Rubes Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 One thing to keep in mind, though, is Orton's history. He was thrown into the fire his rookie year after Grossman was injured. He didn't do so well or look so good, even though the team won and went to the playoffs - he had the lowest QB rating in the league. The Bears were so impressed they demoted him to 3rd string for the next 2 years behind Rex Grossman and Brian Griese, and when he finally got the chance to start again in his 4th season, the Bears were so impressed they sold the house, the furniture, and Orton to obtain Cutler. This is spot on, really. I remember watching Orton his first few years in the league -- my brother-in-law is a Bears fan and season ticket holder, so we're both up on each other's teams -- and he was bad. Really bad. He certainly seemed to find something those couple of years in Denver, but while he was in Chicago he was nearly unwatchable. Like you said, though, I'm not taking anything away from his current play. He's doing well, and I hope he continues it, of course. But I don't see him as a long-term solution.
JC2002 Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 Puzzled by this - Jay Cutler was in Denver and Chicago Fans had no chance to crush on him until the Bears FO swapped Orton and a handful of draft picks (2 1sts and a 3rd) for Cutler. I'm happy as any Bills fan should be at the QB play this game. I can even go with the "don't mind a couple of sacks, provided the ball is protected" camp. One thing to keep in mind, though, is Orton's history. He was thrown into the fire his rookie year after Grossman was injured. He didn't do so well or look so good, even though the team won and went to the playoffs - he had the lowest QB rating in the league. The Bears were so impressed they demoted him to 3rd string for the next 2 years behind Rex Grossman and Brian Griese, and when he finally got the chance to start again in his 4th season, the Bears were so impressed they sold the house, the furniture, and Orton to obtain Cutler. Please don't misinterpret- I'm not trying to take a thing away from Orton's current play, and I hope it continues! Just bear in mind that it's NOT simply "wrong place wrong time". The Bears did not have that much "man crush" on Grossman or Griese, Orton simply couldn't beat them out his 2nd or 3rd year. He looked like you'd expect a guy who played 14 games and had the lowest QB rating in the league to look. Orton had a significant chance to start early on in his career, on a team that would have been happy to anoint him a starter, and wasn't able to take advantage of it AT THAT TIME. If he continues to do well here, it will be an example of a QB who needed time to develop, got it, developed, and then found a team willing to give him a shot, not a guy who always had the goods and never caught a break. Which is a story worth bearing in mind for those who want to declare EJ irretrievably broken and a bust after 16 games. Orton was never given the chance because they had Grossman . To say the Bears would have went away from Grossman is just not true . Once the bears discovered they had a top 5 defense and special team and running game after not having been relevant for a long time . They were not going to spend time developing Orton and especially starting a qb competition when they had a 1st rd qb who was coming back off injury . Lets keep in mind that Orton was a SHOTGUN passer a bigtime one at that coming out of Purdue but back then shotgun qbs were not as in style as they are now . The Bears were a I formation team who referred to themselves as getting off the bus running so it shouldn't be a surprise that Orton struggled his rookie year as the Bears didn't change anything . They basically forced Orton to learn a whole new style of play. Once Grossman was back from injury Orton didnt get any reps outside of scout team until 2007 and didn't get a chance to compete for the job in the offseason until 2008 which he then won the job . You say he was demoted but in reality he was always the 3rd string guy in the bears eyes holding the spot until the starter came back his rookie year. Ej was in a situation where he had an entire offense built around things he presumably did well . The comparison just is not there
Dorkington Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 (edited) 7th in completion percentage 6th in yards per attempt 2nd in longest pass 6th in QB rating 9th in yards per game 4th in TD % 13th in INT% (13th best) 7th in PFR's Adjusted Yards Per Attempt 12th in PFR's Adjusted Net Yards Per Attempt 2nd-T 4th Q comebacks 3rd-T Game Winning Drives Pretty good stuff BUT, for those of you who need negativity... 28th in QBR 33rd in Sack Percentage Edited October 28, 2014 by Dorkington
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 This is all i have to say: Kyle Orton 10/17, 238 yards, 4 TDs, 142.9 QB rating. Its a shame billsfan4life wont show his face for a week now. Shouldnt be that way - we all root for the same team. oh come on booboo I've been on and you know it. if you insist he had what 2 or 3 short field possessions Jets 40 to 50 w/o points?? Two others for 2 FG's 20 pts off 6 turnovers could have been 42 3rd-T Game Winning Drives which is nice.... but if they had the lead these game saving drives wouldn't be needed. that goes for ANY QB.
bigK14094 Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 Add Alpha and CB97 to that list too. Orton is doing this with no camps and no first team reps before his first start. Two weeks of practice should help him and the offense improve even more. Unfortunately, I don't anticipate Hackett's love for inside zone runs to diminish over that time. Actually, the bills are off this week after watching film today. So, only a standard week of practice before the KC game. Of course, the coaches will be working, and getting game plan ready. Might even be working the Miami game plan.....as they will only have 4 days to prepare for that baby. If I were HC, I would be doing that as well. Prep time is critical, get your head in the right place and the good game plan will follow.
Dorkington Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 (edited) 20 point victories, not good enough for "BillsFan-4-Ever" Peyton Manning, 38 game winning drives, sucks because he wasn't up to begin with. Edited October 28, 2014 by Dorkington
dayman Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 Orton is just what the doctor ordered for this franchise. We finally have a good roster, and now we have a drunken, above-average, crazy-man QB who throws the rock deep. Perfect.
Dorkington Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 (edited) Actually, the bills are off this week after watching film today. So, only a standard week of practice before the KC game. Of course, the coaches will be working, and getting game plan ready. Might even be working the Miami game plan.....as they will only have 4 days to prepare for that baby. If I were HC, I would be doing that as well. Prep time is critical, get your head in the right place and the good game plan will follow. I'd rather them solely work on KC. We've played Miami, doing research on them will be mostly about what adjustments they've made. Edited October 28, 2014 by Dorkington
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 20 point victories, not good enough for "BillsFan-4-Ever" Peyton Manning, 38 game winning drives, sucks because he wasn't up to begin with. 43 points may not be good enough against the Putrids or Bronco's I said I was happy for the win. There is much to worry about with the O. If people choose to ignore that fact then you will be in a world of hurt when that issue bites them in the I wasn't happy with four 3 and outs in the 3rd QTR where teams are supposed to make adjustments and the NYETS brought the game to a 7 points difference
Dorkington Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 Good thing we scored 6 points and they scored 0 points in the 3rd quarter then.
hondo in seattle Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 Puzzled by this - Jay Cutler was in Denver and Chicago Fans had no chance to crush on him until the Bears FO swapped Orton and a handful of draft picks (2 1sts and a 3rd) for Cutler. I'm happy as any Bills fan should be at the QB play this game. I can even go with the "don't mind a couple of sacks, provided the ball is protected" camp. One thing to keep in mind, though, is Orton's history. He was thrown into the fire his rookie year after Grossman was injured. He didn't do so well or look so good, even though the team won and went to the playoffs - he had the lowest QB rating in the league. The Bears were so impressed they demoted him to 3rd string for the next 2 years behind Rex Grossman and Brian Griese, and when he finally got the chance to start again in his 4th season, the Bears were so impressed they sold the house, the furniture, and Orton to obtain Cutler. Please don't misinterpret- I'm not trying to take a thing away from Orton's current play, and I hope it continues! Just bear in mind that it's NOT simply "wrong place wrong time". The Bears did not have that much "man crush" on Grossman or Griese, Orton simply couldn't beat them out his 2nd or 3rd year. He looked like you'd expect a guy who played 14 games and had the lowest QB rating in the league to look. Orton had a significant chance to start early on in his career, on a team that would have been happy to anoint him a starter, and wasn't able to take advantage of it AT THAT TIME. If he continues to do well here, it will be an example of a QB who needed time to develop, got it, developed, and then found a team willing to give him a shot, not a guy who always had the goods and never caught a break. Which is a story worth bearing in mind for those who want to declare EJ irretrievably broken and a bust after 16 games. Good post. If you look at Orton's stats over the years, although there are some ups-and-downs, it's clear that he got better with time. His last year starting for Chicago was far better than his first. His stats with Denver were far better than his stats with Chicago. In limited action, his stats in Dallas were better yet. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/O/OrtoKy00.htm I hope all this suggests two things: (1) Orton's good start with the Bills is not an aberration. He'll continue to perform well with us. Hopefully, he gets even better as he masters Hackett's offense. (2) EJ might still turn into a good starter someday.
eball Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 BUT, for those of you who need negativity... 28th in QBR 33rd in Sack Percentage The QBR is down because of the sacks, fumbles, and lack of running ability...factors not considered in the traditional QB rating.
Dorkington Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 It's plainly obvious how big of a factor sack percentage is in ESPN's QBR, due to Kyle's overwhelmingly positive numbers in just about every other area of play. I'd like to blame the OL, but EJ's sack rate is about 6 points lower, and in the middle of the pack for the league...
machine gun kelly Posted October 28, 2014 Posted October 28, 2014 Guys- I taped the NFL rewind Bills game and just fun to watch. I wish they would keep to an hour vs. 1/2 hour as they skipped some nice sacks on our defense. Man it was great to see some of those deep passes to Watkins, etc. He's not Brady, but I'll take him. If he gets time to gel with the WR, this is what we've been waiting for Ina durable QB. I bet he'll love being the man, and if he plays well through the rest of the year, and starts well next year, we extend him at a decent price. He'll never garner big money, but we can win with him. You know damn well if we had him in Houston, this team would be 6-2 right now, going into a softer part of the season for four weeks. I'm not saying the Chiefs or Browns are easy, but they aren't the Broncos.
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