FireChan Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) If that's how it played out, you might be right. If the fan seemed threatening, you might be right. So let's suppose that was the case for a second. One has to ask, why is the #2 QB out that late, partying, that close to game day? I thought Johnny's excuse for all the problems he encountered during the offseason was, well, that it was offseason. Once the season starts, it's all business, right? Sure, he's an adult and gets to make those decisions. But he is also a guy who has experienced a lot of negative publicity for him, and his team, by using questionable judgement. How can one consider him a team player, and a team leader, if he continues to put himself into situations where there is an enhanced likelihood of attracting trouble? He is a celebrity---and not a reluctant one. He basks in the attention and profits from it. But it doesn't seem as though he can handle the issues that come with celebrity status. People approach celebrities, photo them, touch them and, yes, attempt to hug them. If he can't take it, I think the smart choice would be to stay private, party at home, play down his celebrity status, etc. Approaching someone, asking for a hug (if that happened), is NOT grounds for punching them. The only way a punch would have been acceptable is if the approach were CLEARLY threatening. It might not be fair that Johnny has to watch his step while in public, but it isn't particularly fair he gets paid what he does for his job. I'm not suggesting he is overpaid, but I am suggesting the job comes with its rewards, and drawbacks. Fan attention comes with the job, like it or not. In a way this reminds me of a time when by friend kept finding his teenage son with pot. It was in his drawer, he got caught with it in school, etc. Of course, he had to punish his son. The funny thing was, we smoked pot all the time when we were teenagers. We were smart enough, and discrete enough, to never get caught. Clearly his son isn't. He isn't really mad at the kid for smoking pot. He's mad because he keeps screwing up and getting caught. In a way, that's what makes Manziel different from others who may do the same thing. He just doesn't seem bright enough to be that arrogant. You can't defend yourself from battery? Since when? Anyway, I get what you're saying, but Manziel wouldn't even be a blip in the media 20 years ago. Sure he could tone it down, but I don't see the big deal. The report on Deadspin now says that the guy tried to grab Johnny, and got punched a buddy in Johnny's crew. Then, the hugger's brother came through and tackled Johnny, and Johnny punched him. The "victim" and his brother were also charged with tax evasion last year. Edited November 24, 2014 by FireChan
Nanker Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) No way, Peyton would fall down and curl up in the fecal position at the first sign of trouble. Edited November 24, 2014 by Nanker
Garranimal Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 That's where you just lie there like a turd? Exactly...i guess next time i need to include the (SIC) for the sense-of-humorless board members.
TheFunPolice Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 This greasy little punk makes my skin crawl I would rather sign EJ to a 10 year guaranteed contract that stated he could not be benched for any reason than cheer for Manziel
QCity Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 My guess is JFF is an amateur compared to Jim Kelly's younger days. Sucks for him to be born in the age of Twitter. Our HOFers were no angels. I'm pretty sure a few of them were paying rent on 2nd apartments in Fort Erie based on the amount of time they spent up there. I can't even imagine the 80s/early 90s stories if everyone was walking around carrying a video camera in their pocket. I don't know if we could upstage the Cowboys, but I bet it would be close. This is just what happens when you try to fill a 24 hr sports news cycle when there isn't 24 hrs worth of sports news.
K-9 Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 You can't defend yourself from battery? Since when? Anyway, I get what you're saying, but Manziel wouldn't even be a blip in the media 20 years ago. Sure he could tone it down, but I don't see the big deal. The big deal is that he has engaged in a pattern of behavior that is not attractive to NFL teams and thus isn't conducive to a long and successful career. While each incident may not be a big deal in and of itself, the incidents add up and teams have a low tolerance for the sheer repetitive aspect of those incidents. GO BILLS!!!
FireChan Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 The big deal is that he has engaged in a pattern of behavior that is not attractive to NFL teams and thus isn't conducive to a long and successful career. While each incident may not be a big deal in and of itself, the incidents add up and teams have a low tolerance for the sheer repetitive aspect of those incidents. GO BILLS!!! That's fine, and I get that. But it's not a big deal to me. These are the same teams that thought Russel Wilson's height was not conducive to a long and successful career.
Andrew Son Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 That's fine, and I get that. But it's not a big deal to me. These are the same teams that thought Russel Wilson's height was not conducive to a long and successful career. That would be a good comparison if, despite their concerns, Russell Wilson kept engaging in behavior that made him shorter
34-78-83 Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 I think the biggest deal about JF is that he thinks he has "arrived" and it's very clear that he hasn't, and has quite a long shot to even be a serviceable NFL player.
TheFunPolice Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 Little Johnny doesn't like to work, thinks he is God's gift to football, and acts like a spoiled, entitled little punk whose Daddy kept bailing him out of trouble.
K-9 Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) That's fine, and I get that. But it's not a big deal to me. These are the same teams that thought Russel Wilson's height was not conducive to a long and successful career. It's not a big deal to me, either. Johnny Manziel couldn't hold the jock of some of the guys that played a generation ago when it comes to partying. But it's a different world and, like it or not, players have to be smarter. He keeps it up, he'll be out of the league if he doesn't grow up. Especially if he can't win a starting job. I don't find the Russell Wilson comparison valid. His behavior was never in question, only his ability to function as a pocket passer in the league. GO BILLS!!! Edited November 24, 2014 by K-9
FireChan Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) It's not a big deal to me, either. Johnny Manziel couldn't hold the jock of some of the guys that played a generation ago when it comes to partying. But it's a different world and, like it or not, players have to be smarter. He keep it up, he'll be out of the league if he doesn't grow up. Especially if he can't win a starting job. I don't find the Russell Wilson comparison valid. His behavior was never in question, only his ability to function as a pocket passer in the league. GO BILLS!!! Well, I was merely making the point that NFL teams' standards do not always hold water as what is truly conducive to success. With Wilson it was height. With JFF it's his behavior. Edited November 24, 2014 by FireChan
SJDK Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 No way, Peyton would fall down and curl up in the fecal position at the first sign of trouble. the "fecal position"? Hmm.. A real turd furgeson
thebandit27 Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 Our HOFers were no angels. I'm pretty sure a few of them were paying rent on 2nd apartments in Fort Erie based on the amount of time they spent up there. I can't even imagine the 80s/early 90s stories if everyone was walking around carrying a video camera in their pocket. I don't know if we could upstage the Cowboys, but I bet it would be close. This is just what happens when you try to fill a 24 hr sports news cycle when there isn't 24 hrs worth of sports news. All of that may be true; the point is not what those guys did, the point is that EVERYONE is aware of the amount of exposure that celebrities get these days. Everyone, literally everyone has a camera phone...if you're out an about, and people know who you are, it's your responsibility not to give anyone any ammo. Right now, Manziel doesn't get that.
TheFunPolice Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 dip Ryan Leaf in a vat of vegetable oil, give him a rich daddy, and make him shorter and you have little Johnny.
YoloinOhio Posted November 24, 2014 Author Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) Well, I was merely making the point that NFL teams' standards do not always hold water as what is truly conducive to success. With Wilson it was height. With JFF it's his behavior. Unfortunately JFF has both to overcome. He went in the 1st because he was a supreme talent despite non-ideal NFL size at the position. The Browns can't wait to get him on the field. I don't think they love Hoyer. But BH has had more success than any other QB in a very long time. I think JM sees the field before the end of the season. Each week Hoyer is teetering because he hasn't gotten better, he's gotten worse. Probably because of the film accumulating. His drive for the winning FG yesterday though was very nice. Edited November 24, 2014 by YoloinOhio
1billsfan Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) I think the biggest deal about JF is that he thinks he has "arrived" and it's very clear that he hasn't, and has quite a long shot to even be a serviceable NFL player. That's the thing about QBs, you never know what you have until they play. It's kind of scary to think that the Bills might be a player for him if Manziel is shopped by the Browns. I just don't want the Bills starting QB to be a guy that everyone loves to hate with a passion. If the Bills got him, I could imagine that there would be Bills players in their own locker room that hate him, simply because he would no doubt suck up all the oxygen in the room while the rest of the team would be ignored. Manziel has that kind of media impact. All NFL players have egos, not just Manziel. I'd rather the Bills not trade for him and have them just draft another QB in the 2nd or 3rd round to compete with the vet QB and EJ Manuel. I don't remember any NFL team winning a Super Bowl with a "look at me," "drama" QB. Edited November 24, 2014 by 1billsfan
34-78-83 Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 (edited) That's the thing about QBs, you never know what you have until they play. It's kind of scary to think that the Bills might be a player for him if Manziel is shopped by the Browns. I just don't want the Bills starting QB to be a guy that everyone loves to hate with a passion. If the Bills got him, I could imagine that there would be Bills players in their own locker room that hate him, simply because he would no doubt suck up all the oxygen in the room while the rest of the team would be ignored. Manziel has that kind of media impact. All NFL players have egos, not just Manziel. I'd rather the Bills not trade for him and have them just draft another QB in the 2nd or 3rd round to compete with the vet QB and EJ Manuel. I don't remember any NFL team winning any Super Bowl with a "look at me," "drama" QB. Agreed.... I am also of the opinion though that he can't play. His "highlights" from college are improv plays to Mike Evans mostly. He'll come in and look good for a quarter or 2 until D's adjust. Kinda like when Vick came in off the bench. Edited November 24, 2014 by 34-78-83
K-9 Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 Well, I was merely making the point that NFL teams' standards do not always hold water as what is truly conducive to success. With Wilson it was height. With JFF it's his behavior. With Wilson, it was a physical limitation he had to prove didn't limit him in the pocket, which he wasted little time in proving. With Manziel, it's a pattern of behavior he has yet to show he's outgrown nearly seven months after being selected and three months after being beaten out for the starting job. If he keeps that up he may not get the opportunity to prove he's also a good pocket passer as well. Being a good pocket passer is conducive to success. Being chronically immature in the eyes of your employers is not. GO BILLS!!!
thebandit27 Posted November 24, 2014 Posted November 24, 2014 That's the thing about QBs, you never know what you have until they play. It's kind of scary to think that the Bills might be a player for him if Manziel is shopped by the Browns. I just don't want the Bills starting QB to be a guy that everyone loves to hate with a passion. If the Bills got him, I could imagine that there would be Bills players in their own locker room that hate him, simply because he would no doubt suck up all the oxygen in the room while the rest of the team would be ignored. Manziel has that kind of media impact. All NFL players have egos, not just Manziel. I'd rather the Bills not trade for him and have them just draft another QB in the 2nd or 3rd round to compete with the vet QB and EJ Manuel. I don't remember any NFL team winning a Super Bowl with a "look at me," "drama" QB. About the closest I can remember is Jim McMahon.
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