K-9 Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 Was the Bennett trade worth it? This has been asked before and you should prepare for the inevitable "We already had our QB in place" responses. As if NOT making the trade ensures us of drafting a Kelly in next year's draft. Preposterous, I know. But that's the mentality. GO BILLS!!!
JohnC Posted October 24, 2014 Posted October 24, 2014 You will get no argument from me that you can find a franchise QB outside the first round. But strictly from a probability standpoint drafting the best available one with your highest selection every year is easily the most likely way to succeed in finding one. The Bills are a study in how NOT to draft. They have traditionally shunned the QB position with their highest pick....doing so only twice with that selection and doing it over 50 years apart! And that is being kind, because EJ was a tradeback pick in a weak QB draft. They have also overvalued the impact of other positions on an organization with dozens of those highest picks used on RB's and DB's. Utter stupidity organizationally. And they have traditionally drafted for need and that is a product of a play-it-by ear organization and a setup for long term disappointment. The problem with the Bills drafting problems has little to do with drafting strategy. It centers on the issue of their adroitness in evaluating talent, regardless of position. Torrell Troup was an undersized NT with a history of back problems. He was simply overdrafted. When he was on the roster it turned out that he was an undersized NT who had back problems. Shocking! Don't you think we could have come away with a good offensive lineman at that juncture? Graham was a 'track" receiver who the Bills moved up (slightly) to pick. Again, in the third round a good guard prospect could have been available instead of the "track" receiver with little football instincts? Nix acted as if he was an appealing prospect that other teams were going to jump the pack to acquire. If your scouting proficiency is mediocre it doesn't matter what position you are assessing. The results follow the same pattern. I'm much more optimistic with Whaley at the helm than with Nix. Although I believe Whaley was most responsible for the EJ selection I still believe that the scouting department is better situated with him and his own hires.
Gabe Northern Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 As many of our informed posters KNEW on draft day, as Whaley said on draft day, our 2015 pick was never going to be in the top 5, and had a very low propensity to be in the top 10. This directly contributed to the decision to make the trade for Watkins. If EJ and Jeff Tuel split the 16 starts this year, as appeared to be likely as of August 29, a top 5 pick was most definitely in play. This whole line of reasoning and the 8+ wins depends entirely on EJ playing so bad against Tampa that the front office panics and pulls the trigger on making Orton the highest paid "back up" in the league.
The Bunk Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Correct. Without Orton this team absolutely had a chance to finish with a top 10 pick. And if that would have happened the Watkins trade goes down as all time bad, don't care how good he is. Great wideouts don't make QB's, it's the other way around. Sammy got open for EJ, but EJ simply missed him or didn't even see him. This front office did the right thing by getting Orton and avoiding a 6-10 season.
Augie Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 Correct. Without Orton this team absolutely had a chance to finish with a top 10 pick. And if that would have happened the Watkins trade goes down as all time bad, don't care how good he is. Great wideouts don't make QB's, it's the other way around. Sammy got open for EJ, but EJ simply missed him or didn't even see him. This front office did the right thing by getting Orton and avoiding a 6-10 season. Well said. We will never know what would have happened. I hope for much better than 6-10 with Orton, but who knows where we might have landed without him. That's how he got the big pay day. Good for him. Hopefully it ends well for all of us!
Kemp Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 The notion that 6-10 is out of the question is wrong.
Kirby Jackson Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 The notion that 6-10 is out of the question is wrong. I'd be willing to wager...I'll take 7-9 or better and give you 2:1
BADOLBILZ Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 The problem with the Bills drafting problems has little to do with drafting strategy. It centers on the issue of their adroitness in evaluating talent, regardless of position. Torrell Troup was an undersized NT with a history of back problems. He was simply overdrafted. When he was on the roster it turned out that he was an undersized NT who had back problems. Shocking! Don't you think we could have come away with a good offensive lineman at that juncture? Graham was a 'track" receiver who the Bills moved up (slightly) to pick. Again, in the third round a good guard prospect could have been available instead of the "track" receiver with little football instincts? Nix acted as if he was an appealing prospect that other teams were going to jump the pack to acquire. If your scouting proficiency is mediocre it doesn't matter what position you are assessing. The results follow the same pattern. I'm much more optimistic with Whaley at the helm than with Nix. Although I believe Whaley was most responsible for the EJ selection I still believe that the scouting department is better situated with him and his own hires. Troup was a "play it by ear pick" as I said. At the moment they needed a 3-4 NT so they reached for him. The fact that he couldn't play was just insult to the injury. When you are a lousy team like that one you take the most organizationally impactful player available. Even if only because you don't have the foundation to support drafting role players that early in round 2 for chrissake. Yeah, it's a problem with how they draft. When you have a bad team and you are still trying to draft for need you know you are out of touch.
The Wiz Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 (edited) I blame EJ for the deal that the bills made. Had they decided to drop back in the draft and take a different player and kiko, they would have started the year thinking kolb was going to be the starter. Assuming he still fell on a mat and received a concussion, it would have been Lewis and tuel for the season. This would have no doubt solidified a top 5 pick in which the bills would not have needed to trade away next years 1st round pick and could have went with Sammy or if they did draft EJ and he was flat out awful instead of winning a few games. Edited October 25, 2014 by The Wiz
Solomon Grundy Posted October 25, 2014 Posted October 25, 2014 I'm with the OP on this one. Doug Whaley and Co. were shrewd with this move. I think they looked at the upcoming draft and figured no way would they be drafting in the top 5. I think they also evaluated one "franchise" QB in this year's draft and wasn't sure if he was coming out(Winston) Mariota and others are just as "green" as EJ and would've needed time to develop also. Sammy Watkins was/is the most dynamic player at his position since Randy Moss/Larry Fitzgerald. There won't be another player in the draft like him no time soon. With both the skill set and maturity. Sammy Watkins will be a star in the league for a long time. Not so sure about players in upcoming draft not named Jameis Winston. Forget all the hypotheticals, the Bills scored a HR with the move and the pick!
BADOLBILZ Posted October 26, 2014 Posted October 26, 2014 I'm with the OP on this one. Doug Whaley and Co. were shrewd with this move. I think they looked at the upcoming draft and figured no way would they be drafting in the top 5. I think they also evaluated one "franchise" QB in this year's draft and wasn't sure if he was coming out(Winston) Mariota and others are just as "green" as EJ and would've needed time to develop also. Sammy Watkins was/is the most dynamic player at his position since Randy Moss/Larry Fitzgerald. There won't be another player in the draft like him no time soon. With both the skill set and maturity. Sammy Watkins will be a star in the league for a long time. Not so sure about players in upcoming draft not named Jameis Winston. Forget all the hypotheticals, the Bills scored a HR with the move and the pick! The hyperbole on Watkins ability is a bit much. For instance, more dynamic than Megatron? Bills fans can sometimes be a bit out of touch about the rest of the league because it's been so long since the team mattered but there are lots of incredible receivers. Sammy is becoming one of them but he isn't a 4.3 guy and he isn't 6'5" either. His game is shaking db's on horizontal routes, gaining RAC yards and sensational hands. But don't look for him to be snagging 10 TD's over his shoulder on nine routes every season because in a straight line the average starting cb can run with him.
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