B-Man Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 If you thought the violence and rioting in and around Ferguson, Mo., last night was unbelievable, President Obama’s take on the effectiveness of his “peaceful protest” speech will blow your mind. According to White House Deputy Press Secretary Eric Schultz, the president feels his remarks to the nation were worthwhile since “most protests were peaceful.” Maybe he hasn’t read the paper yet today. Come on, NYT, man up … offer a bounty for the head. New York Times Publishes Darren Wilson’s Address Info As Ferguson... On Monday, the New York Times published the name of the short suburban street where Ferguson Police Officer Darren Wilson's house sits .
/dev/null Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 (edited) "Charging" is now an ambiguous racist code word http://www.realclear...are_racist.html So does this put San Diego in the same club as Washington? Will Phil Simms apologize for daring to speak the team name? Will America be annoyed by another of Bob Costas soliloquies? Edited November 26, 2014 by /dev/null
DC Tom Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 "Charging" is now an ambiguous racist code word http://www.realclear...are_racist.html So does this put San Diego in the same club as Washington? Will Phil Simms apologize for daring to speak the team name? Will America be annoyed by another of Bob Costas soliloquies? LISA BLOOM, NBC LEGAL ANALYST: I handle excessive case forces, I know how to do it and frankly it's not all that complicated. What you do is you get the person who's accused of excessive force to break this down nano second by nano second so that you can test if the story is true or not. That tells you all you need to know about her perspective. A "nanosecond by nanosecond" breakdown of a tense situation does not accurately reflect that situation - you get a HELL of a lot different answers in a protracted ex post facto analysis than you do judging the situation at the time from within the situation. The woman's not an authority on excessive case forces. She's an authority on sales.
Alaska Darin Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 I actually agree with all this except about the National Guard. They didn't enlist to go arresting people. They are not trained for that and dont have experience handling situations like that. They should have brought in cops from the state, though They are trained. And arresting people is pretty easy. Processing them is another story. And if it had led to similar protests in other places I'd do the same thing there. At some point people will learn the difference between protesting and criminal behavior. I've seen this behavior by mobs in a couple of different countries. The only time it was ever stopped was by equal force. In South Korea, the riot police made the Rodney King beating look like a birthday party. End of protest. I'm not saying it needs to get to that level because generally Americans don't require that large an escalation but...
TakeYouToTasker Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 They are trained. And arresting people is pretty easy. Processing them is another story. And if it had led to similar protests in other places I'd do the same thing there. At some point people will learn the difference between protesting and criminal behavior. Our military does not belong in the streets, combating domestic crime. We should not court a new Kent State, or worse, Tienanmen Square.
Tiberius Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 Our military does not belong in the streets, combating domestic crime. We should not court a new Kent State, or worse, Tienanmen Square. That's what I was thinking. Arresting people may sound simple but it's anything but. Weekend warriors are not used to dealing with emotional issues that spin out of control quickly. I think it would be really unfair to have them do that. There are enough police to be shifted to the scene and handle the situation, and there should have been.
boyst Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 They are trained. And arresting people is pretty easy. Processing them is another story. And if it had led to similar protests in other places I'd do the same thing there. At some point people will learn the difference between protesting and criminal behavior. I've seen this behavior by mobs in a couple of different countries. The only time it was ever stopped was by equal force. In South Korea, the riot police made the Rodney King beating look like a birthday party. End of protest. I'm not saying it needs to get to that level because generally Americans don't require that large an escalation but... Hopefully, they're not combat oriented or suffering NDCUSE type PTSD. Hopefully, they're MP's. Our military does not belong in the streets, combating domestic crime. We should not court a new Kent State, or worse, Tienanmen Square. Well, at least it'll look good on TV tonight.
Alaska Darin Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 http://www.army.mil/article/10426/Missouri_National_Guard_conducts_riot_control_training/ This is a regular occurrence by National Guard units all over the country. It's what they do. We can argue semantics about roles but that's another topic all together. In this instance, in a city the size of St Louis with the number of protesters, the resources should have been allocated and little tolerance should have been shown.
boyst Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 That's what I was thinking. Arresting people may sound simple but it's anything but. Weekend warriors are not used to dealing with emotional issues that spin out of control quickly. I think it would be really unfair to have them do that. There are enough police to be shifted to the scene and handle the situation, and there should have been. Come on, you know it. !@#$ the Police.
Tiberius Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 http://www.army.mil/article/10426/Missouri_National_Guard_conducts_riot_control_training/ This is a regular occurrence by National Guard units all over the country. It's what they do. We can argue semantics about roles but that's another topic all together. In this instance, in a city the size of St Louis with the number of protesters, the resources should have been allocated and little tolerance should have been shown. You might be right, but I'd guess most NGmen don't get that training. And dealing with crazy people that are angry inst something these guys get used to in the guard one weekend a month. Love those shields though, like the Greek phalanx
DC Tom Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 Our military does not belong in the streets, combating domestic crime. We should not court a new Kent State, or worse, Tienanmen Square. While I agree with the last sentence, the National Guard is not "our military." They're the states' militias, to be used at the governors' discretion (and not at the President's discretion until and unless federalized, at which point posse comitatus comes in to play). It's one of the reasons Katrina was such a damn mess - Bush couldn't commit the National Guard, and Blanco wouldn't. Also, the National Guard is usually intended to round out the non-combat functions of the combat brigades. So they encompass a lot of skills like...public affairs, or military police. I don't know who's being called out in Ferguson, but the odds are they're as qualified and trained for crowd control, if not more so, than the civilian police.
Tiberius Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 Come on, you know it. !@#$ the Police. Don't you just wish your political opponents thought the way you want them to? The world would be so much easier to understand. Beef prices
boyst Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 You might be right, but I'd guess most NGmen don't get that training. And dealing with crazy people that are angry inst something these guys get used to in the guard one weekend a month. Love those shields though, like the Greek phalanx I worry about that, too. How do you fight gunfire? More gunfire. I bet there are more then a few automatic weapons in the crowd of looters. Don't you just wish your political opponents thought the way you want them to? The world would be so much easier to understand. Beef prices I just want to post the NWA song but it has dirty words that would get me in trouble.
Chef Jim Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 Don't you just wish your political opponents thought the way you want them to? Says the guy who generalized conservatives every chance he gets.
DC Tom Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 While I agree with the last sentence, the National Guard is not "our military." They're the states' militias, to be used at the governors' discretion (and not at the President's discretion until and unless federalized, at which point posse comitatus comes in to play). It's one of the reasons Katrina was such a damn mess - Bush couldn't commit the National Guard, and Blanco wouldn't. Also, the National Guard is usually intended to round out the non-combat functions of the combat brigades. So they encompass a lot of skills like...public affairs, or military police. I don't know who's being called out in Ferguson, but the odds are they're as qualified and trained for crowd control, if not more so, than the civilian police. Although I was able to confirm that the MO National Guard's command includes two batallions - 12 companies - of military police, which is a hell of a lot of cops, and the MO Guard's biggest single unit. It's probably some of them who were activated - I just heard on the radio that both MP batallions, roughly, will be active tonight. Also heard someone complaining about how the National Guard did nothing to prevent the deaths last night. Uh...what deaths? Of common sense?
tomato can Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 (edited) Bull. They should have had every National Guard troop in Missouri on those streets with an adequate supply of flexi-cuffs and the ROE to use them. They should have started stacking those !@#$ers up like cord wood and sending the message that the second you step over the line, you're going into custody and getting a record. None of this "catch and release" **** they did before. Put them in the tombs for a few days and let them feel what it's really like. The message should have been sent loudly and clearly that what happened in August wasn't happening again, under any circumstances. The "Hug-a-Thug" tactics opened them up to this mess and were started by the "leadership" of idiots like Jay Nixon and Claire McCaskill. They cut the police off at the knees and essentially declared open season on the citizenry of a town. This probably the only way to stop the riot chasers. It's their opportunity to fight with the police, engage in civil disobedience, vandalise, loot, arson, ect without really being detained and properly charged. Tear gas and rubber bullets apparently is not a good deterrent. Edited November 26, 2014 by tomato can
Azalin Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 And now this Pop quiz. Other than being a simpleton dolt from a corrupt organization and ridiculous country the size of Tennessee or whatever and then chastising America after he watched 5 minutes of MSNBC; what makes this guy an even bigger douche bag than all of those things combined? he's a dolphin fan?
Doc Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 That tells you all you need to know about her perspective. A "nanosecond by nanosecond" breakdown of a tense situation does not accurately reflect that situation - you get a HELL of a lot different answers in a protracted ex post facto analysis than you do judging the situation at the time from within the situation. The woman's not an authority on excessive case forces. She's an authority on sales. Did she really say "excessive case forces"? I couldn't get the video to play. Although I was able to confirm that the MO National Guard's command includes two batallions - 12 companies - of military police, which is a hell of a lot of cops, and the MO Guard's biggest single unit. It's probably some of them who were activated - I just heard on the radio that both MP batallions, roughly, will be active tonight. Also heard someone complaining about how the National Guard did nothing to prevent the deaths last night. Uh...what deaths? Of common sense? There was one death last night.
ExiledInIllinois Posted November 26, 2014 Posted November 26, 2014 The grand jury is the cornerstone of our judicial system. Their decisions have to be respected. That said, they made the right decision.
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