Orton Not the Answer

[TSOL]

 

 

> The book is written on Orton, its still yet to be written on EJ.

 

The first few chapters of EJ's book have been written. He lacks throwing accuracy (a poor man's Fitzpatrick), almost always looks for the check-down (Trent Edwards), can't process information quickly (Losman), and lacks pocket awareness (a hint of Rob Johnson). You could say, give him time to develop, maybe he'll improve. Except that he didn't display strength in any of those areas back in college. The idea that he'll drastically improve is based on a triumph of hope over disciplined thinking.

 

 

EJ is almost as good as Orton right now. After playing only a handful of games. EJ's the kind of guy that the more reps he gets, the better he gets. Now look at the rest of our schedule and ask yourself which games Orton would win and which games EJ would win. If you come up with a big difference in the amout of games youre kidding yourself. its the same amount of games. Orton gave us a mini 3 game thrill there so i understand how some win starved Bills fans would hop on board with his bandwagon, but at the end of the year the wins loss difference will be negligable.

 

Orton is toast. Develop the kid.

 

 

How quickly people forget there was a freaking locker room mutiny about to happen if EJ started another game.

 

Unless he won the next game, then it wouldve been a tremendous bonding experience for a young squad learning to win together

 

The EJ sucks crowd really just projects its lack of vision

Edited November 11, 2014 by mastershake

[thewildrabbit]

Why are so many forgetting how bad that O line really is, and how Orton managed to get rid of the ball quickly many, many times rather then take a sack. That was the #1 pass defense in the NFL that the Bills OC had him throw 48 times against.

 

The guy realizes what he has for surrounding players, and is trying to do the best he can regardless. Perhaps the Chiefs didn't exploit the Bills O line interior, But I'd think the Dolphins will surely try.

 

This is the exact same Orton who played against the Jets last week only the team didn't get 6 turnovers this week. The team had trouble moving the ball, and scoring against the Jets defense too. Only 3 out of 13 drives were successful, and 44 series went for negative yardage. The red zone offense stunk long before Orton became the starter.

 

A journeyman QB can only overcome so much ineptitude by the coaches.

[Solomon Grundy]

 

 

 

EJ is almost as good as Orton right now. After playing only a handful of games. EJ's the kind of guy that the more reps he gets, the better he gets. Now look at the rest of our schedule and ask yourself which games Orton would win and which games EJ would win. If you come up with a big difference in the amout of games youre kidding yourself. its the same amount of games. Orton gave us a mini 3 game thrill there so i understand how some win starved Bills fans would hop on board with his bandwagon, but at the end of the year the wins loss difference will be negligable.

 

Orton is toast. Develop the kid.

 

 

 

Unless he won the next game, then it wouldve been a tremendous bonding experience for a young squad learning to win together

 

The EJ sucks crowd really just projects its lack of vision

 

I am a EJ Manuel fan! I say play Orton until we are out of the playoff picture then insert EJ. This way EJ can come back and play without the added pressure allowing him to " just sling it"

[Orton's Arm]

EJ is almost as good as Orton right now. After playing only a handful of games. EJ's the kind of guy that the more reps he gets, the better he gets. Now look at the rest of our schedule and ask yourself which games Orton would win and which games EJ would win. If you come up with a big difference in the amout of games youre kidding yourself. its the same amount of games. Orton gave us a mini 3 game thrill there so i understand how some win starved Bills fans would hop on board with his bandwagon, but at the end of the year the wins loss difference will be negligable.

 

Orton is toast. Develop the kid.

 

 

 

Unless he won the next game, then it wouldve been a tremendous bonding experience for a young squad learning to win together

 

The EJ sucks crowd really just projects its lack of vision

 

> EJ is almost as good as Orton right now.

 

This is not true. In 2014, Manuel averaged 2.13 air yards per attempt. Orton's average for the year is 4.51--over double Manuel's. During his four starts, Manuel threw a lot of short, very easy passes. Some of which resulted in great yards after the catch (YAC). In 2014, 2/3 of Manuel's total passing yardage came from YAC; with the other third from air yards. Conversely, over 60% of Orton's total passing yardage has been from air yards. With Orton, the Bills have a real QB. Not a top-10 QB, perhaps, but still a credible starter. "Credible starter" is not a phrase I'd use to describe E.J. Manuel, either now or in the future.

 

> After playing only a handful of games. EJ's the kind of guy that the more reps he gets, the better he gets.

 

If that's the case, why was he no better in the first four games of this season than he was last season?

[Rob's House]

I am a EJ Manuel fan! I say play Orton until we are out of the playoff picture then insert EJ. This way EJ can come back and play without the added pressure allowing him to " just sling it"

 

You're getting Mastershake all hot and bothered with that talk.

[Dorkington]

Once we are out of the playoff hunt, I'm totally on board with EJ getting starting reps.

[phypon]

Once we are out of the playoff hunt, I'm totally on board with EJ getting starting reps.

 

Once we are out of the playoff hunt I'm all for this staff being canned. "(s) Ain't Doug" style ;-)

[TSOL]

 

 

> EJ is almost as good as Orton right now.

 

This is not true. In 2014, Manuel averaged 2.13 air yards per attempt. Orton's average for the year is 4.51--over double Manuel's. During his four starts, Manuel threw a lot of short, very easy passes. Some of which resulted in great yards after the catch (YAC). In 2014, 2/3 of Manuel's total passing yardage came from YAC; with the other third from air yards. Conversely, over 60% of Orton's total passing yardage has been from air yards. With Orton, the Bills have a real QB. Not a top-10 QB, perhaps, but still a credible starter. "Credible starter" is not a phrase I'd use to describe E.J. Manuel, either now or in the future.

 

> After playing only a handful of games. EJ's the kind of guy that the more reps he gets, the better he gets.

 

If that's the case, why was he no better in the first four games of this season than he was last season?

 

EJ is .500 this season, Orton? Again, how many of these last 7 games do you really see him winning for us. You know hes a .500 guy, its undeniable. Why waste our time on him.

 

 

 

 

You're getting Mastershake all hot and bothered with that talk.

 

Dude, when you grow up, in about 20 years, and can compose an original thought of your own, maybe you and i can talk football.

 

But its a big maybe.

Edited November 11, 2014 by mastershake

[Whack 'Em Williams]

What other option do we have at this point? Extreme Justice has failed at pulling the trigger when he sees open receivers. Hard to play football and win if you don't ever pass and have two running plays up the middle. Orton offers us a chance.. That's all we can ask for.

 

Orton sees fires, EJ sees thinks dumps.

Dumps don't win, Fire can burn holes.

[Rob's House]

EJ is .500 this season, Orton? Again, how many of these last 7 games do you really see him winning for us. You know hes a .500 guy, its undenyable. Why waste our time on him.

 

 

 

 

Dude, when you grow up, in about 20 years, and can compose an original thought of your own, maybe you and i can talk football.

 

But its a big maybe.

 

Maybe by that time you'll "develop" (used your favorite word there) a sense of humor.

 

And I don't really care to talk football with you. There's a reason why the only person on the board who agrees with you is Bills Fan 4 Ever. You're like comic relief that isn't funny. Just someone who says ridiculous things for others to argue with. And I find it highly patronizing and borderline offensive the way you keep referring to EJ Manuel as "the kid." Might as well just call him "boy" while you're at it. He's a grown man and a professional football player, not some piss ant kid on the playground.

[TSOL]

Im not tryin to get into it with you. Just getting my point across on why i think its stupid to play Orton this year.

 

But that was kick ass

[JC2002]

Orton was off yesterday but considering he was on fire to start and then the ridiculous drops it was just crazy .

 

This team is learning how to win and it would have been fantastic if Orton could have pulled us from the fire for a 3rd time but in close games you simply can't muff a punt in a 3pt game in the 4th and you cant want to be a back in the NFL and fumble out the back of the red zone AGAINST GOOD TEAMS . The first rule of being a good football team is to not beat yourself .

 

Orton right now is the answer because hes put us position to where we get to see players in position to make plays that can help us win football games and we are seeing a lot of warts as a result. Ortons long term viability has always in my eyes been dependent on us getting to playoffs.

[Orton's Arm]

Once we are out of the playoff hunt, I'm totally on board with EJ getting starting reps.

 

How would you explain that to the players? These guys make enormous physical sacrifices. They play through pain. Watkins' playing through broken ribs is a good example of that. They're told the reason for all this sacrifice is because winning matters above all else.

 

Suppose that a few weeks from now, Marrone walks into the locker room and announces that Manuel is now the starter. The receivers will know--at least intuitively--that Manuel is much less likely to throw them the ball downfield. They'll realize that except on very rare occasions, they'll be getting the ball on dump-offs only. Or, if the ball is thrown downfield, there's an excellent chance it will be a widow maker type pass. This implies that the coaches would be requiring an even greater level of sacrifice from our WRs, while at the same time deliberately reducing the team's chance of winning. The effect this would have on morale would be less than stellar, especially among the Bills' WR corps.

 

Maybe you care about morale in the locker room, and maybe you don't. But a number of excellent Bills' players are nearing the ends of their contracts. Players like Hughes. The more head-scratching moves the front office or coaching staff make, the harder it becomes to retain players like that.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Orton's Arm

[C.Biscuit97]

Orton is exactly as advertised. He gets decent passing yards and doesn't score tds. It's what he did in Chicago and it's what he did in Denver. It's why he's on his 5th team. He is a great backup and an average at best NFL starter.

 

He isn't the problem. It's the offensive coaches who select a QB in the 1st round and give up on him because they can't develop him. They tried a quick fix because they aren't good enough coaches and the journeyman isn't good enough.

 

The worst part is we have a defense that could win a SB.

[rumblefish]

he may not be the answer, time tells all, but on the other hand things could be worst , we could be in the same boat as Jet and Giant fans, no hope at all, play the games and roll the dice, we remember 2-14 with no hope, no plan, no joy, yes there is a light at the end of he tunnel, and t's not a Mac Truck....