Fire Hackett

[freeagentqb]

I think it's ok to be conservative and run the ball frequently at times but what is maddening is running the same GD play everytime with the samr GD result. Hackett looks like an idiot and I was embarrassed with the repetitive play calling. Fine, if you must keep running, please vary the play call. As others have stated, run some sweeps, pitchouts, reverses or anything including a QB sneak. To me, it feels like we're kneeling down on 1st and 2nd down and leaving a lot of yardage on the field and putting us in a 3rd down hole. MIX IT UP SOME HACKETT, PLEASE BEFORE I LOSE MY MIND.

[RJ (not THAT RJ)]

im curious to see and appreciate you taking the time to check. id be surprised if i am "right" but would also be surprised if i was far off too.

 

take out sammy getting caught from behind and penalties and we went like 40 minutes without a first down. on the bright side, a few of those did end in TDs though.

 

TDs are counted as first downs.

Edited October 27, 2014 by RJ (not THAT RJ)

[NoSaint]

 

 

TDs are counted as first downs.

 

i wasnt trying to ignore the positivity of those (why i mentioned them), just discussing that we didnt do much to string together drives.

 

 

 

Okay, first downs yesterday: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19E6nWc07RVVsTvB-ebQwu67O7l_2QSkrvC-INENlLDc/edit?usp=sharing

 

Runs: 16

Passes: 4

 

Run yards: 47

Pass Yards: 33

 

Run breakdown:

 

Negative: 1

0: 0

1: 4

2: 0

3: 2

4: 4

5: 2

6: 1

7: 1

 

so the 50-50 mark was at 3 yards, not 2.

 

and if you pull the scramble for 7, and run for 6 on the first drive it would be none over 5 yards, and 5/13 for 2 or fewer 7/13 for 3 or fewer.

 

like i said, i didnt think my gut was toooooo far off for a guy that wasnt tracking it.

 

 

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

And what I've been arguing all morning is that more important that "maximizing opportunities" was minimizing mistakes, knowing how prone the opponent was to making them. Does this not compute?

 

I just disagree. The Jets were down 1 score at halftime and had no business being in the game. If the Bills made 1 mistake the game could have been tied. You should continue to play your game and do what you do well until the game is decided. Boobie Dixon dive plays are not what the Bills do well. There was no benefit to just punting them the ball back. The irony is that by playing to not make a mistake they consistently gave the Jets the ball back. It's much easier to score on offense than on defense.

[The Big Cat]

i was saying the 1st down plays yesterday - probably after the first drive (i think we had a few good ones out of the gate).... id guess slightly over half were 2 or fewer yards, and generally speaking most of the rest were minimally above

 

Here is second down

(in a minute I'll combine the two so we know what we faced on third down. Which, the more we argue about it SHOULD be the thing we're most concerned about: converting manageable third downs. my hypothesis is THAT'S where we're weak and THAT'S what the concern should be about):

 

Passes: 5

Runs: 13

 

Pass yards: 90

Run Yards: 8 <---wow. see breakdown below

 

Negative: 4 <---ouch

0: 1

1: 2

2: 2

3: 3

4: 1

[NoSaint]

The irony is that by playing to not make a mistake they consistently gave the Jets the ball back. It's much easier to score on offense than on defense.

 

i think this is the perfect quote for why ive been discussing that we didnt actually string anything together.

 

 

[thebandit27]

I'd like to see Bryce Brown get more first down carries...he had 4 all game, and averaged 5.0 YPC on them. His other 3 carries went for a combined -5 yards.

[stevewin]

I think it's ok to be conservative and run the ball frequently at times but what is maddening is running the same GD play everytime with the samr GD result. Hackett looks like an idiot and I was embarrassed with the repetitive play calling. Fine, if you must keep running, please vary the play call. As others have stated, run some sweeps, pitchouts, reverses or anything including a QB sneak. To me, it feels like we're kneeling down on 1st and 2nd down and leaving a lot of yardage on the field and putting us in a 3rd down hole. MIX IT UP SOME HACKETT, PLEASE BEFORE I LOSE MY MIND.

This. It's one thing to be conservative, its another to just plow into the middle of the line time after time after time with the same run call. It's preposterous. Counters, sweeps, draws, off-tackle - it's an embarrassment that Hackett won't at least throw some of these in. A good run game requires some amount of variation too - not the same unimaginative, unsuccessful gd play over and over. I can't understand how anyone could defend this.

[NoSaint]

 

 

Here is second down

(in a minute I'll combine the two so we know what we faced on third down. Which, the more we argue about it SHOULD be the thing we're most concerned about: converting manageable third downs. my hypothesis is THAT'S where we're weak and THAT'S what the concern should be about):

 

Passes: 5

Runs: 13

 

Pass yards: 90

Run Yards: 8 <---wow. see breakdown below

 

Negative: 4 <---ouch

0: 1

1: 2

2: 2

3: 3

4: 1

 

the first was a tiny bit better than i expected - this was definitely an ouch though, and worse then i thought by a good chunk. generally speaking 1st seemed to keep them at least close to "on schedule" but this tends to point towards them getting off that badly on second. then you see 3rd and passing situations - which fits the narrative that we saw yesterday.

 

ps - another thanks for bringing numbers into it. its easy for me to shoot from the hip right now, but not so much to research while i multitask.

Edited October 27, 2014 by NoSaint

[Wayne Cubed]

It's not about running too much or passing too much - it's about the PREDICTABILITY AND LACK OF CREATIVITY. It was the same argument week 1 and it it's the same argument week 8.

 

It was argued in the CJ threads; it was argued in the Hackett is really bad thread; and it's argued in THIS THREAD.

 

How are the Bills predictable, as you say, if they are 50/50 on first down pass or first down run? Being 50/50 on first down play calls in my mind is the definition of being UN predictable.

 

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/play-index/play_finder.cgi?request=1&match=summary_all&year_min=2014&year_max=2014&team_id=buf&opp_id=&game_type=R&playoff_round=&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&week_num_min=0&week_num_max=99&tr_gtlt=lt&ytg_gtlt=gt&yds_to_go=&yg_gtlt=gt&yards=&is_first_down=-1&fp_gtlt=gt&fp_tm_opp=team&fp_ydline=&type=PASS&type=RUSH&is_turnover=-1&is_scoring=-1&no_play=0&game_day_of_week=&game_result=&order_by=yards&down=1

 

It's right there. 101 pass plays. 104 runs plays. They are averaging 5.42 YPC and 6.0 YPA.

[The Big Cat]

I just disagree. The Jets were down 1 score at halftime and had no business being in the game. If the Bills made 1 mistake the game could have been tied. You should continue to play your game and do what you do well until the game is decided. Boobie Dixon dive plays are not what the Bills do well. There was no benefit to just punting them the ball back. The irony is that by playing to not make a mistake they consistently gave the Jets the ball back. It's much easier to score on offense than on defense.

 

Look, I was SUPER pissed at the three and outs that surrounded the Jets last second field goal: the one that gave them the ball, and the one that we had coming out of the break.

 

But the first three and out was set up by a sack. BAD play from Orton, but not a "conservative run up the middle play not to lose call."

 

The ensuing run WAS a conservative call, but the right one with the Jets out of time outs. Then the defense gave up 21 yards. That sucked.

 

Coming out of the break Orton was sacked on first down, the ensuing run did nothing, then we got 14 when we needed 15.

 

So, yes, those 3 and outs sucked, and given the situation you brought up, they were NOT what we needed...but the playcalls COMPLETELY defy the narrative that you're trying to match them to.

 

So, you got what you wanted: two series in crunch time where we needed to move the ball, and we didn't. And not because we ran it up the middle...because WE WERE SACKED.

[st pete gogolak]

Is some of this on Marrone and the ridiculousness of Mike Williams being in Marrone's doghouse? When Woods was out of the game (most of the second half), I saw a ton of one wideout, two TE's and one fullback sets - geez, what is this? 1974? Not only that, you're going up against a good if not great Jet's front seven. Really -you'd rather have Lee Smith, Chris Gragg or Frank Summers in the game instead of Mike Williams? Really? Stupid, just stupid.

[Alaska Darin]

Is some of this on Marrone and the ridiculousness of Mike Williams being in Marrone's doghouse? When Woods was out of the game (most of the second half), I saw a ton of one wideout, two TE's and one fullback sets - geez, what is this? 1974? Not only that, you're going up against a good if not great Jet's front seven. Really -you'd rather have Lee Smith, Chris Gragg or Frank Summers in the game instead of Mike Williams? Really? Stupid, just stupid.

Not only that but the unwillingness to spread them out is maddening. Even when the BILLS run multiples, they're putting all 11 guys within 10 yards of the ball, which is exactly what the JETS want them to do. You want to run the ball against the JETS with our offense? Go at least 3 wide and spread them out.

 

Free Mike Williams!

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

Look, I was SUPER pissed at the three and outs that surrounded the Jets last second field goal: the one that gave them the ball, and the one that we had coming out of the break.

 

But the first three and out was set up by a sack. BAD play from Orton, but not a "conservative run up the middle play not to lose call."

 

The ensuing run WAS a conservative call, but the right one with the Jets out of time outs. Then the defense gave up 21 yards. That sucked.

 

Coming out of the break Orton was sacked on first down, the ensuing run did nothing, then we got 14 when we needed 15.

 

So, yes, those 3 and outs sucked, and given the situation you brought up, they were NOT what we needed...but the playcalls COMPLETELY defy the narrative that you're trying to match them to.

 

So, you got what you wanted: two series in crunch time where we needed to move the ball, and we didn't. And not because we ran it up the middle...because WE WERE SACKED.

It's chicken and the egg though. The plays called were not moving the football. Its okay to make a 1st down on 1st down. You don't need to get to 3rd down before converting.

 

The Bills had a chance to put the game away much earlier than they did. The opportunities were there and they didn't take advantage of them. You bring up 2 series in "crunch time." The whole point that I am trying to make is there should have never been a crunch time in this game.

 

Just to be clear my frustration isn't with them running the ball. My frustration is that they had a chance to put them away and didn't. At the end of the day it didn't matter because the Jets stink but against another team it could be a different story.

Edited October 27, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[FireChan]

Someone explain to me how the run game this year is Hackett's fault, when we were #2 overall last year. Someone? Anyone?

[mikef272002]

I agree he should be fired, BUT to say he ran the ball too much this game is not really fair. How much of that was Doug telling him to run if any? And if you're playing with a huge lead is there really any reason to throw? The ran a lot in the fourth quarter as they should have, that's great coaching.. I'm not saying hackett is any good based off the past 7 games because he sucks, I'm just saying they ran a lot once they had the lead and that was the right thing to do..

[Alaska Darin]

Someone explain to me how the run game this year is Hackett's fault, when we were #2 overall last year. Someone? Anyone?

Because we need a target. Everything is someone's fault.

[BigBuff423]

Someone explain to me how the run game this year is Hackett's fault, when we were #2 overall last year. Someone? Anyone?

 

Last year the BILLS attempted an insane number of runs, didn't have Watkins and EJ was the QB, with rookie WRs in Woods and Goodwin...so, while I didn't like Hackett's play-calling last year, I gave him a pass (pun intended there) to see how he did this year...EJ certainly didn't help things, but by this point in the season, he's part-in-parcel to the Running game issues. Inappropriate run game calls at inappropriate times, not always - but often...and not using Spiller to his strengths, falls on his shoulders as well...so, this year, the lack of running game has to do with design and choice of plays, which falls at Hackett's feet...last year was due to volume and rookie QB struggles, plus it was the first year of Hackett's Offense, with little to no tape, now the teams have the film, and are adjusting, he is not...JMO

[PolishDave]

Someone explain to me how the run game this year is Hackett's fault, when we were #2 overall last year. Someone? Anyone?

Buffalo was number 1 in rushing attempts which translated into more total rushing yards at the end of the season. But, they were ranked #14 in yards per attempt which is about average.

 

The rushing game last year wasn't exactly magical either.

 

This year so far they are #23 in rushing yards per attempt.

 

So they regressed from being a hair above average last year to below average this year.

 

And people aren't laying the blame for that solely on Hackett. They are blaming Hackett for the run, run pass drive killers. And the number of runs on first down in general, especially when it isn't working well.

Edited October 27, 2014 by PolishDave

[PromoTheRobot]

The Jets knew the Bills were going to run on certain plays and sometimes we did and sometimes we didn't. That's the idea. Look at the Lee Smith TD pass. Jets "knew" it was a run...until it wasn't.