Chuck Pagano and Mike Smith are worse than Marrone

[The Big Cat]

What exactly do you think marrone is exceptional at?

 

If he's not an oline guru, or offensive guru - do you find him to be exceptional at managing in game? Why is marrone the guy that you defend? What makes him the next great coach?

 

His ability to pick coordinators that look good if handed top 5 talent?

 

I see.

 

So he's either exceptional or he's microwaved cat vomit.

 

Don't fans have enough sensationalism shoved down their throats from the media?

 

Why must we circulate it ourselves!?

[NoSaint]

 

 

I see.

 

So he's either exceptional or he's microwaved cat vomit.

 

Don't fans have enough sensationalism shoved down their throats from the media?

 

Why must we circulate it ourselves!?

 

so we cant expect our coach to excel or be noteworthy at skills that translate into team performance?

 

im not saying he has to be the best at everything - but im curious what abilities would qualify as above average. right now, from what we can piece together it seems theres some bad, and some ok, but whats the really good thing that marrone brings to the table that we would potentially have a hard time replacing if we replaced him? i get that we dont get to see everything but it doesnt seem like hes excellent at anything currently.

 

im trying to give you an opportunity to make a case for marrone being better than an average hire if we were to contemplate switching directions. other than we wouldnt have to start over, or if you give him elite units in every phase hed have a good record -- i havent seen a lot of good reasons.

 

Edited November 20, 2014 by NoSaint

[FireChan]

 

 

so we cant expect our coach to excel or be noteworthy at skills that translate into team performance?

 

im not saying he has to be the best at everything - but im curious what abilities would qualify as above average. right now, from what we can piece together it seems theres some bad, and some ok, but whats the really good thing that marrone brings to the table that we would potentially have a hard time replacing if we replaced him? i get that we dont get to see everything but it doesnt seem like hes excellent at anything currently.

 

im trying to give you an opportunity to make a case for marrone being better than an average hire if we were to contemplate switching directions. other than we wouldnt have to start over, or if you give him elite units in every phase hed have a good record -- i havent seen a lot of good reasons.

 

Marrone is a good motivator. This team doesn't quit, or hang their heads. Look at the Detroit or Vikings games. Our offense couldn't execute, and we played like crap, but we were able to push those things aside to get the W.

[The Big Cat]

Marrone is a good motivator. This team doesn't quit, or hang their heads. Look at the Detroit or Vikings games. Our offense couldn't execute, and we played like crap, but we were able to push those things aside to get the W.

 

Yeah but still.

[C.Biscuit97]

I don't think Smith is a good coach but id take Pagano in a second.

 

Plus, neither Smith or Pagano were dumb enough to make the Syracuse OC a NFL OC and qb coach to develop a young qb.

 

Like Gailey and DCs, Marrone's choice of an OC will probably cost him his job.

 

 

 

Marrone is a good motivator. This team doesn't quit, or hang their heads. Look at the Detroit or Vikings games. Our offense couldn't execute, and we played like crap, but we were able to push those things aside to get the W.

 

Please. That says more about Detroit having one of the worst kickers in NFL history and Minnesota being awful.

 

Those were Jauron wins.

[The Big Cat]

I don't think Smith is a good coach but id take Pagano in a second.

 

Plus, neither Smith or Pagano were dumb enough to make the Syracuse OC a NFL OC and qb coach to develop a young qb.

 

Like Gailey and DCs, Marrone's choice of an OC will probably cost him his job.

 

 

 

Please. That says more about Detroit having one of the worst kickers in NFL history and Minnesota being awful.

 

Those were Jauron wins.

 

Did you have a stroke or something? When did you go from TSW's brightest ray of sunshine to its most cantankerous griper?

[NoSaint]

 

 

Marrone is a good motivator. This team doesn't quit, or hang their heads. Look at the Detroit or Vikings games. Our offense couldn't execute, and we played like crap, but we were able to push those things aside to get the W.

 

Maybe, i guess? even that i think is on the fence, and id guess youd put several guys ahead of him.

 

minnesotas biggest lead was 6.

Maybe detroit would count but down 14 with 44 minutes to go shouldnt have any team check out either.

 

i wouldnt argue it a weakness but i dont have the impression that anyones trying to run through a brick wall for him either. both those examples kind of clear the bar of "didnt experience inexcusable meltdowns."

 

 

 

Yeah but still.

 

so youre going with that hes above average at motivating his teams. anything else? since youve dug in so hard on the issue and are criticizing so many people for not being happy, im trying to give you an open platform to sing praises.

 

i suspect you realize hes probably in that group of average at best guys and are using that he isnt proven to be a dumpster fire yet to prove some point. hes not the worst out there. but i dont know how many are arguing that.

[FireChan]

I don't think Smith is a good coach but id take Pagano in a second.

 

Plus, neither Smith or Pagano were dumb enough to make the Syracuse OC a NFL OC and qb coach to develop a young qb.

 

Like Gailey and DCs, Marrone's choice of an OC will probably cost him his job.

 

 

 

Please. That says more about Detroit having one of the worst kickers in NFL history and Minnesota being awful.

 

Those were Jauron wins.

 

Please. You've hated Marrone since he benched EJ. A stance that I've seen 0 regulars take. You're hardly the voice of reason.

Edited November 20, 2014 by FireChan

[The Big Cat]

Maybe, i guess? even that i think is on the fence, and id guess youd put several guys ahead of him.

 

minnesotas biggest lead was 6.

Maybe detroit would count but down 14 with 44 minutes to go shouldnt have any team check out either.

 

i wouldnt argue it a weakness but i dont have the impression that anyones trying to run through a brick wall for him either. both those examples kind of clear the bar of "didnt experience inexcusable meltdowns."

 

 

 

so youre going with that hes above average at motivating his teams. anything else? since youve dug in so hard on the issue and are criticizing so many people for not being happy, im trying to give you an open platform to sing praises.

 

i suspect you realize hes probably in that group of average at best guys and are using that he isnt proven to be a dumpster fire yet to prove some point. hes not the worst out there. but i dont know how many are arguing that.

 

Well, you have your hunches, others have theirs. None of us have spent a second in a film room. We have no !@#$ing clue what the atmosphere in the coaching booth on gameday is like. If Orton audibles we have no way of knowing. And NOBODY can say with a straight face that execution has been flawless.

 

So...you know, putting the honus on US to prove that he's good? That's silly. There have been an AWFUL lot of assumptions made to determine he's bad.

 

Trust what your eyes tell you, fine. But don't profess to know they see the whole story. I certainly don't.

[FireChan]

 

 

Maybe, i guess? even that i think is on the fence, and id guess youd put several guys ahead of him.

 

minnesotas biggest lead was 6.

Maybe detroit would count but down 14 with 44 minutes to go shouldnt have any team check out either.

 

i wouldnt argue it a weakness but i dont have the impression that anyones trying to run through a brick wall for him either. both those examples kind of clear the bar of "didnt experience inexcusable meltdowns."

 

 

 

so youre going with that hes above average at motivating his teams. anything else? since youve dug in so hard on the issue and are criticizing so many people for not being happy, im trying to give you an open platform to sing praises.

 

i suspect you realize hes probably in that group of average at best guys and are using that he isnt proven to be a dumpster fire yet to prove some point. hes not the worst out there. but i dont know how many are arguing that.

 

Baby steps NoSaint. There's no point in diminishing the few bright spots. Our players play hard. That's a rarity for the Bills in the 21st century. Marrone is hardly the best motivator, but he's better than the crap we've been trotting out. I'll take that. Just like all we wanted was a QB better than Fitz. These lofty standards are a little unrealistic.

[C.Biscuit97]

 

 

Did you have a stroke or something? When did you go from TSW's brightest ray of sunshine to its most cantankerous griper?

 

Haha. I remember when we were the only ones defending Jauron. At least, Jauron got the most out of his talent. I don't think this coaching staff is.

 

I never liked the Hackett hire. I think he is solely where he is because of his dad. He ran boring offenses in college. I think offensive players have all regressed under this staff - Spiller, Glenn, Wood. The Urbik situation was a joke.

 

This should be a playoff team but it won't make it because of it's offense. I'm down apologize for subpar product. I liked the idea of Marrone at first because he was a college coach. But he hired his unqualified buddy and is no different than an old NFL coach. I'm ready for someone new.

 

 

 

Please. You've hated Marrone since he benched EJ. A stance that I've seen 0 regulars take. You're hardly the voice of reason.

 

 

Was I wrong? We benched a 2 year player at 2-2 for a 9 year vet who is a .500 qb. And guess what? We're .500 and our offense has scored 22 points in our two most important games.

 

Yeah, we should be throwing a parade for Marrone.

 

 

 

Baby steps NoSaint. There's no point in diminishing the few bright spots. Our players play hard. That's a rarity for the Bills in the 21st century. Marrone is hardly the best motivator, but he's better than the crap we've been trotting out. I'll take that. Just like all we wanted was a QB better than Fitz. These lofty standards are a little unrealistic.

 

What a load of crap. The team played hard for Jauron and Gailey. Their rosters weren't good enough. This team's roster was.

 

It figures you would defend Marrone and Hackett. Because only a crazy person would.

[FireChan]

 

 

Haha. I remember when we were the only ones defending Jauron. At least, Jauron got the most out of his talent. I don't think this coaching staff is.

 

I never liked the Hackett hire. I think he is solely where he is because of his dad. He ran boring offenses in college. I think offensive players have all regressed under this staff - Spiller, Glenn, Wood. The Urbik situation was a joke.

 

This should be a playoff team but it won't make it because of it's offense. I'm down apologize for subpar product. I liked the idea of Marrone at first because he was a college coach. But he hired his unqualified buddy and is no different than an old NFL coach. I'm ready for someone new.

 

 

 

 

Was I wrong? We benched a 2 year player at 2-2 for a 9 year vet who is a .500 qb. And guess what? We're .500 and our offense has scored 22 points in our two most important games.

 

Yeah, we should be throwing a parade for Marrone.

 

 

 

What a load of crap. The team played hard for Jauron and Gailey. Their rosters weren't good enough. This team's roster was.

 

It figures you would defend Marrone and Hackett. Because only a crazy person would.

 

This team played hard for Gailey? What?

 

And yes. You were wrong. Orton is still an upgrade over EJ any day of the week by anyone familiar with the game.

[NoSaint]

 

 

Baby steps NoSaint. There's no point in diminishing the few bright spots. Our players play hard. That's a rarity for the Bills in the 21st century. Marrone is hardly the best motivator, but he's better than the crap we've been trotting out. I'll take that. Just like all we wanted was a QB better than Fitz. These lofty standards are a little unrealistic.

 

i hear you, i just like the bright spots to be a little brighter. i guess my problem is i was on the fence when he was hired, and some of my "hopefully he follows through with...." things have kind of fallen by the wayside. im not saying there is no chance, but i think if marrone is going to have to change his stripes on some big stuff.

[The Big Cat]

i hear you, i just like the bright spots to be a little brighter. i guess my problem is i was on the fence when he was hired, and some of my "hopefully he follows through with...." things have kind of fallen by the wayside. im not saying there is no chance, but i think if marrone is going to have to change his stripes on some big stuff.

 

Except it's the redzone offense that's keeping us from being 7-3 right now. Everything else is working well enough for us to be...7-3.

 

SEVEN AND THREE.

 

We're a mere inches away from SEVEN AND THREE.

 

We're a Chandler/Brown double fumble from 6-4.

 

If it wasn't for the REDZONE OFFENSE, we'd have very VERY little to B word about.

[C.Biscuit97]

 

 

Except it's the redzone offense that's keeping us from being 7-3 right now. Everything else is working well enough for us to be...7-3.

 

SEVEN AND THREE.

 

We're a mere inches away from SEVEN AND THREE.

 

We're a Chandler/Brown double fumble from 6-4.

 

If it wasn't for the REDZONE OFFENSE, we'd have very VERY little to B word about.

 

The knock on Orton was he puts up passing yards but doesn't score tds. I posted that the second he was announced as a starter.

[ctk232]

This thread is ridiculous . . . is Marrone a great coach? Still too early to be seen. Is he the only coach on the staff coaching off. and def play calling? Nope. Is he the problem? Sure as hell not.

 

The issue, as so wonderfully stated by C.Biscuit97, is our RedZone offense and QB play. We saw production during consistent QB play from Orton. But there's a reason he has never been a starter in the NFL - plain and simple, he isn't reliable and can't make crucial throws. The same goes for the Sammy hate - I'm done hearing it. Most of Orton's throws to Sammy are off-target, behind him, and inaccurate. The argument could be made that Sammy has actually played more defense than offense under Orton. Granted they have connected for big plays, but the consistency that the WR, of any caliber, needs from his QB just isn't there.

 

We need an effin' QB who can manage the game, make consistent throws, be mobile to avoid rushes, quick decision making - and for god's sake SCORE. An improved OL couldn't hurt this cause either. Largest weaknesses on this team: 1. QB, 2. OL, 3. Secondary (sorry but it's true)

Edited November 20, 2014 by ctk232

[The Big Cat]

The knock on Orton was he puts up passing yards but doesn't score tds. I posted that the second he was announced as a starter.

 

So...then...how is that the coach's fault?

 

If we agree that it's not a poor offense, just a poor redzone offense and that that limitation is reflective of our QB's traits...then...how? How is that a coaching blunder?

[FireChan]

 

 

So...then...how is that the coach's fault?

 

If we agree that it's not a poor offense, just a poor redzone offense and that that limitation is reflective of our QB's traits...then...how? How is that a coaching blunder?

 

Because Biscuit believes we have a great QB on the bench.

[The Big Cat]

Because Biscuit believes we have a great QB on the bench.

 

The argument always begins with people like me asserting that our talent isn't good enough in the areas where people want to blame coaches. Then, if you hang around and challenge the play-calling-mob enough, eventually their thesis gets back to all the things the coach fails to do to account for our woeful lack of talent.

 

So, you know, they'll tell you it's the egg because the chicken is to blame.

[thewildrabbit]

Please. You've hated Marrone since he benched EJ. A stance that I've seen 0 regulars take. You're hardly the voice of reason.

I've hated on this "offensive" coaching staff from last years KC game, and I'm proud of it. Before that game I defended Hackett.

 

What did Jauron's teams in was an unbelievably amount of injuries every season, and bad choices for OC's...all three of them Schonert, AVP, Fairchild. None of those people have advanced in the NFL past QB coach, and two are no longer even in the NFL. Jaurons forte was defense, and his offenses were weak.

 

What did Gailey in was his choices for his DC's, both of them stunk and set both team & NFL records for being bad. Plus, his teams had a lot of injuries too. Gailey's forte was offense, and his defenses were weak.

 

 

Maroon has no excuse, as his offense is #27th in the NFL in his area of expertise, and his red zone offense is worst in the NFL in getting TD's. His O line is ranked the worst, and his players are grading as some of the worst. He, and his staff had no idea how to get Spiller in space. Don't know how best to utilize WR Mike Williams, and mostly has been inactive because special teams are "obviously" more important the scoring TD's. This Bills OC forces his offensive game plan right into the teeth of his opponents strengths. Its almost as if he is taking bribes from the other team to throw games, or is losing on purpose in order to get the HCing job.

 

Marrone's forte is offense, and is currently fielding one of the worst units in the league.

 

http://coacheshotseat.com/CoachesHotSeatRankingNFL.htm