The Big Cat Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) Um, Marrone has an offensive background. If he was a defensive coach like Rex Ryan, he would get more credit. He's a major reason for using 4 Qbs. He bailed on the guy he drafted in the 1st round after 4 games for a career mediocre qb. That's all on him. He deserves a ton of blame for that. The best part of the team, defense, he has little to do with but hire the DC. I guess he gets some credit. You don't think the head coach with an offensive background has a huge say in the Qbs???? And Cleveland's situation at qb is very similar. Who cares what's happening in Cleveland? Do you think they'll beat us next week? Do you think they'll finish the season with a better record than us? I don't. And so because Marrone used to coach Drew Brees, Kyle Orton should...? By your own admission, you've said up and down on this board that Kyle Orton is, and always has been, !@#$ing lousy. How now is it Marrone's fault? Edited November 21, 2014 by The Big Cat
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 Who cares what's happening in Cleveland? Do you think they'll beat us next week? Do you think they'll finish the season with a better record than us? I don't. And so because Marrone used to coach Drew Brees, Kyle Orton should...? By your own admission, you've said up and down on this board that Kyle Orton is, and always has been, !@#$ing lousy. How now is it Marrone's fault? You're right. My bad. The coach who has an offensive background shouldn't be responsible for the Qb play on the team. He shouldn't be responsible for leaving Nate Freaking Hackett to be the OC and QB coach for his young qb. That's not poor decision making at all. Marrone is doing a great job. He is very innovative and creative. We are lucky to have him. the Buffalo Bills are just lucky to have a coach. Let's keep settling for boring football teams. We deserve it.
The Big Cat Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 You're right. My bad. The coach who has an offensive background shouldn't be responsible for the Qb play on the team. He shouldn't be responsible for leaving Nate Freaking Hackett to be the OC and QB coach for his young qb. That's not poor decision making at all. Marrone is doing a great job. He is very innovative and creative. We are lucky to have him. the Buffalo Bills are just lucky to have a coach. Let's keep settling for boring football teams. We deserve it. If you cram one salient point inside a bunch of horse **** sarcasm, it doesn't really make your case any more concrete. I will gladly concede that they entered 2013 with the wrong coaching formula to adequately engineer an offense. But that was like 18 months ago. Marrone has since admitted the error...AND done things to fix it. Are we also going to use this as an opportunity to B word about drafting Aaron Maybin?
NoSaint Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 And yet to make that point you've highlighted the sub-par talent they have at the most important position. Show me the coaches that win with quarterbacks as bad or worse than ours, please. And try not to stretch too far to tell me the situation in Arizona is analogous, please. Am I allowed to use someone like harbaugh with Alex smith, or even young guys getting hidden in a well run team like early Big Ben, or what rules are you going toss in when I give you an answer?
The Big Cat Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 Am I allowed to use someone like harbaugh with Alex smith, or even young guys getting hidden in a well run team like early Big Ben, or what rules are you going toss in when I give you an answer? Alex Smith is much, MUCH better than any QB we've had since Kelly. Ditto future Hall of Famer Big Ben. So there's that. Did you have any other QB's in mind? Or do they all come with top-5 defenses unlike what we have/had?
NoSaint Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) Alex Smith is much, MUCH better than any QB we've had since Kelly. Ditto future Hall of Famer Big Ben. So there's that. Did you have any other QB's in mind? Or do they all come with top-5 defenses unlike what we have/had? You got me - they are 6th in total yards per game- but 4th in yards per play, 3rd in takeaways, and for you 8th in points. Methinks our offensive woes don't help and it's still pretty stellar though. So what kind of qb situation am I allowed to use? Can't be a rookie that developed over his career, can't be a guy that's at best average in the league, can't be a team with a good defense, I'm assuming it can't be more than a decade old (which is agree it's a different league).... So you are demanding I find a coach that has taken a mediocre qb, not been able to develop him at all, and win without a top defense in order to further my point that I think marrone is probably ranked in the 20s right now? And I'm the unreasonable one? Edited November 21, 2014 by NoSaint
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 Alex Smith is much, MUCH better than any QB we've had since Kelly. Ditto future Hall of Famer Big Ben. So there's that. Did you have any other QB's in mind? Or do they all come with top-5 defenses unlike what we have/had? He was worse than EJ his first few years in the league. He was considered a bust until Harbaugh came there.
The Big Cat Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) You got me - they are 6th in total yards per game- but 4th in yards per play, 3rd in takeaways, and for you 8th in points. Methinks our offensive woes don't help and it's still pretty stellar though. So what kind of qb situation am I allowed to use? Can't be a rookie that developed over his career, can't be a guy that's no better than average in the league, can't be a team with a good defense, I'm assuming it can't be more than a decade old (which is agree it's a different league).... So you are demanding I find a coach that has taken a mediocre qb, not been able to develop him at all, and win without a top defense in order to further my point that I think marrone is probably ranked in the 20s right now? And I'm the unreasonable one? To wit, both QB's you named are better than ours AND they played with remarkable defenses. I didn't mean to nitpick on how good or bad or defense is. I'm honestly wondering if you can point to a team that's analogous to ours. He was worse than EJ his first few years in the league. He was considered a bust until Harbaugh came there. That was his seventh season. Edited November 21, 2014 by The Big Cat
reddogblitz Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 I will gladly concede that they entered 2013 with the wrong coaching formula to adequately engineer an offense. But that was like 18 months ago. Marrone has since admitted the error...AND done things to fix it. http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&offensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=TM&season=2014&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=2&d-447263-n=1 Then how come it's gotten worse? Last year we ended the year at #19 in total offense. Today we are at #25 and worst in red zone TD %..
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&offensiveStatisticCategory=GAME_STATS&conference=ALL&role=TM&season=2014&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=TOTAL_YARDS_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=2&d-447263-n=1 Then how come it's gotten worse? Last year we ended the year at #19 in total offense. Today we are at #25 and worst in red zone TD %.. Marrone has no input on Qbs or the offense. Duh.
The Big Cat Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 http://www.nfl.com/s...=2&d-447263-n=1 Then how come it's gotten worse? Last year we ended the year at #19 in total offense. Today we are at #25 and worst in red zone TD %.. That's an exceptionally valid question, but one that doesn't really make the point that the coaches are to blame considering they did more with less last year. If they could solve the red zone conundrum we wouldn't be having this conversation. They need...NEED to figure out what they do well in the redzone and !@#$ing stick to it. But the truth is, we haven't done ANYTHING well in the redzone. Pass, run, play action, it's all been a bust. You can't blame the guy for trying. At this point, it's worth being optimistic knowing we're running out of things to fail at!
NoSaint Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 To wit, both QB's you named are better than ours AND they played with remarkable defenses. I didn't mean to nitpick on how good or bad or defense is. I'm honestly wondering if you can point to a team that's analogous to ours. The tough thing here big cat is you are asking me to guess what qbs and defenses and everything else is analogous and not just have them be in the window discussed but over long stretches too and in a small window of time. Would year 1 Russell Wilson work? Much like early Big Ben or Alex smith with both harbaugh and Reid is worth discussion. Or a BB protecting a young Brady or getting to 11 wins with cassell. but you don't want to have a real discussion on it. If you had to rank marrone 1-32 what area does he fall for you? I'd say probably 20-25 of I had to throw a number at the wall? Not the worst but not in the top 15 (ie above average). Much like discussion on Stevie, fitz or chandler from discussions that swamped the board in the past
The Big Cat Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) The tough thing here big cat is you are asking me to guess what qbs and defenses and everything else is analogous and not just have them be in the window discussed but over long stretches too and in a small window of time. Would year 1 Russell Wilson work? Much like early Big Ben or Alex smith with both harbaugh and Reid is worth discussion. Or a BB protecting a young Brady or getting to 11 wins with cassell. but you don't want to have a real discussion on it. If you had to rank marrone 1-32 what area does he fall for you? I'd say probably 20-25 of I had to throw a number at the wall? Not the worst but not in the top 15 (ie above average). Much like discussion on Stevie, fitz or chandler from discussions that swamped the board in the past Yeah, pretty much. At best, 15th. At worst, 22nd. Better than Marrone Bruce Arians John Harbaugh John Fox Mike McCarthy Andy Reid Bill Belichick Sean Payton[N 6] Rex Ryan Chip Kelly Mike Tomlin Mike McCoy Jim Harbaugh Pete Carroll Jeff Fisher Worse than Marrone Mike Smith Lovie Smith Ken Whisenhunt Jay Gruden Tony Sparano Joe Philbin Mike Zimmer Jim Caldwell Gus Bradley Marc Trestman On Par with Marrone Ron Rivera Mike Pettine Bill O'Brien Jason Garrett Marvin Lewis Chuck Pagano Tom Coughlin Edited November 21, 2014 by The Big Cat
26CornerBlitz Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 (edited) Yeah, pretty much. At best, 15th. At worst, 23rd. Better than Marrone Bruce Arians John Harbaugh John Fox Mike McCarthy Andy Reid Bill Belichick Sean Payton[N 6] Rex Ryan Chip Kelly Mike Tomlin Mike McCoy Jim Harbaugh Pete Carroll Jeff Fisher Worse than Marrone Mike Smith Lovie Smith Ken Whisenhunt Jay Gruden Tony Sparano Joe Philbin Mike Zimmer Jim Caldwell Gus Bradley On Par with Marrone Ron Rivera Marc Trestman Mike Pettine Bill O'Brien Jason Garrett Marvin Lewis Chuck Pagano Tom Coughlin :lol: Marrone is as good of a coach as Coughlin who has multiple playoff appearances and two Lombardi trophies to his credit. Beyond ridiculous! Edited November 21, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 Yeah? You think honestly think it falls in his lap when the four quarterbacks...FOUR...FOUR !@#$ING QUARTERBACKS...running his offense over the last 26 games are average on their best days? Actually, I am not saying because of QB play at all. I agree with you that QB play could improve. Still, I think the OC is in over his head.
The Big Cat Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 :lol: Marrone is as good of a coach as Coughlin who has multiple playoff appearances and two Lombardi trophies to his credit. Beyond ridiculous! We're talking about what's happening right now. In 2014. The 2014 Giants are currently 3-7. Shall I compare Marrone to the corpse of Vince Lombardi, too? For argument's sake? Actually, I am not saying because of QB play at all. I agree with you that QB play could improve. Still, I think the OC is in over his head. I honestly don't understand what that means.
26CornerBlitz Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 We're talking about what's happening right now. In 2014. The 2014 Giants are currently 3-7. Shall I compare Marrone to the corpse of Vince Lombardi, too? For argument's sake? Coughlin would have this Bills team at 7-3 at least. In case you haven't noticed, he's very much alive. Meathead Marrone would have the Giants at 0-10.
Sisyphean Bills Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 I honestly don't understand what that means. It means that watching all-11 players on offense and what they are trying to do is highly unimpressive. That's coaching.
26CornerBlitz Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 Can't blame Coughlin The Giants are a mess but you're crazy to pin their struggles on Tom Coughlin, Adam Schein says.
C.Biscuit97 Posted November 21, 2014 Posted November 21, 2014 Yeah, pretty much. At best, 15th. At worst, 22nd. Better than Marrone Bruce Arians John Harbaugh John Fox Mike McCarthy Andy Reid Bill Belichick Sean Payton[N 6] Rex Ryan Chip Kelly Mike Tomlin Mike McCoy Jim Harbaugh Pete Carroll Jeff Fisher Worse than Marrone Mike Smith Lovie Smith Ken Whisenhunt Jay Gruden Tony Sparano Joe Philbin Mike Zimmer Jim Caldwell Gus Bradley Marc Trestman On Par with Marrone Ron Rivera Mike Pettine Bill O'Brien Jason Garrett Marvin Lewis Chuck Pagano Tom Coughlin No disrespect but this is one of the worst lists I have ever seen. Lewis has been to the playoffs multiple times and have the Bengals challenging for the division again. He's so much better than Marrone. Caldwell took over a bad team and has them in first. Better. Garrett finished 8-8 and has the Cowboys challenging for the top seat in the NFC. Better. Pagano has gone to the playoffs twice in 2 years and is winning the division again. I could argue a bunch of other guys too. Our roster is simply better than the Jags, Vikes (I'd rather have Zimmer and Turner than Marrone and Hackett). This list is laughably bad. Marrone's wife doesn't love him as much as you do. seriously, you sound crazy. Coughlin would have this Bills team at 7-3 at least. In case you haven't noticed, he's very much alive. Meathead Marrone would have the Giants at 0-10. Marrone went 7-6 at Syracuse. What the hell has Coughlin done???
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