady. I would NOT take him in the 1st or second like so many other average to horrible big ten QB's drafted in recent years. I sure as hell wouldn't trade up for him.
Coach Tuesday Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 It's nice to pick the couple of guys that had success. Off the top of my head, how about Tony Banks, Chad Henne, Drew Stanton, Todd Collins, Chuck Long, Jeff George, and Jim Harbaugh? I'm sure I'm missing a few and those are just early 1st/2nd round picks, but none of them are worth a damn. I would gladly take your M.State guy in the 3rd round ala Russell Wilson or even in the 6th ala Tom Brady. I would NOT take him in the 1st or second like so many other average to horrible big ten QB's drafted in recent years. I sure as hell wouldn't trade up for him. "All swans are white." FALSE.
YoloinOhio Posted December 3, 2014 Author Posted December 3, 2014 It's nice to pick the couple of guys that had success. Off the top of my head, how about Tony Banks, Chad Henne, Drew Stanton, Todd Collins, Chuck Long, Jeff George, and Jim Harbaugh? I'm sure I'm missing a few and those are just early 1st/2nd round picks, but none of them are worth a damn. I would gladly take your M.State guy in the 3rd round ala Russell Wilson or even in the 6th ala Tom Brady. I would NOT take him in the 1st or second like so many other average to horrible big ten QB's drafted in recent years. I sure as hell wouldn't trade up for him. why does the conference matter where you would draft him?
H2o Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 Sounds like the 2015 draft is not good for QBs again. They include Cook, but I don't think he will declare. Outside of Marcus Mariotta, imo, the class is weak.
Luxy312 Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 why does the conference matter where you would draft him? It doesn't to me, but this guy thinks somehow playing in the Big Ten actually matters and that the conference does a better job than others at preparing QB's for the pros. I like and follow the Big Ten personally, but would not ever support the notion that what he's saying is true.
YoloinOhio Posted December 3, 2014 Author Posted December 3, 2014 (edited) It doesn't to me, but this guy thinks somehow playing in the Big Ten actually matters and that the conference does a better job than others at preparing QB's for the pros. I like and follow the Big Ten personally, but would not ever support the notion that what he's saying is true. i think it was me. No, I don't think they do a better job than others on the whole. I'm not going to draft Braxton Miller vs. a pro style guy in another conference. I do like a 6'4 pro style guy who makes nfl throw after NFL throw and has shown he can do it in 100 degrees as well as wind, snow and below 0 windchill through HS and college, vs the unknown in someone who's never experienced playing in anything but one climate. Gives me more to evaluate, because the hardest thing to assess is whether a player can replicate what he has done in college once he gets in the nfl. You can tell him to make certain throws at the combine or pro day, chase him around with a broom to simulate a pass rush, whatever. The more variables you have to work with the better. Edited December 3, 2014 by YoloinOhio
BillsFanM.D. Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 Um ... Russell Wilson. Sort of. He played one season in that conference. He was ACC QB for all other seasons. Either way, it doesn't detract from your post. There's good and bad QB's in most conferences. Of those...only a very few become 'elite' NFL qb's.
Maddog69 Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 The rest of us have a history of watching JPL, Trent and EJ struggle to the point where we are still ithout a franchise QB. I think this is the biggest problem with the fanbase. None of this has any effect on the current QBs on the roster yet it is held against them. Just because we haven't had success developing a QB doesn't mean that EJ will never develop or the next young QB we bring in is doomed to failure. Fans need to let the past go and they need to realize that it takes a couple years for a QB to really develop. On rare occasions, a rookie QB will be good from the get go, but that is rare. Most struggle. The issue is that our fanbase has no patience for that struggle. Dumping a struggling young QB without a dramatically better option on the roster just sets the team back in terms of development.
K-9 Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 Right. And just as we've seen a devaluation of RB contracts because of that shelf life, perhaps the "seismic" shift in professional QB's could follow a similar path. I'm completely spit balling here. I'm not saying it WILL happen, but I am saying it's within the realm of possibility. I don't think it's in the realm of possibility. The only way an offense can maximize its effectiveness is by having the entire field to work with. That only happens when the QB is operating from the middle of the field consistently and that only happens when operating from a pocket. That's not to say that an occasional roll-out or moving pocket won't catch a defense by surprise, but you can't make that a bread and butter scheme; it's too easily defended as you limit yourself to 1/2 or 1/3 of the field. GO BILLS!!! Outside of Marcus Mariotta, imo, the class is weak. Mariotta is nothing special as a pro prospect at this point, either. GO BILLS!!!
Luxy312 Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 i think it was me. No, I don't think they do a better job than others on the whole. I'm not going to draft Braxton Miller vs. a pro style guy in another conference. I do like a 6'4 pro style guy who makes nfl throw after NFL throw and has shown he can do it in 100 degrees as well as wind, snow and below 0 windchill through HS and college, vs the unknown in someone who's never experienced playing in anything but one climate. Gives me more to evaluate, because the hardest thing to assess is whether a player can replicate what he has done in college once he gets in the nfl. You can tell him to make certain throws at the combine or pro day, chase him around with a broom to simulate a pass rush, whatever. The more variables you have to work with the better. It wasn't you. It was someone else that suggested "trading up" to draft Connor Cook. I'll tell you what, his completion percentage wasn't better than Gary Nova at Rutgers. I'm not sure I would draw the conclusion that he can make all the throws. 58.2% at the college level is pretty paltry, where as Mariota was sitting at 68.6%. At least Mariota was mobile. At the end of the day, I didn't take exception with taking a shot at a guy. Regardless of conference. I did take exception with trading up for a guy that doesn't blow me away at doing anything at the college level. As someone said, he probably will spend another year in college anyway, so it's pretty irrelevant. Anyone remember 2nd round pick Todd Collins by the Bills out of Michigan? I do and was not impressed.
ndirish1978 Posted December 3, 2014 Posted December 3, 2014 Tell that to the WR's, they're the ones who got EJ demoted. You've GOT to be kidding me. They're the ones losing money because our QBs don't get them the ball!
FireChan Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 You've GOT to be kidding me. They're the ones losing money because our QBs don't get them the ball! You misunderstand. I'm okay with the demotion, but the fans had no control.
Agent 91 Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 OK - that's the one. Didn't see it hit the ground. Yeah it skipped off the ground. You can see it in Watkins face. He is frustrated. He looks like he is trying to play it off though Its written. All over his face. Atleast from where I sit. I said to my dad when we were watching. If we had another qb there would probably be another mutiny. I thought Rob Woods started to look a lot like he did with EJ before the 2 games he got hot. But that may just be my own individual observation.
YoloinOhio Posted December 4, 2014 Author Posted December 4, 2014 (edited) Yeah it skipped off the ground. You can see it in Watkins face. He is frustrated. He looks like he is trying to play it off though Its written. All over his face. Atleast from where I sit. I said to my dad when we were watching. If we had another qb there would probably be another mutiny. I thought Rob Woods started to look a lot like he did with EJ before the 2 games he got hot. But that may just be my own individual observation. woods wears his emotions on his sleeve. While not all passes are good to Sammy, there have been some catchable that he didn't get and he did not beat Haden 1:1 according to those who break down the film. So not all on orton and I love Sammy but he's a rookie and that was an all pro corner. It will come. Edited December 4, 2014 by YoloinOhio
Formerly Allan in MD Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 Tell that to the WR's, they're the ones who got EJ demoted. lEJ got EJ demoted. Did you ever watch him closely as he missed open receivers and had no feel for the game? Clearly not.
tonyd19 Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 Tell that to the WR's, they're the ones who got EJ demoted almost got killed. Fixed
FireChan Posted December 4, 2014 Posted December 4, 2014 lEJ got EJ demoted. Did you ever watch him closely as he missed open receivers and had no feel for the game? Clearly not. How could so many people misconstrue this post. Baffling.
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