Marangi Wants Manuel

[truth on hold]

If ej learned something from Orton on reading defenses and leadership in the huddle, that's all we could ask. Time to sit the .500 journeyman Orton and start the young guy with potential

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

No, I'm just bad at the internet.

 

 

Except that Jeff Tuel has started one NFL game, in which he was indisputably terrible, has not been involved in three game-winning drives in the fourth quarter or overtime, and was not selected with a first-round pick, you're right. Tuel and Manuel are exactly the same.

 

You can do better.

he's a non EJ fan. so be patient with the snarky remarks.

[freeagentqb]

I would dispute that tuel's start was terrible. It was pretty good for a rookie's first start, against a playoff team.

 

I agree, We put up a lot of yards in that game. If that int was a TD instead, he may be still starting.

[1billsfan]

No offense, but I despise your attitude. This is no way to build a winning team by declaring the season "over." Sure, we're not making the playoffs, and everyone knows it. But, I would sure hope that every member of the team still wants to win games from now until game 16. Maybe you don't care it EJ throws 15 interceptions. But, I'll bet it would be a pretty serious downer for him and every other member of the team. I have a hard time believing that making the rest of the season some experiment that does't include winning games does the team any good. Losing more games isn't going to make our team better next season. It's only going to make us losers.

 

Winning team? There are three games this year in which the Bills actually looked like a winning team…Bears, Dolphins 1st game, Jets. Two of those games were with EJ Manuel as the starter. I think you'd have an honest point were it not for the rest of the players on offense looking like crap. Why is EJ the only one that loses his job? Why do the rest of these shlubs get to start week in and week out playing pathetically? Manuel is currently no worse than Orton. Orton has become the definition of a sitting duck back there and teams are just teeing off on him. So there should be no delusions that this team is better with Orton because it should be clear that that ship has passed.

 

Start Manuel, a guy who can actually run away from defenders and you take advantage of these meaningless games by letting him loose and not restricting him with fear of reprisals when he throws interceptions. If I’m one of the defensive players, I welcome Manuel starting because I don’t want to push the decision back further and go into the 2015 season with a giant white elephant in the room if Manuel wins the starting QB spot. Players, coaches and fans all know that practice and preseason means nothing.

 

Back in 2004, the Giants had the Superbowl winning Kurt Warner as their starter, played him 10 games and then they benched him for Eli Manning for the last 6 or 7 games with their team being right in the thick of the playoff race. Yet Manning was given free reign to fail and he did so time and time again. He was 1-6 and threw 9 interceptions in those games. But he was able to learn something because he was allowed to fail. When you play conservative you are setting up your QB for failure because you and the player learn nothing and it eventually leads to changes because we all know that doesn’t work in this league. I honestly don’t care what the rest of the players think. They are losers in my book. Every game they needed to step up they folded. This team owes them nothing but a paycheck. This franchise needs to find out about EJ Manuel now and the players can take a walk if they don’t like it. I’m sure there were malcontents on the Giants, but that team is smart and knows that you don’t burn a top pick on a QB then proceed to hide from that decision like a scared little bunny rabbit. They had the balls to play Eli Manning and let him throw the ball down the field even though he looked like a disaster, because they knew that it was the only way to truly find out what they had. They didn’t go full Dick Jauron and kick the evaluation can down the road.

[BuffaloFan68]

I Start Orton against the Jets & if we win, then he earns another week. If he looks really good then he earns another week. If we lose & he doesn't look above average then the following week I start EJ to see what he's learned.

 

Interesting point - the more a QB plays in our system, the worse they get. Our offensive system is the common denominator.

[Rocky Landing]

Winning team? There are three games this year in which the Bills actually looked like a winning team…Bears, Dolphins 1st game, Jets. Two of those games were with EJ Manuel as the starter. I think you'd have an honest point were it not for the rest of the players on offense looking like crap. Why is EJ the only one that loses his job? Why do the rest of these shlubs get to start week in and week out playing pathetically? Manuel is currently no worse than Orton. Orton has become the definition of a sitting duck back there and teams are just teeing off on him. So there should be no delusions that this team is better with Orton because it should be clear that that ship has passed.

 

Start Manuel, a guy who can actually run away from defenders and you take advantage of these meaningless games by letting him loose and not restricting him with fear of reprisals when he throws interceptions. If I’m one of the defensive players, I welcome Manuel starting because I don’t want to push the decision back further and go into the 2015 season with a giant white elephant in the room if Manuel wins the starting QB spot. Players, coaches and fans all know that practice and preseason means nothing.

 

Back in 2004, the Giants had the Superbowl winning Kurt Warner as their starter, played him 10 games and then they benched him for Eli Manning for the last 6 or 7 games with their team being right in the thick of the playoff race. Yet Manning was given free reign to fail and he did so time and time again. He was 1-6 and threw 9 interceptions in those games. But he was able to learn something because he was allowed to fail. When you play conservative you are setting up your QB for failure because you and the player learn nothing and it eventually leads to changes because we all know that doesn’t work in this league. I honestly don’t care what the rest of the players think. They are losers in my book. Every game they needed to step up they folded. This team owes them nothing but a paycheck. This franchise needs to find out about EJ Manuel now and the players can take a walk if they don’t like it. I’m sure there were malcontents on the Giants, but that team is smart and knows that you don’t burn a top pick on a QB then proceed to hide from that decision like a scared little bunny rabbit. They had the balls to play Eli Manning and let him throw the ball down the field even though he looked like a disaster, because they knew that it was the only way to truly find out what they had. They didn’t go full Dick Jauron and kick the evaluation can down the road.

Who'e being dishonest here? The attitude I was refuting was one where fans, such as yourself, claim that the "season is over," "we may as well test (once again) EJ to evaluate him," "we have nothing to lose," etc. Now you're claiming that Orton is worse than EJ? Based on what, exactly? If you're going to argue that the rest of the games don't matter (you did), then support that claim. If you're going to make the argument that EJ gives us a better chance of winning now, then that is a very different argument. And, anyone who says that EJ is better than Orton is suffering from willful amnesia.

 

I've posited this question several times over the last couple days, and not gotten a single response: If a secret poll were conducted among the players on the roster, who do you think they would want starting next week? Sure, you "don't care what they think." I get that, and that's the biggest part of your attitude that I find the most objectionable. ("All losers???) But, if you think they don't have a pretty good idea of who is the better QB, well, I don't even know what to say to that.

 

Personally, I think the answer is obvious, and I'm just assuming that the players on our team don't share your defeatist attitude, and actually want to win games. And, for myself, I want to watch them win games, regardless if they're going to the playoffs. To me, the regular season doesn't end until week seventeen.

 

 

EDIT: I keep going back to your post and seeing other little obnoxious statements! "...the players on offense looking like crap." ??? Tell that to Fred Jackson. Or Chris Hogan who has vastly exceeded people's expectations. What about Sammy Watkins? Seantrel Henderson? And there are five games (not three) in which we "looked like a winning team"-- those would be the ones we won.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Rocky Landing

[1billsfan]

Who'e being dishonest here? The attitude I was refuting was one where fans, such as yourself, claim that the "season is over," "we may as well test (once again) EJ to evaluate him," "we have nothing to lose," etc. Now you're claiming that Orton is worse than EJ? Based on what, exactly? If you're going to argue that the rest of the games don't matter (you did), then support that claim. If you're going to make the argument that EJ gives us a better chance of winning now, then that is a very different argument. And, anyone who says that EJ is better than Orton is suffering from willful amnesia.

 

I've posited this question several times over the last couple days, and not gotten a single response: If a secret poll were conducted among the players on the roster, who do you think they would want starting next week? Sure, you "don't care what they think." I get that, and that's the biggest part of your attitude that I find the most objectionable. ("All losers???) But, if you think they don't have a pretty good idea of who is the better QB, well, I don't even know what to say to that.

 

Personally, I think the answer is obvious, and I'm just assuming that the players on our team don't share your defeatist attitude, and actually want to win games. And, for myself, I want to watch them win games, regardless if they're going to the playoffs. To me, the regular season doesn't end until week seventeen.

 

 

EDIT: I keep going back to your post and seeing other little obnoxious statements! "...the players on offense looking like crap." ??? Tell that to Fred Jackson. Or Chris Hogan who has vastly exceeded people's expectations. What about Sammy Watkins? Seantrel Henderson? And there are five games (not three) in which we "looked like a winning team"-- those would be the ones we won.

 

I said EJ was no worse than Orton and this is based on watching Orton the last couple of games. When you have two QBs that are at the same level of poor production, you go with the athletic 24 year old QB you spent a 14th overall pick only two years ago over the 32 year old rent-a-journeyman who has lead feet and is playing to collect a paycheck way more than he’s playing for any love of the game.

 

The players on the Bills forfeited any pretensions that they actually want to win games based on how they played when it counted most. This season is over and the rest of these games should be about the decision of who will be the Bills starting QB in the 2015 season.

 

You can’t live in a make believe fairyland were the Bills win 5 of the next 6 games with dead legs Orton starting. I actually think the better chance of them going on a run like that is firing Hackett and letting Manuel run the spread option. That’s beside the point however, the main point is that you have to make important decisions and the biggest one is deciding whether this team needs to trade for Manziel or make a major move on the top free agent QB out there. You can’t make that decision before you know what you have with Manuel. Because if you cut Manuel loose and he flourishes with another team like the Eagles, and Manziel sucks then you will have thrown another “lost decade” on the fire.

Edited November 16, 2014 by 1billsfan

[Best Player Available]

he's a non EJ fan. so be patient with the snarky remarks.

besides you describe exactly what a EJ fan is? You know someone other than a crusader with really nothing to crusade for. other than another busted pick by ole Buddy Nix.

A few weeks on the bench, Did EJ magically learn how to accurately throw a ball past his first telescoped read? Doubtful.

Edited November 16, 2014 by Best Player Available

[PolishDave]

I'm with Marangi on this. The team needs to know whether EJ can play or not, and has a chance to find out. Keeping Orton in makes no sense; the Bills are just as likely (that is, not likely) to run the table with EJ as with KO.

They found that out in the first few games this season. They decided "NO" when he played that pathetic game in Houston.

[The Bunk]

Now folks want EJ back? lol okay. Be careful what you wish for, when he gets Watkins killed as EJ cluelessly leads him into a heat seeking missile known as a safety don't come back here calling for Orton again.

[GunnerBill]

Interesting point - the more a QB plays in our system, the worse they get. Our offensive system is the common denominator.

 

Yep - EJ by the time he was pulled was going backwards. Thad Lewis went backwards to the point they had to cut him and then Orton has got worse the more he has played leading to a pathetic display in Miami. Our OC is useless.

[C.Biscuit97]

 

They found that out in the first few games this season. They decided "NO" when he played that pathetic game in Houston.

 

As pathetic as that game was, we scored double the amount of tds as Orton has led us to in 2 weeks!

 

The myth that Orton is a better option is hilarious. Marrone might be the worse coach inthe NFL and is trying to save his job. He's too stubborn to admit he was wrong and doesn't care about the long term future of this team.

 

If he was consistent, Orton would be benched because these past 2 games were as bad as EJ's 2 games that got him benched. Only difference is we actually scored tds in EJ's game.

[PolishDave]

As pathetic as that game was, we scored double the amount of tds as Orton has led us to in 2 weeks!

 

The myth that Orton is a better option is hilarious. Marrone might be the worse coach in the NFL and is trying to save his job. He's too stubborn to admit he was wrong and doesn't care about the long term future of this team.

 

If he was consistent, Orton would be benched because these past 2 games were as bad as EJ's 2 games that got him benched. Only difference is we actually scored tds in EJ's game.

I disagree that Orton's last two games were as bad as EJ's last 2. Ej seemed to overlook open receivers repeatedly. That led him to make bad decisions with the football and the team sucked as a result. Orton isn't doing that.

 

I don't think Orton is anything great, but in my opinion, he gives you a much better chance to win and much more confidence going into a game.

[C.Biscuit97]

 

I disagree that Orton's last two games were as bad as EJ's last 2. Ej seemed to overlook open receivers repeatedly. That led him to make bad decisions with the football and the team sucked as a result. Orton isn't doing that.

 

I don't think Orton is anything great, but in my opinion, he gives you a much better chance to win and much more confidence going into a game.

 

I guess agree to disagree. The knock I heard on Orton from Denver fans was he gets passing yards but not touchdowns. Well, that certainly has been proven.

 

And if Orton was the 2nd year guy, I'd be more patient. But minus a freak Jets game, we are scoring less with a 9 year vet than the 2 year qb he replaced.

 

I'm no expert but I think points help you win more games. Marrone is an idiot.

[FireChan]

 

 

I guess agree to disagree. The knock I heard on Orton from Denver fans was he gets passing yards but not touchdowns. Well, that certainly has been proven.

 

And if Orton was the 2nd year guy, I'd be more patient. But minus a freak Jets game, we are scoring less with a 9 year vet than the 2 year qb he replaced.

 

I'm no expert but I think points help you win more games. Marrone is an idiot.

 

We are also playing better defenses. Carry on.

[Fan in Chicago]

I disagree that Orton's last two games were as bad as EJ's last 2. Ej seemed to overlook open receivers repeatedly. That led him to make bad decisions with the football and the team sucked as a result. Orton isn't doing that.

 

I don't think Orton is anything great, but in my opinion, he gives you a much better chance to win and much more confidence going into a game.

 

The O is producing less with Orton at the helm. Both QBs were leading an anemic offense. Orton just looks good doing it - more composed, more calm and has swagger but ends up with the same sucky offensive performance.

[Best Player Available]

The O is producing less with Orton at the helm. Both QBs were leading an anemic offense. Orton just looks good doing it - more composed, more calm and has swagger but ends up with the same sucky offensive performance.

All true, but don't think for a second the receivers aren't now less fearful of getting decapitated with Orton in there. By now someone would have been on IR if EJ was still attempting to throw to them.

[C.Biscuit97]

 

 

We are also playing better defenses. Carry on.

 

And we scored more Points when Manuel was the qb against Miami. Keep trying to arguing when you're wrong.

[FireChan]

And we scored more Points when Manuel was the qb against Miami. Keep trying to arguing when you're wrong.

 

One game sample size? Bold move.

 

Manuel played #28. #26, #12, and #2. Orton has played #1, #2, #6, #8, #9, #16.

 

And unless EJ was blocking for CJ Spiller, we can hardly award him for that return TD, right? Or the 3 turnovers that helped Manuel limp us to 23 points against Chicago? But sure, you can knock out the Jets game because of "turnovers" but not for your boy.

 

But other than that, your points make sense.

Edited November 16, 2014 by FireChan

[C.Biscuit97]

 

 

One game sample size? Bold move.

 

You mean their one common opponent? Yeah, it's crazy to compare that.