Johnny Hammersticks Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 Insanity. Not insanity. Just part of the truth. Great players can make a coordinator look good, just a a great coordinator can make his players look better than they really are.
Dragonborn10 Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 No need to apologize or congratulate. Crossman or any ST's coach has nothing to do with ST's performance. It is all theplayers. Do you think Crossman is doign anything different than he did last year? Dixon made a great effort play. Nothing magical about it. If anyone deserves credit it is Marrone for carrying two kickers and cutting Moorman.
Rockinon Posted November 27, 2014 Posted November 27, 2014 I'm still peeved that they moved the kickoff spot up so far that almost no kickers bring the ball out of the end zone anymore. Turned one of the most exciting plays of the game into a meh. But it was fun seeing the Jets repeatedly bring the ball out and Easley gunning it hard.
Kelly the Dog Posted November 27, 2014 Posted November 27, 2014 Marrone uses a lot of starters on the ST this year. That has made a very big difference. Obviously the additions of Boobie and Graham who were ST all pros made a big difference. Whaley picking up Carpenter and Gay Schmidt also had a huge impact. It's a combination of things. But ST coaches cannot make crappy ST players into good ones. The only ST coach with worse stats than Crossman's Bills last year was Bobby April, you know, the one guy that everyone seemed to want instead of Crossman.
BigBuff423 Posted November 27, 2014 Posted November 27, 2014 Rather than apologize to Crossman, you can thank Mr. Doug Whaley for bringing in excellent ST players. Oh wait...doug should be fired. I forgot. ^^^^this....and to be fair, I was one leading the charge with pitchforks and torches...as it turns out, they really did just need better players
thewildrabbit Posted November 27, 2014 Posted November 27, 2014 No need to apologize or congratulate. Crossman or any ST's coach has nothing to do with ST's performance. It is all theplayers. Do you think Crossman is doign anything different than he did last year? Dixon made a great effort play. Nothing magical about it. If anyone deserves credit it is Marrone for carrying two kickers and cutting Moorman. and for Whaley in finding a decent punter and my favorite kicker in Dan Carpenter! In Marrone carrying two kickers, and fielding extra players for special teams while know red zone threat WR MIke Williams is inactive most of the year. This last game I think MW was in on some ST snaps at least. The Bills red zone scoring is the worst in the NFL in scoring TD's. The O line is one of the worst in the NFL, as is the the offense. So, sorry if i don't choose to cheer for Maroons best buddy considering the HC is constantly shifting help his way. Meanwhile the offense needs a bunch of help in the run game, and scoring points.
GunnerBill Posted November 27, 2014 Posted November 27, 2014 I at the time said I was sceptical, because I like No Saint remember Crossman's not so special teams in Detroit. However, I also said that Marrone and his staff had undergone an evaluation and had come to a conclusion and we had to trust them on what they were saying.
Wayne Cubed Posted November 27, 2014 Posted November 27, 2014 No need to apologize as I wasn't outraged the Bills kept him. I actually defended the move. Good/bad special teams don't make teams great. Bobby April had the Bills ST tops in the league during the Juaron era, it didn't matter. I said as much in the Crossman epic thread.
klos63 Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 Im still waiting to see what Crossman does when he doesnt have top tier talent. getting very good play out of very good players is definitely nice, and not to be ignored - but after a decade of his poor coaching, im still not jumping on his bandwagon yet. Is there any coach who's squad wouldn't suffer if the talent level goes down? How about judge a coach when given the proper tools to succeed. He's been given the tools and it's working.
NoSaint Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 Is there any coach who's squad wouldn't suffer if the talent level goes down? How about judge a coach when given the proper tools to succeed. He's been given the tools and it's working. I'm saying you could have this squad look good. If he has an average crew I'm looking to see if they are top ten, average, or 31st. I don't but that almost every year of his career was coaching bottom three talent.
ALF Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 Crossman is a very good surprise. I wish the OL coach could step up to the level of Joe D' or mouse Mc Nally
mountainwampus Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 If Crossman is so good, why do we have Gay, the kickoff specialist, on the roster? Oh, that's right, because Crossman sucks. Meanwhile, every good team routinely pins opponents inside the 20 on kickoffs. The ST superstars are Easley, Carpenter and Schmidt. Crossman has nothing to do with their talents.
thebandit27 Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 If Crossman is so good, why do we have Gay, the kickoff specialist, on the roster? Oh, that's right, because Crossman sucks. Meanwhile, every good team routinely pins opponents inside the 20 on kickoffs. The ST superstars are Easley, Carpenter and Schmidt. Crossman has nothing to do with their talents. This might be the worst argument I've ever seen. Kickoff coverage had an almost minimal effect on ST play in this league nowadays. Punt coverage, return game, etc are the critical elements. Oh, and Marrone likes to keep a KO specialist because it keeps the PK's leg fresh; it's not because Dan Carpenter can't boom it deep. Lastly, if you think that those are te only 3 impact ST guys on the team, you haven't been watching. Ron Brooks, Corey Graham, Boobie Dixon, and even Robert Woods have made outstanding special teams plays all season.
hondo in seattle Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 Hmmm.... Our punt, KO, and FG teams look good because we have good kickers, not good coaching. How do our return teams look?
mountainwampus Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 This might be the worst argument I've ever seen. Kickoff coverage had an almost minimal effect on ST play in this league nowadays. Punt coverage, return game, etc are the critical elements. Oh, and Marrone likes to keep a KO specialist because it keeps the PK's leg fresh; it's not because Dan Carpenter can't boom it deep. Lastly, if you think that those are te only 3 impact ST guys on the team, you haven't been watching. Ron Brooks, Corey Graham, Boobie Dixon, and even Robert Woods have made outstanding special teams plays all season. I recall we were getting gashed on KO returns last season. Marrone can't stomach the thought of covering a KO. He wants to keep ST out of the game. He wants a sure thing: drive starts at the 20. Seems idiotic to think that Carpenter's accuracy is somehow affected by a few kickoffs per game. I've never heard of such a thing. Wouldn't it be better to just kick it short and give Easley a chance to pin them? Carpenter was accurate last year, even with kickoff duty, and he usually got touchbacks anyway. If a KO specialist is such a good idea, why doesn't any other team in the NFL have a kickoff specialist? Is Marrone some lone genius? Now there is no room on the roster for our red zone threat, Mike Williams, because too many kickers. Having more than 3 ST stars only bolsters my argument that Crossman is a non-factor. It's the players that are good. Thanks for agreeing.
YoloinOhio Posted November 28, 2014 Author Posted November 28, 2014 I recall we were getting gashed on KO returns last season. Marrone can't stomach the thought of covering a KO. He wants to keep ST out of the game. He wants a sure thing: drive starts at the 20. Seems idiotic to think that Carpenter's accuracy is somehow affected by a few kickoffs per game. I've never heard of such a thing. Wouldn't it be better to just kick it short and give Easley a chance to pin them? Carpenter was accurate last year, even with kickoff duty, and he usually got touchbacks anyway. If a KO specialist is such a good idea, why doesn't any other team in the NFL have a kickoff specialist? Is Marrone some lone genius? Now there is no room on the roster for our red zone threat, Mike Williams, because too many kickers. Having more than 3 ST stars only bolsters my argument that Crossman is a non-factor. It's the players that are good. Thanks for agreeing. if Marrone thought Williams was an effective red zone threat, he would find room. I don't blame the decision to use a KOS on him not playing.
Lv-Bills Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 Apologize for what exactly? He has sucked his whole career, including his first year here. Took so much heat, that Whaley went out and got him some good players. Good job to the Bills for the bolstering of special teams. So, what it appears is that the guy can't coach unless he's stacked. Or maybe he's just unlucky and has had terrible players his whole coaching career before this year.
The Big Cat Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 Anyone want to name that stand out unit in the NFL that's not "stacked?" Special teams, offense or defense. Doesn't matter. Show me the one that's not "stacked." Good play = good players. Bad play = bad coaches. So stupid.
NoSaint Posted November 28, 2014 Posted November 28, 2014 Anyone want to name that stand out unit in the NFL that's not "stacked?" Special teams, offense or defense. Doesn't matter. Show me the one that's not "stacked." Good play = good players. Bad play = bad coaches. So stupid. not off hand. is your argument that outside of 3 years, his entire career hes had talent that ranks in the bottom 3? or might there be a case that given an average team, he doesnt get the most out of them?
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