Gugny Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 With this defense and with the offensive players available throughout the course of the season, I consider (8-8) to be an outright failure, bordering on pathetic. This is a playoff team with a better HC and OC. In my opinion, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 With this defense and with the offensive players available throughout the course of the season, I consider (8-8) to be an outright failure, bordering on pathetic. This is a playoff team with a better HC and OC. In my opinion, of course. In today's NFL, in most cases you go as far as your QB takes you. That's my opinion. The Bills have a mediocre QB and will likely have a mediocre record. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snamsnoops Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 (edited) For some reason he doesn't seem to get how handicapped EJ was with such an inferior offensive staff this year. Orton, while not great in any aspect.... he is veteran enough to read the defenses, set the line protections like Fitz used to do, and change the play if needed. Listening to EJ, and what he has learned from Orton so far is compelling enough evidence to realize that benching EJ was the best thing that could happen for everyone. EJ is learning far more by watching Orton then he ever did at the hands of Hackett's moronic play calling. Orton sets the offensive plays he wants to run in the film room, and takes command of the offense in every area. If there is a failure along the way, its that no QB can do it all by himself, and needs more support then some baboon continuously calling pass plays against a better pass defense then run defense. Even against Cleveland who had the 9th ranked pass defense, and twenty something run defense Hackett had Orton come out throwing. Kyle Orton is not the bigger issue with the team, its the very bad interior O line, and poor offensive coaching. Still, the team is 7-5 and has a shot to get better as the season progresses. We can only hope. yup, this team with EJ wasnt going anywhere. KO at least gave us hope of a possible winning season and dare i say we r still in the playoff hunt. December is a really really tough month. This is arguable the best D B-lo has had.....ever! We can win any game as easily as we could lose any game. Thats why they play the game!Lets not kid ourselves our O-line is not the greatest, but we do have some play makers at skill positions. Woods has been solid as of late and this was expected. Watkins and woods should be productive for us for a long time. Who was this TE Grey, and where did he come from. not sure he produces regularly, but what a suprise. All in all we have a nasty D, Average at best O.. We can win games. Yes a top ten QB would vault this team into SB talk, but we have been searching for a QB since the days of Kelly. All i got is that it is easier said then done.This is our team and putting in EJ would b a mistake until we r officially out if the playoffs. I havent given up on EJ, he needs to learn from a VET --> this is what he is doing. For some reason we play like Chit-ner at home, but a win is a win, and is was gainst an AFC opponent! Also,our O cord may need to be upgraded. Edited December 1, 2014 by snamsnoops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv's Neighbor Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Back to Jauron territory! Next stop WADE'S WORLD! Hope it's not one step forward, two back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fridge Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 You can play that hypothetical, but highly unlikely that EJ wins the Lions and Viking games. Why is that exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Perhaps that's true, but who knows? Perhaps they win a game or two that the Orton led offense helped to lose. People love to act like EJ was the worst QB ever when he really wasn't. Orton has had a few good games but other than those he hasn't looked like much of an upgrade. The bottom line is that 8-8 doesn't get the Bills in the playoffs. EJ could have managed missing the playoffs too while getting the experience he needs. The change to Orton was a "playoffs or bust" move and if they don't make the playoffs, well, that's a bust. This team needs to win 3 of the next 4 and make this conversation moot. With this D it's possible. Got enough non sequiturs in there? It's not a zero sum game and no one claimed Orton would guarantee a trip to the playoffs. At the time, he presented a far better opportunity for the Bills to make the playoffs. That's still the case, and unless you live in an alternate reality world to think that EJ would have had a miraculous turnaround in his play, Bills were destined to 5 wins with him at the helm, Why is that exactly? He was too shellshocked to look more than 10 yards down field, his WRs quit on him, and defenses zeroed in on his weakness. Orton's flaws have absolutely nothing to do with EJ's troubles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snamsnoops Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Imagine next year with Kiko back! Yup, We just cant lose our D-cord again. Bradham is a bad bad man! With the emergence of Brown our LB core should be solid for years! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 In today's NFL, in most cases you go as far as your QB takes you. That's my opinion. The Bills have a mediocre QB and will likely have a mediocre record. I think this holds true for teams who do not have a defense like the Bills' defense. But looking at the standings, I see CIN, PHI and AZ, all with 3 losses, leading their divisions, and none with anything better than a mediocre QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 He was too shellshocked to look more than 10 yards down field, his WRs quit on him, and defenses zeroed in on his weakness. Orton's flaws have absolutely nothing to do with EJ's troubles. Sammy Watkins was covered by a very good Haden, and was still open quite a bit, but Orton refused to look downfield to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Buffalo Joe Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Next stop WADE'S WORLD! Hope it's not one step forward, two back. That's a bunch of Malarkey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 We finish 8-8 and I'm doing the happy dance. I want a home playoff game obviously, but 8 wins for the 1st time since 2004 would OK. How pathetic is it when fans are actually happy with 8-8 seasons? Mr. P PLEASE read this BS and clean house so we can start actually have WINNING Seasons with playoffs and maybe superbowls as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 8-8 still means 15 years with no playoffs. And that's the longest streak since 1990 when the NFL went to a 6 team post-season format for each conference. well ain't you a ray of sunshine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 I'm with you - 8-8 is good and I think we might actually finish 9-7 - Yup, we beat OAK and steal one of the other 3. The key in the offseason is to shore up the OL, get Kiko back, and maybe just maybe keep Hughes. I am also hoping that EJ can make enough progress to have a legit competition in training camp next year. I wanted to like Orton but yesterday was pretty much what we're going to get with him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 How pathetic is it when fans are actually happy with 8-8 seasons? Mr. P PLEASE read this BS and clean house so we can start actually have WINNING Seasons with playoffs and maybe superbowls as well! Maybe they are happy to see progress. It may be your opinion that it is pathetic, but each fan can choose what they want to be happy about. It gives the team something tangible to build on. Mock it if you wish, but not everyone looks at everything the exact same way. I know what you are saying, don't get me wrong. But sometimes there are positives to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Say what you will, but playoffs or not this year, this team is headed in the right direction. With the D intact, a couple guards, and a real OC, this team is set to go deep into the playoffs next year. Not a big fan of Maroon, but I give him one more year to cure his rectocephaly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jethro_tull Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 With this defense and with the offensive players available throughout the course of the season, I consider (8-8) to be an outright failure, bordering on pathetic. This is a playoff team with a better HC and OC. In my opinion, of course. IMHO some of the personnel on offense are keeping this team from legit contention, not the coaching. Love Freddy and what he has done for this team but his quickness is gone. CJ can't really be as effective as he could be in the run game because the OL is still sub par in run blocking. Chandler is a great backup, but not even close to a Gronkowski. Orton could improve with more reps and a legit run game to keep the defense honest but he has a low ceiling. Upgrade those areas and this team is righ up there even with the same coaching staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 How pathetic is it when fans are actually happy with 8-8 seasons? Mr. P PLEASE read this BS and clean house so we can start actually have WINNING Seasons with playoffs and maybe superbowls as well! Yes, Mr. P. Please scrap any and all incremental signs of progress and clean house. Because nothing leads to consistent success better than cleaning house every 2-3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agent 91 Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 For some reason he doesn't seem to get how handicapped EJ was with such an inferior offensive staff this year. Orton, while not great in any aspect.... he is veteran enough to read the defenses, set the line protections like Fitz used to do, and change the play if needed. Listening to EJ, and what he has learned from Orton so far is compelling enough evidence to realize that benching EJ was the best thing that could happen for everyone. EJ is learning far more by watching Orton then he ever did at the hands of Hackett's moronic play calling. Orton sets the offensive plays he wants to run in the film room, and takes command of the offense in every area. If there is a failure along the way, its that no QB can do it all by himself, and needs more support then some baboon continuously calling pass plays against a better pass defense then run defense. Even against Cleveland who had the 9th ranked pass defense, and twenty something run defense Hackett had Orton come out throwing. Kyle Orton is not the bigger issue with the team, its the very bad interior O line, and poor offensive coaching. Still, the team is 7-5 and has a shot to get better as the season progresses. We can only hope. I think he gets it. But I concur that anyone who says EJ definitely wouldn't have won this or that game has the same blind hatred. Orton doesnt look good. The only saving grace is as you said, what ej says he is learning from Orton. It is a playoff or bust situation. They said Orton gives us the best chance of winning. Well what are we trying to win? 8 games... whats the difference between 8 games and 6 or 7? We still miss the playoffs. Now we have a qb controversy next year. And all buffalo has in their minds is how many times EJ got hit by JJ Watt. He was 2-2 losing the Houston game... yeah he basically lost that game WITH the help of the O-line. Also the San Diego game, we played against evidently an elite qb. He dissected and obliterated our defense. Did Hackett put him in a position to win and let him succeed or fail? Or did Hackett coach him not to take chances? Do we know with all certainty? And how many games did Orton win vs how many games did he manage. He looks down field sometimes. But most of his passes are? Yep under 10 yds. Didnt the majority of Ortons yds come from Fred and Gray? How many games did the D win not to mention. Our star player Alex Henery in the Detroit game.Im not saying you. But I am saying people are giving people credit where credit is not due. Why do we always have this conversation? Why cant we let EJ play with a real OC and compete for his job with a real offensive game plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 Say what you will, but playoffs or not this year, this team is headed in the right direction. With the D intact, a couple guards, and a real OC, this team is set to go deep into the playoffs next year. Not a big fan of Maroon, but I give him one more year to cure his rectocephaly. Were they headed in the right direction when they lost to probable playoff teams like SD (at home) NE (at home) KC (at home) and then in a must-win game, couldn't score double digits against Miami? Beating up on NYJ and CLE is nice. Losing would be embarrassing. Yet, they come up small when it matters most despite, as many claim, having more talent than they've had in years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snamsnoops Posted December 1, 2014 Share Posted December 1, 2014 IMHO some of the personnel on offense are keeping this team from legit contention, not the coaching. Love Freddy and what he has done for this team but his quickness is gone. CJ can't really be as effective as he could be in the run game because the OL is still sub par in run blocking. Chandler is a great backup, but not even close to a Gronkowski. Orton could improve with more reps and a legit run game to keep the defense honest but he has a low ceiling. Upgrade those areas and this team is righ up there even with the same coaching staff. Only thing i can agree with! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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